"Simon Le Bon"
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Do you know that often, often, when I'm driving on Sunday night to our Sunday night dinner that we all do together with our fans and stuff. You'll rock out to Duran Duran? I'll rock out to Hungry Like the Wolf. You have to film that next time. As I'm driving through the hills. It makes me feel good. That's why you always walk in with a glow stick between your teeth.

That's why I'm always wearing like pastels under a blazer with shoulder pads. Your tonser ton jacket. Yeah. That's why you walk in with two hookers on either side of you. By the way, speaking of walk, I am... My hamstring... I'm having major hamstring issues. Yeah, when did this start and why? I don't know. I think it's... I hate to say...

I think it's golf-related. It's a golf injury. That's up to you with a sleeping injury. Well, Jason, you had your back golf injury last week. Right, but I usually hurt my back doing things like tying my shoes or toweling off after a shower. We've come to that year. Toweling somebody off after a shower? Or just myself. Oh, okay. Okay.

I don't know. Because I'm a little wet right now, if you want to just dry me up. Wait, Jake, how long do you have? Wait a second. We're going to clip that for sure. I'm a little wet right now. Well, I meant from the shower, from the shower, water. So, Jason, how long do you have to stop playing golf for your back to get better?

It's been a week, and today I'm going to break the mold. It's been a week back. It's raining. No, it stopped. Take a look. I have a window in my room. No, it's going to be a shit day. You're going to have a terrible day, and you're going to re-break your back is my prediction. Ah.

I'm doing prediction. But... How are your hamstrings, Angel? The hamstrings suck. How do you hurt your hamstrings playing golf? You know what? It's been a nagging thing that's been kind of... I've had it sort of strained a few times over the last two years. Is it a disc thing in your back that goes down your...

I don't think so. I think it's an actual just hamstring thing. And I think that probably a non-properly stretching thing. And I do a lot of, I do that hill. If we were smart, if we were smart, the three of us being of a certain age, north of 50, we would do the thing that we hate, which is yoga. If we did yoga, we would have such a more pleasant aging process, I think. I know.

I used to-- One of the best-- -But it's the same as Pilates. -I did yoga a little bit, but Pilates-- I did Pilates about 10 years ago for about six months. In addition to the regular sort of working out, I did that. I was stacking. Before stacking was a thing, I was stacking. And it was great. I felt so much better doing that. I know, but it takes a lot of discipline to-- And also, like, I can't stand sweating because I'm stretching.

It's like being stuck in a hot car with windows that won't come down and a door lock that is broken. It's like, if I'm sweating, I want to be doing something active. I feel the same way. Except not when you're in the sauna, you're sweating and you're not active. That's true. That's the sort of a contradiction that for some reason I'm okay with. But like if you're moving furniture or doing like a strenuous activity, something you're sweating, I get really irritable fast. Yes, yes.

I always feel like, and this is going to be controversial, but oftentimes it reminds me of when I'm in England and it's cool out and I feel like everywhere inside is very stuffy and hot. I always feel like I'm wearing a jacket and then I'm inside and it's stuffy inside. How about in Europe? Yeah.

Look at Jason's face. Every time you're in England, what the fuck? Do you work for the government? What are you talking about? What are you in England? I spent a lot of time in England. How about when you're in England or Europe or whatever and you ask for a Coca-Cola, they don't give you ice. Right. I don't know how they... They've never experimented with how things taste better with ice. Things. Carbonated beverages. It's true. I used to put ice in my beer. You've never...

I mean, like, it's indisputable that a room temperature Coca-Cola tastes world's worse. I was at a restaurant once, and it was in Italy, and it was quite warm out, and I said, can I get a Coke? And the guy brought me a warm Coke, and I looked at him, and I said, do you want me to barf? I mean, hey, guy. I know.

I don't understand it. But anyway, I don't know. Anyway, it's a long way from there from my hamstring, but I do have it wrapped right now. Did you go to the doctor? No, doctor. You wrapped it yourself. Yeah. Well, yeah, I wrapped it myself. He wraps. I didn't have some. I want to wrap right now. My name is Will. My name is Will with a W before the XYZ and after the T in you.

