"Paul Giamatti"
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You know, Jason, have you ever ate edamame? Because I've edadadé. I've never even met your mame. Oh, see, you did the joke too. I do like, you know what I really like doing with the edamame, especially if I'm sitting across the table from my daughters, is I like to take one of those edamame beans, like to fire, like to squeeze it and fire one of those beans right at one of my daughters. That's fun, right? And of course, you know, 16-year-old gets pissed off, but the 11-year-old, she opens up her mouth real wide and goes, yeah, try, try, try, I'll catch it.

And that's fun. And then mom smacks me. And then dinner falls apart. Hey, remind me to skip sushi next time. Yeah, you should. Or just wear a helmet. Welcome to Smartless. Smart. Less. Smart. Less. Smart. Less.

What's the purple sex toy over your right shoulder? There? In the back. Keep going. The purple thing. It's just one purple thing. Right here? Even further back. Oh, this? Yeah. By the way, you know what that is? Should it be in somebody? Roller, back roller. That's the inside of like a metal, but it's a record. It's like a sound thing.

Oh, never mind. And you can also stick it up your ass. That's what we're getting at. Okay, but wait. I want to say something about Jason's food because I FaceTimed with Jay last week.

and you do eat a lot of stuff it is kind of a joke but it's not really because you do for every you know cookie that goes in it's like 20,000 pounds of nuts and bolts and twigs and sticks go in that's right so uh but but i facetimed you and you answer it you were on the treadmill and that's the other thing you constantly are on the treadmill constantly well we talked about it's not constant it's just discipline it's one hour a day no i know but it's a routine it

And then I brought up the porn thing again because I can't believe you're the only male in the world that doesn't look at porn, but we already talked about that. Have either one of you looked at any porn today?

No. No. I don't need the eyebrows, Will. You don't need to be like, what a weird question. Do you guys look at it daily or weekly or what's the frequency? Again, more eyebrows. This isn't an... What about, is it once a week?

more i don't know like the frequency of it but i'm just saying like generally well let's hear it you say you don't know let's hear it no like male guys every guy looks at point anyway yeah but the other thing was i want to talk about the headband that you're wearing while you're running on the thing seems kind of horny it was no i've never seen you in that i've seen you in that like others like hats and stuff but i've never seen you wear the headband while you're on the i still have that dumb long hair and i don't want it sweating into my eyeballs

That was astonishing. It was like Loverboy, like the 80s band or something. But it made you think of gay porn? Yeah. Yeah. No, I don't know. I just thought I'd never seen you in that headband. Jason would never look at gay porn because he'd be too worried. Yeah.

Why are my pants crowding? Yeah. Oh, no. Wait, what were you saying? What's my workout? Yeah, what's your workout get up? So, you know what? It's funny. Well, my hair is quite short right now, but if it's even a little bit longer, I have, it's the worst. If I'm, so that I don't sweat and I would never wear it outside because I'm embarrassed.

It's old school bandana rolled and then kind of up here and then my hair is kind of sticking behind. That's exactly what Jason was wearing. It's the worst, but I could never wear it. Like everybody who lives, kids, Alessandra, everybody looks at me like, dude, that is the worst. I look like such a solid. Because you don't want to get zits? Is that what it is?

Well, you just don't want the hair dripping down his face. No, I don't want the sweat in my face. You don't want to sweat because then you get zits if you sweat on your face. Well, I'm 53. You know, I'm pretty good on that. But it's more I just don't want to get the sweat in my face.

-You know what-- -I don't sweat out of my face. -You don't sweat, period. -You what? -You don't sweat out of your face? -I never sweat from my face. You know why? 'Cause it's hard to sweat while you're chewing. Boy, I'm getting on that t-shirt so quick. I wanna get to our guest 'cause I can hear him. I feel badly for him that he's had to listen to the porn and he's had to listen to the-- Sweat. I don't sweat out of my face. I don't. And he doesn't deserve it. You know why? Because this is a guy-- I use-- Do you like the term "actor's actor"?

-I do like that. -He's the kind of actor-- And the way I look at it is, he's the kind of actor that all us actors look up to. -Yeah. -You're like, "Yeah, this is the guy who knows what he's doing." -I'm getting nervous. -Well, the second you say "actor's actor," you know they're friendly. Yeah, and they're just like-- They've just done so much stuff. They've done the dramatic stuff, and they've done the comedy, and they're good at all of it. And you don't begrudge them because you're like, "They're so good at it." You're like, "Yeah, yeah, they do." And this is a guy who's got-- He's got an Academy Award nomination. He's won two Golden Globes. He's won--

He's won a Primetime Emmy. He's won four SAG Awards. He's been in every imaginable-- We were talking about one of his movies last night at dinner after you left, Jason, because one of his co-stars was there from that film from years ago. - Ooh. - He's been in-- He's single-handedly responsible for the death of the Merlot business.

He's played John Adams. He played Howard Stern's boss. Oh, I love him. Guys, it's just Mr. Paul Giamatti. I love Paul Giamatti. Did I do this right? Okay. Yes. Yes. Well done, Will. I love you.

Hello. I love you guys. I absolutely love you. Look at you. Fantastic. Look at me. Wait a minute. Talk about the background. Can you hear me? Can you see me? Is this all like okay? We can hear you. Jason, Paul, Jason's very confused right now because of all the books behind you. Look at that wallpaper behind you. It looks so textured. It's a green screen. It's a green screen. It's fantastic. Wait a minute. That's a moth trap. I see that. That's actually a moth trap.

Very effective. Works like a charm. So, listener, he's got at least 6,000 books behind him, and you've read all of them all back? No, no. A lot of them. Well, some of them. I've read some of them. Jason, name a book, quick. Uh...

Where the sidewalk ends. So no pornography, no books. It's pretty dry. It's just sugar and salt for me. Those are my vices. I want to know about the books. Why the books, Paul, behind you? I have a kind of manic thing. Honest to God, I have a kind of collecting mania with books.

I put all my manic behavior into books. I get that. And you know what? If you had asked me to describe, say, what would Paul Giamatti's background be, I probably would have said a bookshelf brimming with books. I probably, given a few guesses. Or a bunch of different glasses frames. Or a selection of Warby Parker just all back there. Paul, do you have a favorite bookstore?

In New York? Yeah, I'm assuming you're in New York. Yes, I am. I like going to the Strand bookstore. That's a classic bookstore. It holds up. There's a good one out in L.A. called Iliad Books. That's a great bookstore. Yeah, Iliad is very good. I know that one. But I was just at the Strand two weeks ago, and it's really holding up, isn't it? It is. It's still there. They still got it. Yeah, it's still there, which is nice. Wait, now who was so, so what was the film that you were referencing last night that one of our dinner guests was in?

Private Parts with Mary McCormick. Yes. Absolutely fantastic. Wow, that is a deep cut. And we were talking about, God, I love that movie, Paul. You're so great in that movie. Thanks, I appreciate it. It's a good movie. It's a really good movie. Betty Thomas directed that, right? Yeah, have you worked with her? I have not, but I would like to. Oh, she's terrific. So let me ask you about Private Parts now that we're on it. How did that movie come about? Like, were you a fan or did you listen to Howard leading up to that at all? No.