-You know? -What? Oh, wait. No, no, hang on a sec, Sean. I think what we've just stumbled on here is a rap that Will has always had since he was a kid. And there's probably music that goes with it. -Oh, my God. -Now, would you like us to do the beat? My name is Will, with a W, before the X, Y, Z, after the T and U. You hear my deaf rhyme. It's coming prime time.

No. How many times have the boys heard that on the way to school? What do you mean write it? I just said it. He grabs the microphone too like he's shaking a hand. But you put effort into that. No, I didn't. No, no, no. I think I wrote... I said it out loud once in the car and then I just said it to myself. It's like a dumbest...

You know, freestyle all the time. Well, at some point, Sean, we're going to get into your pop career. Somebody's got to. Somebody's definitely got to, but I'm too hamstrung to do it. I tell you who's not hamstrung. I tell you who's not hamstrung. This is a segue. This is a really good segue. I feel like my segues are getting worse. I was going to say better, but now that I think about it, it seems like they're worse. Mm-hmm.

You know, our... I'm not hamstrung by the talent of our guest, and neither is he. Oh. This person is kind of known for his voice. Oh. In a way...

And he's been known for his voice for so long in so many iconic ways. This is one of my bucket list guests. Paul Rubens. Who I have not stopped talking about and quoting and singing and listening to and talked for years and years and years. I've bored you guys with it. And I've just always wanted to know. They played, he has played such a huge part in

my musical experience throughout my life in so many different ways and different incarnations. Bon Iver.

Again, one of our guests who, once I start to list things off, you're just going to immediately know who it is, even though you guys already... He has done it all. He's an Englishman who, along with his buddies Nick Rhodes and John Taylor, decided to create a little band called Duran Duran. It's Simon Le Bon. Simon Le Bon! Will, how do you do it, Will? Oh, my gosh. Simon Le Bon!

Oh, that's so cool. How are you, fellas? Nice to meet you. Now, wait, Simon, how do you know Will Arnett? He doesn't. Will, how do you know Simon? I mean, I know you're a fan of Simon. That's a great question. It's completely irrelevant because we don't know each other. That's right.

I just got a call from the production company offering me a huge obscene amount of money to do your podcast. $600,000. If they pay me that much, how can they possibly make a tweet? It's out of my own pocket. I went out of my own pocket for this. Simon, I've been trying to get you on the podcast since we started. We've had to cut out clips of your music just because of publishing and royalties reasons.

I would constantly come on to the show playing Duran Duran. I'm such a massive fan. We all are massive fans. It's such an honor to have you. I've seen you in concert like two or three times and it just blows me away every time. So, Simon Le Bon. We're coming back. You know, we're back on tour in America this year. Right, well, don't push it. I'm not trying to flog it to you. I'm coming. I'll come. Are you playing at the Tabasco Theater? No.

Are we? No, that's where Sean is. Do you mean I've got to look at my itinerary? No, no, no. Sean is playing at the Belasco Theatre. His new play, Goodnight Oscar, opens in April at the Belasco Theatre on Broadway. Oh, the Belasco, not the Tabasco. On Broadway. Jason was just being cheeky, as you might say. We have played at the Belasco. Have you? And New York? And it's next door to the Mayan, isn't it?

I've never been there. I leave in a week. I think it's next door. We've played at both the Belasco and the Mayan Theatre, so downtown LA. Or is it downtown? No, this is in New York.

Oh, we played at the other Belasco. Right, yeah. The Annex. The Belasco 2. The Belasco 2. You've played everywhere. First of all, you have a new record and you guys are going on tour. Last year you did some dates at, did you do four shows at the Hollywood Bowl? Am I right about that? We did three. Three. Three amazing shows. The first one, it was absolutely pissing with rain. Really? Oh, really? But rain shows are always special ones.

But in Los Angeles, rain falls like chemicals from the sky for people in Los Angeles. Everybody scurries. Is that why everybody runs around with their tongues sticking out? It's just...

People just don't know what to do with it. I always say that rain in LA is a chance for all the people on the west side to get out their fancy all-weather clothing. Get to accessorize. It starts to drizzle and people have their great boots and their fucking hooded coats.