Like a little bit, you know, but not much. I wasn't any kind of big, because I didn't realize, for instance, that that guy I was playing was a real guy until about halfway into my little tenure doing the movie, which was a couple of weeks. And they said to me, how'd you nail this guy so well? And I said, this is an actual guy? And they were like, yeah. And I said, I feel terrible now because I'm making this guy look like the biggest asshole on the planet. This is a real person? His children are going to see this? His wife is going to see this?

This is horrible. And it got me a little nervous. I thought, this is terrible. Did you meet him? No. One time I had to do, in promoting something, a few years later, you know, they'd be like, I was always the guy, they'd make me do the drive time radio shit. They'd be like, well, you do the promotion on the drive time radio, guys. When did you start saying no to that? Ah,

Only a couple years ago. But it was always me they made do that because of private parts. So I was always talking to some fucking guys in Oakland or something like that. And one day they patched him through. They put him on with me. And it was just incredibly uncomfortable. But you strike me as a fella who's pretty diligent about...

researching your parts and whatnot. Are you not? Erroneous mistake. Oh, please. It depends. Sometimes I am. Sometimes it depends. But sometimes I do a lot of research and sometimes I just don't bother. And what is, if you're playing a non-fiction character, you'll do the research and maybe... It depends. Yeah, it depends.

Like I did a boxing picture. I did a boxing picture and I was interested. Cinderella Man. You were nominated for an Academy Award, which I mentioned. I was. Thank you. I wanted to learn about how to wrap guys' hands. I wanted to learn all that stuff. I learned all these old school tricks

they would hold a big cold silver dollar against the guy's bruise while he was fighting. I learned all that kind of stuff. Sean, you could have taught him because you're pretty good at wrapping guys' hands around, well, around stuff, I guess. I'll show you. I'll show you later.

- Wait, Paul, what do you mean? What do you mean, the silver dollar? What are you talking about? - It's like an ensuel, right? - Guys would get an ensuel, meaning like a-- - Right, that's like the real thing that they use to smear out a swollen eye or something. It's like a metal square that's got like a little ring. - Yes, that's right. And in the old school, 'cause that movie I did set in the '30s,

If they didn't have those things, they would just have a freezing cold silver dollar and they'd push it against the guy's face. Oh, just to take the swelling down. Yeah. Will, you got anything for end swell? What is it? End swell? Well, all's well. I think that's what it's called. All's well that ends well. I don't know. There you go.

- But Paul, but then what about my idea that you may be very, very well trained? I'm assuming you went to, are you a Juilliard guy? - He went to Yale. - A Yale guy. - I went to Yale, I went to the Yale School of Drama, yes. - That's amazing. - Now wasn't our friend Laura Linney over there?

She went to the Juilliard, I believe. Was she Yale as well, maybe? God, I should know that. No, she was Juilliard. She was Juilliard. Yeah. Hey, Jason, you remember you were in Ozark with her? Yeah, that's right. You were in the television's Ozark. Remember that? I've never been to Ozark. How was that? Did you enjoy that with her? What's that? He's completely blanked it. Yeah. I only can remember just an hour ago. No, she's about the best.

- She is the best. - So Paul, so you went to, you mentioned, so you went to Yale. You're from New Haven. You actually were born there, right? - Yes, I am. - No way. - Yes, I was. - And your dad was a professor there, ended up being the president of Yale. - That's right. - Oh my God. - Wait, what? - Did your mom teach at Yale too?

No, she taught at a private school in New Haven. Right, so your mom was a teacher. So both of his parents were academics. Do you have any Yale tattoos? You should have a Yale tattoo. I should. I should have a big... I don't. I should have a bulldog on my ass. Or a big Y right on the small of your back. I should always have a bulldog on my ass. Same. But wait a minute. What about...

Go back, though, before... In order to get into Yale, you couldn't just... It wasn't like your mom and dad were like, come on, I got you. Like, you had a, like, high school, you probably excelled, right? I did pretty good, yeah. I was pretty good academically, yeah. Did you go to high school in New Haven? No, I went to a high school... I went to a prep school. I didn't board... I went to a boarding school, but I didn't board there. So I went, you know... Willie, you went to a boarding school, didn't you? Yeah. Did you? Yeah, I did, up in Kennet, and then the...

The day students, we called them, because it was all boys, but they were called day boys. Yeah, day boys. Sean, anything? Careful. I mean, this whole episode is... You're going to get a letter, Will. This episode is my history. It's Pride Month, for Christ's sake. Is it Canadian boarding school? Is it as horrendous as the boarding schools seem to be in England? Well, no, but back then...

Do they cane you there? Do they like give you a good sound, good sound thrashing if you, you know. They didn't even bother grabbing the cane. They just went with the hand. I'm not kidding. Easy shot. Did they? I used to get smacked in the back of the head. Oh, yeah. Are you serious? You used to get hit? Really? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I got hit in the back of the head a bunch. Was this like a Catholic school? Was it like Jesuits? No, it's an old school. It's a, it's a, I went to this school that's like a very old school sort of British style boarding school at the time. It's now co-ed and it's very different and it's all changed. And so I'm,

But at the time it was very much a old English-style all-boys boarding school. And our sort of brother's school was this school in Scotland called Gordonstoun where, you know, a lot of the royal family went, et cetera, et cetera. So we had some members of those types of people came over to and went to my school as well. So the then Prince of Spain...

Felipe de Bourbon. Prince of Spain. He's now the king of Spain, went to my school, yeah. So you struggled a bunch growing up, did you, Will? Well, I didn't. I had nothing to do with that. How did you eat? I was starving all the time. That's crazy. Did you have a dad? Low man on the totem pole, yeah. Did people harass the prince of Spain? Did you know the prince of Spain? Yeah, I did. Boy, this is a terrible sentence, but he and I were on the same ski team. So...

That is crazy. And I got bussed. I got bussed to a school in downtown Los Angeles to... Yeah, okay. Yeah, and I had to walk to school with no food. Yeah. No food, no shoes. Right, Sean? Both ways, no shoes. But anyway, we're back. Let's get back to Yale and... And then the Prince of Spain. But your dad was... Your dad was...

A professor and a beginning president of Yale. So that, I think it does help because I know other people whose parents were professors at colleges. Yeah, but it only takes you so far. You must have done very well in high school. I did pretty good in high school. I was a bright kid. SAT score, I'll bet, was pretty good. And your essays and all that? I think probably they must have been. I don't remember what my essays entailed. I don't remember what they were about. What were the extracurriculars called? They must have been pleasing. My extracurricular.

That's interesting. I worked on the school newspaper. I drew cartoons. Really? Wow. On the school newspaper, yes. And what else did I do? I did some theater there. Sure. In kind of the latter end of it, I did some theater. Were your parents more interested or excited about you becoming an academic, or were they okay with you becoming an actor? I think they were okay with me becoming an actor. I think the extra, because everybody in my family going back was teaching.

-Like, it was ridiculous. - Yeah. Wow. Everybody's a fucking teacher. So I think the idea, the assumption was one of their three children was gonna be a teacher. And my brother and sister didn't do it, so I think they thought this guy will do it, and then I just didn't. I could see-- couldn't you see Paul in an Alexander Payne film playing a New Yorker cartoonist?

And I don't know what the story is yet, but I'm working on it. I'm going to call. But now wait, I might embarrass myself here, but did you not do Crumb, the Crumb movie? Am I confusing? I did a movie called American Splendor about a guy, this guy Harvey Pekar, and Crumb did the drawings for his stuff because he couldn't draw. Yes, sir. You're welcome. So you're close, Will. I'm very close. Were you able to use some of your...

Talents?

as a cartoonist whilst doing that film? - Nope, he couldn't draw, so I couldn't. - Oh, right, 'cause Khan drew for him. - Yes. No, I didn't get to do any of that. I had wanted to be a cartoonist, like an animator, was what I kind of wanted to do, but that didn't work out. - Did you know that guy was real when you were doing that movie? - I did. - Yeah, he probably did. - I did, yes, I was, yeah. No, I was confronted with the actual man, so there was no question he was real.

And it was very real. - Do you doodle still to this day? - Yeah, not as much. I wish I did. I don't draw as much as I used to. I think when I decided to be an actor, I stopped drawing and it was just a kind of different part of my life and I stopped drawing. I still do sometimes, but not that much. - Yeah, what is your go-to doodle? I think everybody's got one thing that they do know how to draw well. - Yeah, well, I do a lot of, it's faces mostly and it's kind of angry old men, mustachioed old men.

You have portraits of Jason in your house? Yes, exactly. My 11-year-old daughter is very, very good at drawing, and I was looking at some of her work the other day, and I said to her, I said, I said, honey, you know, I notice a lot of the faces that you draw, there's a lot of tears coming out of the eyes. Is everything okay? She goes...

yeah, dad. And I go, no, no, I mean, I just, you know, I'm trying to be a good dad here and I'm just saying that that's a flair for me and I just want to make, just want to check in with you. She's like, no, it's just really fun to draw. Jason, do you think that she was so shocked that you noticed anybody other than yourself? It's kind of amazing.

That I knew my way to her. Something out of your own that didn't have to do with show business. Something that wasn't stuck to the front of the television that I noticed. Yeah. Was it the Dodgers? That it wasn't Dodgers or golf related? Do you still get a chance to do theater? Do you like doing it? Do you prefer like now that you are on this...

of 800 movies and TV shows. You're like... I haven't done a play in a while. I do like it. I do prefer it. You're doing a play right now. Yeah, Sean would like for you to take over for him. I really want him to step in? He's very tired. You know, Paul actually was quite famously in a...

a play with a very good friend of ours and a friend of the podcast, uh, Billy crude up in Arcadia years ago. Oh, no way. What was it? Yeah. I did a couple of plays with Billy. I did, uh, three plays with Billy. Oh, wow. It just took $15 off me this weekend because, his Yankees took two out of three from my Dodgers. Oh, you're gambling with Billy, but I only sent him $14. I kept the dollar back for the damage that, uh,

Aaron judge did to our bullpen fence. Did you, did you see any of that footage? He ran right through the wall. Uh,

taking a scoring fly ball away from us. Aaron Judge had a very exciting weekend here in Los Angeles. Obviously, this podcast is airing later than that. But, Paul, I don't know if you're a big baseball fan. I know that baseball runs in the family. It does. I'm not a huge baseball fan, but I occasionally follow it. Things like this. Well, tell Sean, because I don't know, Sean, you know Paul's involvement with baseball, which is quite...

No, it goes without saying. And we can cut it too if you don't want to talk about it. No, no, no, no, no. After being in academia, my father ended up in professional baseball. And he ran the National Baseball League not for very long. And then he was the commissioner of baseball also not for very long. He was the commissioner of baseball. He was the commissioner of Major League Baseball for like... That's the god of baseball. Basically. Well, yeah, kind of. That's crazy. Yeah.

It is crazy. And so he didn't, he didn't, he did neither one of those things for very long. Did you, were you, did you go to a lot of games in that time? Were you, was it because it was kind of the family business in a way? Yeah, I mean, I did. I went to some playoff games. Now I can't even remember what ones I went to. I wish I did. I wish I was paying more attention. I wasn't paying that much attention. But I did go to some, yeah. And, and, and, but, but not enough. I wish I'd gone to more. That's why I asked you about extracurricular in high school, like,

I was on the swimming team. I was on the swimming team. Swimming team. Oh, okay. Swimming team. That's interesting. That's about as well. Is it interesting? It is interesting. It's like to picture you swimming in high school is kind of interesting. It is interesting. You know what I mean? I had hair. I had hair. I wore like a little Speedo. So you did have hair. I did have hair. I actually had hair.

But for swimming, you know, you would shave. You would actually shave your head and stuff like that. Of course. Yeah, they would do all that stuff. You'd probably shave your whole body. You'd shave your whole body. Right? You'd shave your whole body. Yes, sir. Did you, Paul, you just said I wasn't paying attention. And I was actually thinking about this concept recently, about this idea of as we get older, and I've been doing a lot more reflecting lately about this idea of like,

This stuff, I just, I feel like now I'm much more aware or cognizant and I want to absorb everything much more now than I did when I was a younger man. All these things that we took for granted.

these experiences that we would have. Right? Have you guys had any of that recently? Well, but even just saying what I was saying to you, I regret that. I mean, I was in college and I was kind of checked out and I was sort of like, eh, not dealing with my dad and stuff like that. And I very much regret it now because he passed away very shortly after doing all of that. So I definitely regret that. And, um,

Very much so, but I very much feel the same way that I need to be taking everything in way more than I did. And I wonder if my kid, my kid will remember shit or regret shit the same way I did, but hopefully not. How old is your kid? He's 22. He just graduated from college. Oh, wow. He's the age I was when my father died. I don't want to bring the whole show down by talking about my father's death. No, this is good. But he's the age my father was.

He's the age of my father when my father died. So it's interesting to me to think, yeah. I remember I worked with Marcus, with your brother, on a very, very shitty football movie. No, I remember that movie very well. I remember just dorking out with him about your dad and just picking his brain about it.

He's a huge baseball fan. He's like a fanatic. He's such a good dude. I really like my time with him. He is a good dude. I loved that movie. What was the movie? It was called Necessary Roughness. This football movie back in the day with Scott Bakula. Was it Goldie Hawn? Scott Bakula. Sinbad? Wasn't Sinbad the movie? Yes, Sinbad, Kathy Ireland. Kathy Ireland? Who else was in that? Yeah, there was...

It was a lot of people. Hector Elizondo. Hector Elizondo. That's right. Jay, did you take the moment during Necessary Roughness and really absorb it? Oh, I sure did absorb it. Wait, we're talking about two different things now. What were you absorbing? Well, we shot it in Dallas, Texas. There was a lot of off time, you know. They've got some nice ballet in Dallas. Absolutely. We'll be right back. All right, back to the show.

Paul, since we're kind of going through and I wanna-- There's so many movies we could-- You know, 'cause behind every movie there's a story about making it and stuff like that. I could talk to you for hours about so many things that I love you in. But is there one-- 'Cause we're kind of like going through them now. Is there one that stands out that's really, really, really meaningful to you that you will-- Speaking of holding on to things and remembering things, that really, really sticks to your soul and you have great memories of?

There's a lot of them I really remember nicely that way. And it's not necessarily the movie. It's the experience, too. Right, right. Is there one in particular? There's a movie I did called The Illusionist, which is this sort of... It's about a magician and stuff like that. I really liked making that movie. It was in Eastern Europe. It was in Prague, which was fun to be in. And I enjoyed making that movie. That wasn't Christopher Nolan, was it? No, it's... That's...