And the safari vehicle. And the snow tires. Just to make it to Trader Joe's. And the safari vehicle with the snow tires on, the chains coming out. And a rhubarb on the front. So, Simon, and we're going to get into how you guys became what you became and who you became in terms of, you know, musically and what an influence you are. But I kind of want to get back to the start because I know so little about it. I want to know...

This is so thrilling. It's such an unbelievable thrill. You started as an actor. You went to drama school, is that right? I started as an acting student. As a student actor. I mean, I had a few roles. I did a few things. I was more of an advert kid. I did personal adverts. That's like washing powder. I did a few commercials.

And I did a run at a theatre in the West End when I was a teenager. But I was an aspirant actor.

And I went to university and I studied acting. That's so crazy. I never knew that. And at the same time, I met a bunch of guys called Duran Duran who were looking for, wait for it, a lead singer. And I had had my own punk band. Well, me and my three mates, we'd had a punk band back in Pinner, the little suburban town that I grew up in. Yeah.

And I fitted right into Duran Duran. How did you know you could sing? Did you audition for it? Well, because I was always a singer. Oh, you were always a singer too? Yeah, I was singing from the cradle. I sang in church choir. I used to do singing competitions. I got a guitar and I started to talk myself to play guitar. Well, actually, no, Mr. Shuri, the folk guitarist who gave 10 lessons at the school I went to taught me how to play guitar.

And I learned the rest of it. I learned to play slow down, you move too fast. You gotta make the morning less just. Kicking down the cobblestones. Looking for fun and feeling groovy.

That's the reach right there. If you can hit that, then you can pick the right octave, right? You're one of those few singers, too, because of the training and stuff. And I said this to another friend of mine that sings. You have the proper training to know how to use it so you can tour and you can do night after night and you can sing properly, as they say, where other people who don't scream lose their voice and they don't know how to take care of it. Isn't that true?

Well, I make no mistake. I used to go out on tour and scream and lose my voice. I think we all did. A lot of us did in the early days. Mainly because we didn't have ear monitors. So we were competing with the guitar. You know, you can only turn the vocal monitors up so loud before they start feeding back. So there's a...

a point at which you can't amplify the voice on the stage any higher. And of course, the guitar can just get louder and louder and louder and louder until the only way you can hear yourself singing is if you shriek your head off. We were also, don't forget, in a lot of places we were competing with

you know, tens of thousands of screaming teenagers, many of them female, with very loud, high voices. And one in the way back. And then there's Sean. And one bloke. That was you, was it? And one young... I bet you had a great time. With a smoky eye. He was ready. Just come from behind the soda machine. Ah!

from a make-out session with another guy. But wait, so Simon, by the way, were you always like... It's true, by the way. It is true. Were you giving sort of shitty glances over to the guy, like who was it, Andy Taylor on guitar at that point? Were you kind of like, hey man, tone it down? Yeah, well, I mean, I knew that it wouldn't make any difference what I said to him. So...

I mean, honestly, you know. I love learning what the ear monitor is for because I feel like...

That's a recent thing, those ones that are formed right to your ear. That's over the last 10 years. Well, the first time... No, they're older than that. You'd be surprised. The first time we went out on tour and I had ear monitors was 1993. 1993? 1993. So we've had them for 30 years. When you first got it, were you like, oh, no.

man, this is, yeah. It was extraordinary. I could just turn, I could, I could turn the guitar down so there was none of it at all in my ears. And then of course, you know, if you turn, if you take all the other instruments out, you, you sing out of tune so that's no good. But I found, you know, you've learned to make a really good balance of the things that are in your head. And, um,

And it works. And it is much easier to save your voice. What's more satisfying when a huge crowd starts singing the words that you're singing, like they know the song, they love the song, or when they're completely silent and they're just totally engaged and you have them in the palm of your hand and they're listening to you doing your great singing? Like, I've always wondered that.

Well, the way you put it makes it sound a little egotistical. Me listening to them listening to my great singing. This is a safe zone. It's not really like that. See, what they do, really, is that they sing along with the big old favorite songs, songs like Hungry Like the Wolf.

Planet Earth, Come Undone, Every World. And the list does go on. It does, man. They sing along with those ones. But when we play new music, especially sort of like the new ballads and things, so off our latest album, which, by the way, is entitled Future Past. Future Past. That...

That's when they listen because they're not so familiar with the songs. So you get that chance with the new album, with the new material, you get that chance to just for them to hear it the way you want them to hear it. And we will be right back. Smart List listener, we get support from Zip Recruiter. And now back to the show. Can I ask a dumb question? Duran Duran means what?

Well, it's like Smith Smith. Duran is the most common name in France. Well, it's the second most common name actually because the most common one is Dupont.

But we didn't like the sound of Dupont Dupont. Right. Durand, Durand, Durand, Durand. I'm looking for Durand, Durand from Planet Earth. Remember that? That was Jane Fonda. I'm looking for Durand, Durand from Planet Earth. Durand, Durand from Planet Earth. Yes, Durand, Durand from Planet Earth. From which we got the band name and the name of our first single. Gotcha. Yeah.

And the name of your first record, Duran Duran, obviously, and was Planet Earth the first single from... Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We didn't, I didn't actually take that from the Roger Vadim film, Barbarella. You did not? No, it was only afterwards when we watched the film again.

that we realized that the title of our first single was in it. It was a wonderful coincidence. Yeah, because that's the character's name in the film, right? So Milo O'Shea played a character called Duran Duran, and he had done a bit of a... He was a scientist, but he'd done a naughty bunk with some kind of pleasure machine. And also this deadly weapon called the positronic ray.

Anyway, this old pervert back in the Earth Foundation got the youngest, most attractive astronaut, which is Jane Fonda, as Barbarella to go out and find him. I've got to see this movie. I've heard about it for years. It's a wonderful film. If you haven't watched it recently, watch it. What's the name of the movie?

Barbarella. Barbarella. Barbarella, yeah. You've heard of that, right, Sean? It's a very famous film. Yeah, of course. And then Pam Anderson remade it, I think. Did she really? Did she? Maybe I got that wrong. Maybe it was a different girl's name. Chances are high. Chances are high that Sean just likes to throw things out there. So, Simon, so you do, so Duran, and the character's name, it was Duran Duran, right? If I'm not mistaken. With a D on the end? It is. I think.

Anyway, which gives you even more... What a disappointment. No, no, I'm sorry to... Oh, my gosh, I can't believe I just broke that to Simon Le Bon. You know, because John and Nick were sitting there, see, in their Birmingham living room watching the movie, and all they could hear was Duran Duran, see? Right. So that was the name of the band at the time. So you guys formed Duran Duran, Planet Earth a big hit, and then...

If I'm not mistaken, was Girls on Film also on that first record? -I think it was, yeah? -Yeah. Yeah, it was. And you guys, that was one of-- That video, and I don't know if you guys remember, that video was like really too hot for American audiences. -Yes, I remember that. -Right? Walk us through that. What we did was we made two versions of that video. And it was-- Kevin Godley and Lowell Kareem were the video directors.

We made one version which was quite tame and you could put it on MTV during sort of, you know, sort of family hours. And then the other version, the night version, which was a longer, it was a longer video and we actually wrote an extended piece of music for it. That was, you could only see that on video jukeboxes. Oh,

Rock America video jukeboxes in nightclubs around the United States. And speaking of which, night versions, you guys actually, and I found this out just, you guys went and remixed all your own songs and did night versions so that they, am I right about that? No, we didn't remix them. We re-recorded them. So we actually recorded longer versions. We didn't just cut and paste the, which you couldn't do that anyway.

Right. Because it was all on tape. It was all on magnetic tape. We didn't try to kind of copy anything and stick it on later. We wrote...

12 minute versions of the song of all the songs that we did night versions so that it would lend itself better to sort of dance clubs and whatnot as opposed to yeah because that was that was the only way we could do it that was the only way we knew how to make long versions 12 inch records was to go in go back in and record them as 12 inches

Isn't that amazing? And so they have this whole, you can go and you can look it up, and they've got all the release of all these night versions of these extended versions that I did not know that you rewrote and re-recorded, which is pretty heavy lifting. I know, but that was just the job that there was to do. And if you listen to the Girls on Film version, the Girls on Film night version, it has a completely different last verse. Oh, really? Yeah.