The Prestige. Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. At the same time, two magician pictures came out simultaneously. Yeah, I remember that at the same time. How did you like working in Prague? Man, that is a beautiful town. Great. I loved it. It was fantastic. What film do you think, and this would be a very hard thing for you to answer, but which film do you think

was the most helpful to you in your career? Because I feel like every single job you've done has been extremely prestigious. And really, really like... Did Will say you've been nominated only once for an Oscar? For an Oscar. Yeah, but I feel like every single...

But like 12 Years a Slave, Romeo and Juliet, Saving Mr. Banks, Downton Abbey. Well, those are all amazing. And 12 Years a Slave was an amazing movie to me. Yeah, all of those were incredible. But any one of those jobs you would think an actor would go, okay, now my career is made. Right. You know? I guess so. But I mean, I think something like Private Parts actually was the first time I ever did anything with real...

Just for my sister, Tracy, Private Parts is the Howard Stern movie about his life. Just so... Where Howard really convincingly and to great acclaim plays himself, which is very unusual. He was so good. He was really great at it. He was terrific. Paul, it does occur to me that Private Parts actually was a kind of a...

kicking off point, of course you were a working actor, but that kind of opened you up to a whole-- 'cause it was such a big commercial success. Yeah, I'd only really done theater stuff up until then. I'd done little bit parts in a lot of stuff, in a lot of TV shows and TV movies and stuff like that. So that was the first time I had anything substantial to do in a movie. Did that lead to Saving Private Ryan?

I don't remember which one of those came first. Maybe? But Saving Private Ryan was just... No, Saving Private was years after Private Parks. I don't... Was it? I don't even... This is what's weird. It's like... And this is where I feel like my mind, my brain is going. You're also a guy... I bet every single film would love to have you be a part of that film because of what... They were a year apart. I just looked it up.

Really? What it says to the community or the industry about what our film is. Like, we have Paul Giamatti in this film. I do, for sure. So don't even submit your, you know, this person or that person. I appreciate that and I like it, but I don't see it. I mean, that's very nice of you to say. I feel the same thing about you, gentlemen. I feel the same way about you. No, don't even try it. No, no, I'm not. I'm sincere and honest. I really do. You're keeping a little of your moth protector back there. That's right.

That's right. When they say I'm in a movie, they're like, oh, great, it's going straight to video. That's good. Now we know. It's going straight to video. I've been in plenty of stuff like that. That's for sure. But, Paul, you know, what's funny is

And I love-- I feel like there have been all these-- Through the decades that you've been working in film, there have been all these moments, like saving private parts, and then in the 2000s, it was Sideways, which really-- It was so-- And I joked that it killed the Merlot business single-handedly. -It did, actually. -But it kind of did, right? It did, yeah. It actually did, I think. Yeah, it seems so. How so? I've seen that movie 50 years ago.

50 times. Because of how disparagingly you guys talk about Merlot? Yeah. That it's just sort of like for the Philistines? Yeah. Oh, dude, dude, what, yeah, what, Paul, you're, even at the mention of Merlot, the look of disgust on your face. The guy goes crazy, yeah. Which, yeah, I have no idea, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I don't, I knew nothing about wine, I know nothing about wine, I don't, you know. You don't drink it? I don't drink it.

Not particularly, no. Kind of gives me a headache. What's the drink that you like? I like tequila. I like mezcal. Those are the two things that I like a lot. Paul, is it a problem?

- Go ahead, we can talk about it. - Drinking? - Yeah. - That's far and done. - Do you really, do you love it? - At this juncture, I do love it. And at this juncture, it's not a problem. I'm still in the loving, I'm still in the love phase. I'm in the honeymoon phase still with tequila and mezcal. So everything's fine. - I took a sniff out of somebody's, somebody had a beautiful glass of tequila on the rocks yesterday that I took a sniff of. I swear to God, I went into a time machine.

By the way, I watched Jason put his nose in the glass. I was knee-deep into my 20s. I was going pretty fast on a highway, and there were all kinds of things in my pockets. You had a candle on the dashboard. Candle on the dashboard. Remember that? Paul, Jason used to drive with a lit candle on his dash. Why? Because he wanted the cops to stop him so bad.

I should have put a Kojak light on my roof. You should have had the little light to just pop up on the roof. Why did you drive in a lit candle? What was the idea? Just for nighttime or was it lit all the time? Paul, it was just because I was blind to my douchiness and I was looking for Atmo.

Jason, when you smelled that tequila thing and it was like a time machine, is there like a desire to drink it? Or are you just like, ah, it was nice to smell it, but I don't have any desire? Yeah, no, not anymore because I did it. And I was thinking about it. At the time, I was thinking, let's do this thing.

until you're sick of it because you don't want to be doing this when you're in your 40s or 50s. Oh, that's interesting. At the level I was doing it. That's how you thought at the time? At the time, yeah. Really? You had that foresight to say, I get it out of the way now. Yeah, I'm a real black or white guy. Can I be honest with you? I am too, a little bit too. Whenever I make a cake, I eat so, I'm not even kidding, I eat so much of it so that I don't ever want it for a long, long time. It also makes all the cake go away so you can't have any more. That's true.

Do you gentlemen, do you drink at all now? I don't drink anymore. All three of us don't. None of you drink anymore. That's admirable. No, Sean doesn't. No. Wait a second. Sean, you don't drink? How do I not know that? Jay, because New Year's Eve two years ago. Oh.

All right, when you were playing games. Sean disappeared. Sean was doing bits. Paul, this is true. We were at our friend's house, and we kept pimping Sean out to do various bits. So he's standing up. It's true. And Sean's doing bits, and he's dancing, and he's doing all these moves, and he's doing impressions of people as we're all sitting at the table, like a monkey. But he was hilarious, and we were dying. And then all of a sudden, he wasn't around. And somebody goes, where's Sean? And he went to the hospital.

Oh my God. Yeah, you had Scotty driving you to the hospital. You have palpitations? What happened? Did you have like palpitations? I get AFib brought on by alcohol. Oh my God. And so I would just deal with it. I wouldn't know when it comes on. Like it would come on once or twice a year. Wait a second, wait a second. So you would have it regularly? Yeah. Like once or twice a year. And I could be at the grocery store. I could be at a party. I could be anywhere. I could be at church. He's got his own entrance at Cedars. He's got a special bag. So,

- Special back door. - It's in the dock. And now Jimmy Kimmel calls me Paddles because I would go so many times to the ER and they would clear, clunk, and get my heart back to right. - Yeah, and then he FaceTimed back to the party. He says, "Guys, I'm okay. "It's just on schedule here." - So you just quietly took yourself off to the hospital? - Yeah. - That's beautiful. - Yeah, his set was done. - That's very thoughtful of you. - He's been known to, Paul, he's been known to

In the middle of the night, go to the hospital and not even wake his husband, Scotty, up.

And then come home, and then he tells Scotty the next day that he was at the hospital. Because you've had these heart palpitations. Well, amongst others. Atrial fibrillation. But amongst others. He's a hypochondriac. He likes to be taken care of. That doesn't sound like hypo. That sounds like a real thing. No, no, Paul, he had his own podcast called Hypochondriactor. Okay? He's a hypochondriac. He'd love it. I understand. I think I used to be one. I'm kind of a recovering one. I'm not as bad as I used to be. Really? Yes, I used to be. How'd you get over it?

I'm not exactly sure. I think I outgrew it. Well, what is a hypochondriac? Like, officially, it's somebody who's irrationally afraid of germs? No, no, no. Or worried about their health, concerned with their health. Yeah, yeah. And a kind of constant monitoring of your health all the time. And making sort of these leaps if they have a sort of a... And I fight against... I think everybody has that in general.

to a certain degree. And I've had it before, too. Yeah, the older you get, too, right? And I had this thing recently where I had, Jay, I was telling you about, remember, I didn't play golf and I had this sort of pain. I was like, and I'm like, you know what, motherfucker? It's just gas and relax and give yourself a break. Oh, yeah, what was it? And it went away. You're joking. Oh, really? Like, in that moment, it just vanished. And I just took it easy for a couple days and I was just like, you know what? Just stop giving it so much fucking credence and stop thinking about yourself and...

Yeah, but you also said you had a three-minute fart. On the backside of that, you felt great. That is true. If I eat hummus, that happens. You have a terrible gas. The valve just gets stuck open. Just know for the longest one forever. Yeah. I would love to go with you to the Mediterranean somewhere and just get you onto a hummus diet and watch it all fall apart. Yeah.

I would be, please excuse my friend. I'm so sorry. That's amazing. The other thing I wanted to bring up was... Sure, yes, please. And going through all, and I don't want to go through all your credits, but one of the things... God, no. And I've been such a fan of yours for a long time, and I even, and I'm a fan of yours despite the fact that you're friends with Thoreau.

- Oh, that's right. - I've made a- - What's the deal with Thoreau? - Well, we don't know. - He's one of our best friends, but we love to throw as much at him as we can. So let's have your best material now. - No, that's interesting. - Throw it at us.

Beautiful Sean. No, no, I haven't seen him in ages. I haven't seen him in a long time. You're better off. Probably. I think I probably am too. He adamantly will not return my calls, my texts, nothing. Does he do this to you guys? You may have a wrong number for him. You think so? He's usually pretty good. He likes contacting connection. He loves doing text bits.

Not with me. There's just bits on the text. Not with me. Not with me. Jason gets really mad with text bits, I've noticed. Well, it's just I don't want to participate. I mean, I'm happy to observe.

but then I'm constantly feeling like, oh, God, everyone is contributing and emojing and double-click thumbs up or ha-ha. And if you don't, then you're... And if I don't, I'm a dick or... Yeah. I hope that people just assume I put my phone down. No, I know. I know that. I feel the same way. But I put my phone down, right? So that they just think I'm not saying it, right? I agree. Yeah, I agree. Pauly, any good... Oh, is it Pauly now? Yeah. Yeah. Pauly.

No, it's fantastic. I want to be a Pauly with him. No, no, I appreciate it. Give me one good theater story. Just something went horribly wrong. Oh, Jesus, that's a tough thing. Did you ever forget your lines? Paul, go ahead, Sean. No, a guy, speaking of heart attacks, a guy had, I was doing a show once, and a guy, I was in a little black box experimental theater in Seattle where I lived, where I moved out to Seattle and I started acting out there. And a guy said,

got up in the second row, I was watching him, and I was on stage doing this long monologue, 40 minute monologue. - Doing the monologue and watching the guy in the second row. - No, I had an eye on the guy because he was getting really dopey looking. And I thought, something's wrong with this guy. I mean, it's close quarters, a little shitty little experimental theater. And he got up and climbed over the guy in front of him, came up on stage, pissed and shat himself and dropped.

No way. And he'd had a heart attack. I didn't realize he'd had a heart attack until, and I was playing in the show. You thought it was just your performance? Well, people thought it was the show because in the performance I was playing a, what do you call it, the guy who puts his hands, you know, a faith healer. A healer. A healer. I was playing a healer.

And, you know, and I suck at improv-ing and things like that. It could have been a golden moment for me, but I didn't. But I sort of knelt down and they came up and got the guy off. I heard later, actually years later, I didn't even know that he'd had a heart attack, a small heart attack.

No way. That's about it, Sean. That's not a great story. That's an amazing story. That's amazing. Like one of the best ones we've ever had. And you're like, I don't know if I got anything. I had a guy have a heart attack. Shitting and pissing himself was the relief. Now, is that common, by the way, when you have a heart attack to empty? I think he was also kind of having it. Yes, that's true. Is it? Do you evacuate fully? Or is it just frontal? When you have a cardiac event? I've never heard about pooing when you have a heart attack.

I think maybe it can happen. Well, yeah, you might lose your faculties or whatever. Yeah.

That's a whole different thing, though. I think he did, yes. Well, he was on stage with you. Did he die? He was on stage with me for a while, yeah. That's crazy. I don't know if there's anybody who enjoys pooping or talking about it more than Bateman. Bateman says to me today, he texts me, he goes, hey, can you play golf on Thursday? I said, no, I can't because I'm getting a colonoscopy on Friday. So Thursday is my prep day.

And I said, let me know. I'm going to be at home in that prep phase. I go, let me know if you want to come by and observe. And he wrote, very kind, what's the latest to let you know? LAUGHTER LAUGHTER

I'm just not sure if my Thursday's going to fill up, you know? You finally had one? I'm having it this week. I'm on Friday. Oh, you are? It's actually fantastic. Listen, I can tell you, I enjoy the hell out of it. Yeah. I enjoy it. That little Twilight thing they send you off into, and you wake up real chatty, too.

I had a bunch of jokes for the doctor. And then the rest of the day, are you exhausted the rest of the day? No, you're good to go. I do feel fresh. I felt very fresh. Paul, I've said this on this podcast a couple times now. You will need a shower, Will. But when I got my colonoscopy and my bare ass was hanging out, right when they put the anesthesia in my arm, they said, count back to 10. I go, 10, 9. Oh, I feel it. Right when I passed out, I go, whatever you do, don't touch my asshole. And then I passed out.

And you got that out. That all got out. And I heard laughing as I went out. Beautiful. Well, it reminds me of one of my favorite jokes, right? Guy walks into a... He's going to ruin it. I know that. I think I know this joke. No, please, please, please. I like this joke too. I think I know what it is. The guy leans over the table and he drops his pants and he's ready for his exam and the doctor comes in and the doctor says...

Okie doke, Jerry, this time no hard-on. And the patient turns around and he says, my name's Andrew. And doctor says, I'm Jerry. No, that's not even close, Jason. It's not? That was so bad. That actually confused me. It was confusing. Paul, Paul. How do I always mess this up? No, I'm confused now. It wasn't the joke I thought it was going to be, and I'm confused now. Paul, you should know we both got quiet because we wanted to let him hang himself.

because he has tried to tell this joke 30 times. It's my favorite joke. And it's so embarrassing. On this show? Oh, on the show, on the golf course, at dinner. And he does it all the time. How did I mess that up? One time he taught it. He went like this. One time he said, he goes, and the guy comes in and he says, don't get a heart on Kevin. And Kevin says, my name's not Kevin. And I go, Kevin says my name's not Kevin?