Yeah, it goes, how's it go? God. Take one last glimpse into the night. I'm touching close, I'm holding bright. Shudders in a whisper, I'm coming closer. Take me high till I'm shooting a star. Only it's more like... Shooting a star!

That's the backup section. Oh, sorry, Mom. Am I going on a bit too long? Did you... I've always wanted to know, whose laugh is at the beginning of Hungry Like the Wolf, which is one of my favorite intros to a song ever? Yeah. That actually was... It was a girlfriend. Her name was Cheryl. She was...

my girlfriend and then funny things that happen in this life she became Nick's girlfriend no way no way how did that happen

I would imagine that's not the only time that happened. You guys have been together for quite some time. Really? Okay, we're going to move right along now. Speaking of being together for a long, long time, you guys have been making music for so long and been relevant for so long and been able to do what it is you want to do for so long for such a great big audience. What is the process of staying...

true to where you guys want to go changing your musical sound and and and having that kind of progress and then also trying to stay as aware of and is in touch with as possible what the what the what the the the changing of music uh is in in popular music you know like

There was a time when it was all the music, the instruments were plugged in and then they were not plugged in. And then there was more like, you know, how does that go? Or do you guys just make music for you and hope that it catches on? I think you've got to, there's a couple of ground rules here. Number one is you can't follow trends. You can't be following a trend as your major focus.

kind of writing inspiration. That cannot be your major inspiration. You have to make music that you like, that you enjoy. Otherwise, there will be no passion in it. And people can hear, they can hear the difference between something that you really mean and something that you're just going through the motions with. And...

But also, I think you've got to be aware of where music is at the moment. And we all are, and we always have been. There's stuff that we did in the 1980s we never dream of doing now because it just wouldn't be relevant to us now. What do you do when your taste in where things have gone is not aligned with your bandmates? What is that kind of creative negotiation like as you guys are starting to work out a new song?

Well, you know, there has been times when somebody's gone in the studio, laid down some parts, and somebody's come in after them and laid down completely contradicting parts that don't work with the ones that went down before. Right. The strong usually survives.

-The-- -That'd be the strong music or the strong personality? Yeah, the strong-- Oh, the music. Definitely the music. And what are the politics of that like? Like sort of navigating that within the band? Well, nobody's got any-- There's nobody whose opinion is more important than anybody else's. -Yeah. -You know, we don't have-- It's gotta be hard though. And, you know, when you went off and did-- went solo on projects, I've always wondered what is that dynamic--

How do you have that conversation like, guys, I love you, but I'm going to go do this for a second? Do they have any animosity? Well, none of us have really gone solo. Oh, I thought you had solo stuff. No, not really. I've done a couple of things. Nick and I did the Arcadia project. Oh, yeah. John and Andy did the Power Station project. Power Station. That's right, Power Station. And Roger...

God bless him. He did drums on both projects. Oh, wow. Okay. So he's the only guy who was in both Power Station and Arcadia. Yeah, I love both. By the way, the fact that you guys weren't named the Taylors is incredible considering it's Roger, Andy, and John in the band. All unrelated.

All unrelated. -Unrelated, yeah. -That is why. Taylor-John. Yeah. So you guys do-- You and Nick do the Arcadia thing. Those guys go and do Power Station. And then, sort of five years later, you guys-- you do the wedding album, is that right?

No, it wasn't quite like that. So we did Seven of a Ragged Tiger, went on tour throughout sort of 84. Then we got back together and we did View to a Kill. Oh, yes. And that was the last recording that the original five members made before the hiatus and the power station and Arcadia. Yeah.

Then Power Station and Arcadia happened. And then we got back together. But in the getting back together, it turned out that ultimately we would only have, well, not ultimately, but when we tried to get back together to reconvene the original Duran Duran, we weren't able to get Andy Taylor back in the band, really, and definitely weren't able to get Roger Taylor back. Mm-hmm.