Wait, but I think I was conscious of that this time, and I think I said it right. No, I don't think you did. The guy's on the table. Somebody was really puzzling about that. The doctor walks in. The doctor walks in. What happened? The doctor walks in, and he says... And the guy says, okay, Jerry, don't get a heart on this time. And the patient goes...

my name's not Jerry. And the doctor goes, no, my name is Jerry. Very good. I just punched it up. I said, I'm Jerry. You throw an extra name in there and it confuses it. I have to say, I'm Jerry's good. I like just I'm Jerry. That's funny. By the way, leave it to me. You made it longer and more complicated. And unfunny. So I'm Jerry's good.

Jerry's funny. That's a funny joke. I have to say it's a very funny joke. If you give it time. Don't get hard on Jerry. And Andrew, who's actually related, who grew up with Jerry's cousin, they're from the same town, says, listen, this is why we need our writers. This is why we need our writers. It's true. You really feel the lack of writing, don't you? We do need our writers. We do love our writers. Jason, who told you that joke?

You? Sean. Sean told you the joke. So speaking of our writers, one of the things I love... So this is what I was getting at before. And again, it goes without saying how much I enjoy watching you perform. I appreciate it. I'm a legit fan. But in the last couple of years, the thing that I've really loved watching you in is Billions. And I think that that is a performance that is so...

just deserves so much more acclaim. And there's a specific... And for people who haven't watched it, it's really great. And it's Paul and it's Damian Lewis and amongst a million other really great performers. I need to. I want to. I've heard nothing but great things about him. So great. And I love me some Damian Lewis, too. I think he's just outstanding. Yeah, he's great. But you, Paul, have this moment in the end of one of the seasons where...

You're left on the bed. I don't want to ruin it. I mean, it's a few years old, but you're left on the bed and you are crying because it seems like your world has imploded. And as the camera comes around, it reveals that you're laughing. And it was one of the great, I thought it was such an incredible device. It was a device, if you will. Smart episode, yeah. But it was a fucking brilliant episode.

I didn't even see it. Oh, thanks. It was such a small target for you to hit. Yeah, because an actor would read that in the script and then you'd have to think, okay, well, how could I laugh that could believably sound like crying? It was tricky. Unfortunately, some of it was on my back. That's actually what made some of it easier was it was on my back. So it was like I could do sort of like making it look like I was hunched over laughing or something.

But I think actually part of it is too, when I start laughing, I start crying actually. So it actually, it wasn't, you know, because if I, and I can get, I have, I'm able, making yourself laugh is tricky actually. It can be. But I feel like it's like faking a sneeze or something like that. Like it's hard to fake a, make an authentic sounding sneeze. Oh, it is hard to do it. Are you a good crier? Can you cry on cue? I'm,

Sometimes I'm not necessarily, I'm not one of those people that can do it on cue and I'm not one of those people that's like, which eye do you want kind of thing. - Laura Linney knows how to do that. - Laura Linney can, oh my God. - My mom could nail that in a second. - Oh, hey, Paul. - But wait a minute, 'cause she only had one eye, Paul. - Oh. - But wait a minute. - Did she have tears out of the fake eye?

No, she had a fake eye. She couldn't afford that one. That one came with a pump that she couldn't... It was a hole in her head. It was a hole in her head. I'm sorry. Did she lose the eye in some way? Yeah, she was two. When she was two years old, she had cancer. Tracy found it and brought it to the show. We actually had... We've all three of us have held her eye. We did it on stage in Wisconsin. Her actual eye had formaldehyde or her glass eye? Her glass eye, yeah. Wow, that's amazing. Paul, is there like a...

Are you somebody who seeks out, like, develop things for themselves? Are you just an actor who's just like, you know what, my agents just call me when there's something that you feel is right. Otherwise, I'm not going to go find a writer, put this thing together, right? It was more that kind of thing for a long time. I made some, like...

not unsuccessful attempts to produce some stuff, not even necessarily stuff for me to be in. And I managed to make some movies and I did a television show that I then appeared in called Lodge 49 that nobody watched and it's a nice show. - Oh yeah, tell me about that show. - It's a really good show. It's a really good show. And yeah, it was on for two seasons on AMC and nobody watched it, but it was a good show.

And just because the writer, I met the guy and I read the thing and thought, wow, somebody should help this guy make this thing because it's really great. But I haven't, only lately now, and as I finished Billions, I've actually been doing a podcast.

because for the past couple of months. Which I was going to get to, yeah. Oh, great. And that was something that I did develop with a guy that I know who is a philosopher and there's animation in it and stuff like that. That's kind of the first thing that I feel like I really did on my own. Oh, that's cool. And that podcast is Chinwagging, is that right? It's called Chinwag, yeah. Chinwag, Chinwag. What does that mean?

What is a chinwag? It's like a... I think it's a British term for, like, just shooting the shit. Oh, I never heard that. Yeah. Wagging your chin. But you... And it's a comedy podcast, but you get into all sorts of different areas. You talk about...

UFOs and ghosts and Bigfoot and shit like that. I'm in. Yeah, because I like stuff like that. I do too. And I was like, you know what? I'm tired of not talking about Bigfoot and doing shit about UFOs and ghosts. Yeah, yeah. I really was. I really am. Really? Do you watch Ancient Aliens? I do watch Ancient Aliens sometimes. I love it. I love it. I love that show. I love it. What about How the Universe Works?

No, I haven't seen that. What's Ancient Aliens? Yeah, what is Ancient Aliens? On History Channel. It's on History Channel? Yeah. It's all about conspiracy theories about why civilizations just died out. Like the Mayans or the Egyptians. It's like all this stuff happens and then it's just done. Chariots of the Gods. It's all about UFOs visited Earth back in the day and they built the pyramids and all this kind of stuff. And we have legitimate people sort of espousing on these theories? Yeah. Fairly legitimate.

Fairly legitimate in their field. They're legitimate in their field. Is that a degree you can get fairly legitimate? Yes. History channel level. Shatner actually was on, was Shatner on Ancient Aliens? Okay, I'm in. Yes, he was. He was. And we actually talked, I talked to Shatner. He was the captain of a spaceship, so yeah, he's quite legitimate. Yeah, yeah. And we will be right back. And now, back to the show.

Paul, do you-- So what have you gleaned from these episodes about, say, for instance, UFOs? -Are they-- What's your feeling about it? -Or Nessie. What's going on with Nessie? Well, I'm a believer. I've never seen anything like this, but I'm a believer. And stuff is super weird now. I mean, all the weirdness now of the government saying they exist and then saying they don't exist. They just opened up a new division. They just did, yeah. They did, but I'm confused. It's like, on the one hand, a bunch of guys say they're real, and then they walk that back for you.

very quickly and it's really confusing. And NASA just, is it in NASA that they just opened up a new thing? I don't know. Jason's right. I read that too, that there's some part of the government is opening a new... They're doing... And if it had any teeth to it, if they were really curious about it, I would think they would not tell us. They would let us know when they were done. You would think. Much like the intelligence community. It's odd, though. But don't you...

We had Neil deGrasse Tyson on our show ages ago, right? One of the first episodes we did, and he made the point that if these things, these supernatural or extraterrestrial visits or all these things were actually occurring, we live in a time...

where people take something like a billion photographs a day and videos pointed in every direction, and yet there's no evidence. Because they don't want to be found. There's lots of videos that they can't discover. Well, the Navy videos are pretty remarkable. Yeah, but don't you think we live in a world now, too, that if there was actual proof... You could hide it. Well, no, I think we live in a culture now where people would be like...

Yeah, that's kind of cool. Anyway, what are you guys doing? They could give a shit. Well, actually, just bury it. It would just get buried in the avalanche of shit that's out there all the time. We just end up as just like a really non-consequential like TikTok. Like, I went with my family this weekend and we saw a UFO. Yeah. You know, in that mechanical voice. I love when I stumped that smart scientist to grass Tyson on my whole mirror thing.

How'd you do that? Oh, you should go back and listen. It's a real great listen. Yeah. Did you tell him the hard-on joke and see if he understood it? I have not yet heard that joke. Here you go, scientist. See if you can figure this one out.

Who's named Kevin and who's Andrew, smart man? Jason was trying to figure out... What is your stumping with? He was trying to figure out about figuring out if you could... Time travel. Time travel and if you put a mirror far enough away, could you see...

It was about the speed of light. The speed of light, and would you be able to see it? But the question was so long and involved, you could see Neil deGrasse Tyson, who really is a big brain guy, figures out a lot of stuff. He's glazing. Glazing and really becoming quite confounded. And then you could see him because he was getting angry that he was having to spend so much time with a dumb duck. And at which point I said, Neil, do you think that they could build a telescope big enough that you could go back in time through mirrors to see the beginning of Jason's question? LAUGHTER

Nice. That he liked. We earned him back on that one. We earned him back. Very good. I'm so into that, Paul. So Billions is... Yeah, take a listen to it. Billions is over. I like it.

Yeah. Yes, it is. Now it's ending. Yeah. Because you guys kind of, you stuttered, stopped, you stopped, and then you guys did another season. Is that kind of how it went? Well, the COVID thing, you know, shut everything down. And so we had in the middle of the fifth season, then we finished that half in the sixth, and then we just did the seventh. And now it's done. Wow. Good for you. Was that a great, good, positive experience working in New York? Yeah.

Oh, yeah. It was great. I mean, I was 15 minutes from my house here in Brooklyn, which was great. And, you know, it was nice. I could be around my kid. He was a teenager. And all of that was great. And the people were great. There was no assholes anywhere on it. It was great. Good for you. That's great. You know what I always say? If you look around, you can't find the asshole on a set. It's probably you. Yeah. You do say that. You do say that a lot. You do say that. Once a day.

I'm looking for it. This reminded me of my colonoscopy. It was all about my asshole. Yeah. You know? Great. Way to bring it all back, guys. We have a classic guest with us today. Paul, what are you doing when you're not acting? What are you doing, like, to fill the time? God, it sounds like you're just reading that. No, I'm just running out because... More robotic. Paul, what do you do when you're not acting? Great question for an interviewer.

It's a little eerie. No, because I want to know because I know you're doing the podcast, but like what else? I do the podcast now and I read a lot. I don't know. It's a little bit like I'm kind of, I don't have a job now and I am a little anxious about it because I am a little bit, I think, of a workaholic actually. Like what will you do for the summer? Okay, again, I

I have to do this podcast. It's for one thing. So you're going to do the podcast. Yeah, and then I don't know. This is just terrible. I get all flummoxed. You walk across the Brooklyn Bridge. This is what I imagine your day is. You walk across the Brooklyn Bridge. You go get coffee. You go to the Strand. You might meet somebody for lunch. Okay. You walk back. You'll take a nap. You'll go for dinner. Maybe you'll go to Williamsburg. Like, I...

That's actually pretty accurate. That's terrifyingly accurate. That's actually pretty close. The thing that is very nice of what you do is that you work all the time so that we get to watch you. I love that I can count on you being in something once a year at least. That's been the case. I hate these great high-quality actors that are so goddamn...

I only want to work, you know, once every five years. Well, but they're picky. That's not a bad thing. You're very picky, though, too. It's just I feel like you... I think there's been more things that you haven't treated yourself to watching that I've done that are not of the highest quality. There's plenty out there. Paul, I know...

I appreciate that, but I'm not, I should have been pickier. No, you're being very modest. And I will say, and I think what Jason is getting at is that you are, if I look at a film or a show that's coming out and I see Paul G, your name, I'm like, all right, this thing has a certain. I'm in good hands. Well, I appreciate that. Yeah, it's true. Now, saying that,

Here are the list of things that you've done that I have not liked. Oh, right. Yeah. Because we like to end the show. That's awesome. Oh, I love that. I'm going to have to go alphabetical because the list is long. Excellent. No, but Paul, but I was going to say, you've done so many things. We often ask people here, we're like, oh, what have you done like this?

You've done a lot of this. You've done a lot of that. What would you like to do? I mean, you've kind of done comedy. You've done drama. You've done period. You've explored a lot of areas as an actor. Is there one zone that you like that you feel really comfortable in that excites you still? Well, I'd like to do more theater. That would be nice. I would like to do...

goofier comedic stuff, which I used to do a long time ago and I haven't really gotten to do something like that in a long time. I'm not comfortable necessarily doing that at all. But goofy, I'll bet not winking though, right? I'll bet like authentic sort of like Coen Brothers type of eccentric characters that are very funny but they don't know they're funny. Yes, that would be nice. Something like that. What if he wants to wink, man?

No. What's with you and the non-winking? And winking would be like, what do you mean? Super broad and sophomoric. You're overqualified for that. You think so? I don't know. Super broad and sophomoric. Do you guys still love to perform? Yeah.

on film and TV? Do you still love it? Do you still feel like it gives you the thing it always gave you? Do you feel... That's a good question. I was going to ask you the same thing. It's a good question. I'm curious. It's like... I just love a set. I just think it's... I'm so comfortable on a set. I love how many people it takes to make something...

I know, but I didn't know then how complicated it is to make fake life and how many people you need to actually get it done. So you love it? Yeah, I love it. Love it, love it. And you love the process of it and all that. More than the product.

Uh-huh. I get that. You know, to answer your question for me, I think at this age, it really now finally for the first time in my life, it really, really matters what it is. Because if I'm going to spend all that time, energy, resources, all of it, I'm going to give 110%. I agree. And if it works right, if it doesn't work right, that's fine. But as long as I believe in it, I think that's my answer. I feel the same way. I feel like, yeah, and life and kids and also just sort of...

Feeling content on a day-to-day basis is... I put such a premium on that. And being happy, I put such a premium rather than on work. And...

The last couple of years, I have not really done anything. I have not said yes to anything in a long time until this year. And that feels good. That felt good. It feels really good. And there were things I maybe should have done, but I was just like, ah, it just didn't feel... But you don't regret it? No.

No, and luckily was doing other stuff so I could continue to make a living and could afford to say no, but I just wasn't feeling it. I mean, you know, and Jay, I know that you feel, because you're doing so much more directing and you've had the opportunity again, I don't want to speak for you, but it's as an observer that you do a lot of like, I don't want to do...

You just want to do the stuff that excites you. Yeah. Yeah, I want to be-- I really like being challenged because I know there's going to-- I've had enough periods in my life where I'm not confident or I'm not feeling up to a challenge, and I know those times will occur again. So while I'm feeling eager to take off possibly more than I can handle, I want to take advantage of those moments. -That's great. -Yeah. For sure. Because I know I'm going to be a coward later again.

Paul, what about you? The same question to you. Yeah, no, I think I feel a lot of the same things that you guys were just saying. But I feel like I'm a little bit in the place that you are, Will, where it's like, I think I just want to

I didn't you and all of you guys I just want to do the thing that is really gonna matter because it's otherwise I don't have the energy I'm old I'm getting old man right and it's like it's like so I have to just it's got to be something I really really want to do but it's been interesting doing other things too it's like I'd like to I would like to draw again I would like to

try to write. I don't know if I can fucking write. I read all the fucking time, but I don't know if I can write something. You should. I'd like to try different things. So I think I need to say no more, and I think I need to just do the things I want to do for sure. Well, how about this? When you're done with your walk across the bridge to get the coffee and the dinner, like Will said, you just...

write a couple pages. I would try. You know what you should do? You should get over there to the Belasco Theater and see Shawnee and Goodnight Oscar. I would like to see you. I would very much like to see that. We're going to get you some house seats, Paul. I would very much like to see that. I would love to see that. Here's what's going to happen. I'm headed east at the end of this week, and I'm going to come to the city. We're going to go and have dinner, or we're going to have lunch. I would love that. Downtown, and then we're going to talk about what you're going to write.

I would love it. For 3%, Will? You're offering his agenting for 3%? No, I'm just going to help him. It's going to be his idea. He knows how to write. I would welcome that. That would help me. It would help me. I need help. Have a conversation to get ideas going for himself. He doesn't need my help. You're just offering your muse. Muse for hire. Paul, why don't you call it Mothcatcher? I love it.

I like it. I like it too. Mothcatcher, fantastic. That's a start. That's a great start. Mothprotector. Isn't that what they call it? Mothprotector. Mothtrap. Mothtrap. Mothtrap. Mothtrap. Mothtrap. That's a good one. That's a good title. Is that a mousetrap? That's a techno thriller. What was the last book that you read that you were excited about that you really liked? Do you remember? I read a lot of crappy mysteries. Do you? That's cool. I read a lot of crappy thrillers and crappy mysteries and spy novels.

Oh, I love spy novels. I read a lot of spy novels. I do too. I read a lot of stuff like that. That's the funny thing. I don't read much highbrow stuff, actually. I read a lot of spy novels. Yeah, I enjoy that stuff a lot. I really like stuff like that. Do you ever read any of those Len Dayton books? Yeah, that's what I just read, actually. Are you kidding? I was going to say, what I just read was a fucking Len Dayton book. That's uncanny. It is uncanny. What you just did there. So the Bernie Gunther series, right? Yeah. So I read all nine of those. Yeah. Yeah.

Those are fantastic. Yeah, those are great. I just, we are. Are these guys going to have a good lunch? We are. I just read up the Lend-Aid stuff. You would be a great fucking Bernie Gunter. I would, that's amazing. I can see these two fucking clowns sitting on the Brooklyn Bridge, each with a book, sitting on a bench. Not even talking to each other. No, no. Like some great old couple. So if you love those Lend-Aid, I've got another series for you. I'll bring him a book. That would be fun. That would be lovely. That would be lovely.

Oh, my God. I'm going to. Please. By the way. Please. Paul, now what are we looking at just before we let you go? What are we looking at for the summer? If everything is kind of shut down, are you going to...

Are you going to hit the beach? Are you going to get in the water? Are you going to, what are you going to do? I'd like to, yeah. I know you're on the swim team. Yeah, I was on the swim team. I'd like to, I'd like to get back in the water. Maybe I'll go up to Cape Cod or something like that. I don't have a home up there, but I would go up there, a main or something like that.

Maybe somewhere like that. That would be nice. Well, let me just say this. There are a lot of people, a lot of really bougie people who listen to our show. Give me your email address right now. And if you've got a real nice place, if you've got a nice spread up there in the Cape or one of the islands, Vineyard or Nantucket, and you'd like to have Paul Giamatti as your house guest for a few days, he's on our Instagram. Yeah, let us know on our Instagram.

Terrific. Somebody could host. Let us know. And he's going to spend a lot of, during the day, don't bother him. He's reading Lynn Dayton books and he's going to be at the pool. But then for dinner time. Don't approach him if he's in the middle of a chapter. Give him a nice glass of mezcal. He's not going to drink your wine, but give him a nice glass of mezcal. And then he'll discuss whatever you want. Awesome.

Paul, you're welcome. Is that good? We've set up your summer for you. That's fantastic. Thank you. By the way, all jokes aside, you're going to find yourself on a fucking yacht in the Mediterranean because of this. This is going to be incredible. Oh, shit. That would be great. That's the demographic? That's the audience? It's all yacht-o-air. That's the first thing right now? It's all yacht-o-air. It's a real yacht-y crowd. Fantastic.

Paul, it is so nice to see you again. And to echo what Will said, I'm here in the city for quite a while, so maybe we could grab a bite or something. Nothing would make me happier than to have lunch with you guys. I'm going to get your contact info from our guys if that's okay, Paul. I'm going to reach out. Absolutely. It would be a pleasure. And Jason, when I'm out there sometime... Yeah, you guys FaceTime me from your lunch. Sure. Jason, we love you. We love you. But Paul can't wait. We love you, Jason. But Paul can't wait. It's going to be amazing.

Likewise. Thank you, Paul Giamatti. Such a pleasure to meet you, my friend. Yeah, real pleasure to meet you guys. Thanks for doing this. Thank you very much. Thanks a lot. My pleasure. See you down the road. Bye, pal. Bye.

Well, Will, it was worth the wait. Right? Do you know him, Will? No. I feel like I met him briefly. I knew that he was friends with Thoreau. They're old friends. And like I said, I've always just been such an admirer of his. Yeah, the credits are just endless. And that's what I meant, right? He's an actor's actor. Like we all as actors, we're like...

You know, if you were doing something and they go, "Oh, yeah, by the way, Giamatti's gonna do it," you'd be like, "Oh, man, this thing is really--" -And never really have-- -This is a real blue-chip event we got going here. Totally. And I met him once at the Golden Globes years and years and years ago.

But I didn't chat with him until right now. And talking to him at length now, you feel like he's one of those people like, oh, I feel like I've known him forever. Yeah. And he's the guy you'd give any part to. Yeah. Yeah, he really does have that just, there's something about him when he inhabits a character. You're just with him.

Yeah. And he brings so much sort of pathos to every character. I even enjoy watching his Verizon commercials when he's playing Einstein. I know. I can't believe we didn't bring it up. I was going to. I was going to. Shit, I totally forgot. When he plays Santa Claus, right? Because his service was kaput. No, he's playing Einstein, you stupid fuck. Oh, Einstein. I thought it was Santa Claus. And his service was kaput. God, I wish we would have brought it up and you would have said, so when you play Santa in the Verizon commercial, you stupid fuck.

You stupid dick. You stupid fuck. Listen, you know what, though? I didn't know he was in Brooklyn. He lives so close to the Belasco. Bye. Dot com. Smart. Smart. Smartless is 100% organic and artisanally handcrafted by Bennett Barbico, Michael Grant Terry, and Rob Armjarff.

Smart Less. This episode was recorded on June 5th. If you like Smart Less, you can listen early and add free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.