So Andy was kind of in it and kind of out of it. Roger was definitely out of it. And sort of after a while, we realised that it would be, you know, it would be me and Nick and John, Roger,

Andy wasn't going to be a guitarist and Roger was not going to be our drummer. So we looked for other guys to work with. And quite happily, we really kind of developed our friendship and working relationship with Nile Rodgers at that time. And that's when we kind of had the Notorious album. That's what made that happen.

Is there a story you can share that you're comfortable sharing about why those two guys weren't able to come back in the new incarnation?

Well, yeah, sure. Roger, he really had... It all became a bit too much for Roger. I don't know the exact term for the psychological problem that he was having. It wasn't a nervous breakdown. But something happened to him and the anxiety was too much for him. And he wasn't able to carry on with the band. And...

Andy just wanted to be a rock and roller. And he just didn't think that Duran Duran was the right vehicle for the kind of music he wanted to make at that time. You know, he went off and he recorded the band Thunder. And he did his own rock records, heavy sort of American style rock record. Whereas we wanted to be Duran, the rest of us wanted to be Duran Duran. Yeah. I have a question about touring. Like, because...

I think when people go see a live show, and they go nuts for you guys, and then the show's over, they go home, and they're like, what an incredible show, not realizing you have to do it night after night after night after night, or sometimes with just a little break in between. What do you do to get ready for a tour? Because I can't imagine how grueling that is on your voice, on your body, on your...

sleep schedule and like the food that you have to eat. You just have to maintain all of that. And second part is, you know, I live for horrific live stories. Like what's the worst that a fan did? Like did they rush the stage and something happened? Or I love those kinds of stories if you haven't.

Right. Just let me just try and unpack those questions. Yeah, just put two in there. Just go ahead and take the first one. Let's do the first one, which is with the first part of that question was what do you have to do to kind of get ready for a tour? Well, we rehearse. But I think, you know, we made... Which is like physically and mentally. Yeah, well, physically, we try not to leave it too long between shows. So we had a before, we had, even though it was a little one, we had a performance at New Year in Times Square. And

And that kind of just keeps you nudging your personal fitness up. And we're going back out again in April. So we'll be rehearsing before that. And we'll all be physically capable of the job, of doing the job properly. Psychologically, I mean, just once you get to a certain kind of state in your career and you know that...

The more you try, the harder it is. So you need to just go up there and just do it and not try too hard. It's a bit like hitting a tennis ball or a golf ball or a cricket ball or even a baseball, let's say. It's that relaxed swing that gives you the best results. And performing is a bit like that. You've got to be relaxed but accurate. Right.

And to do that, you've got to be confident. You've got to really believe in yourself and believe that you can do it. Yeah, because you're going from just, you know,

not running around the stage for a year or whatever to mounting a tour to all of a sudden, I have to run around the stage and you have to keep that endurance up. It's just got to be, I can't imagine. But Sean, you had to do, I mean, you were on Broadway, you did it, you did a couple musicals. Yeah. And it's, yeah, that's why I ask is because, well, I'm gearing up to do it again and it's, you know, mentally just have to. Tabasco. Tabasco.

Can I ask you a question? Do you suffer from nerves? Oh, God, yeah. So I have something for you. I have something for you. This is my gift to you. It's my litany against nerves. And it goes like this. It's not fear. It's adrenaline.

It's just your mind and your body preparing you to do something extraordinary. And you will do something extraordinary. Yeah, I love that. Amen. God, if you're at home, record that and play that back for yourself. I love that too. Honestly, it makes such a difference when you realize I'm not frightened. It's just the butterflies. It's just the side effect of me sharpening up.

Did you have those? When you guys, when you started, you released Duran Duran sort of in the early 80s. Those first, I don't know, five years of the 80s, 80 through 85, maybe the most in-demand band in the world, it must have been like...

You just rocketed up. All your records were top of the pops. You had so many singles and you're on tour all the time. Did you have time in that? Were you young enough to not be nervous and just to be fucking cocky and just... I mean, I was... I got nerves...

I've been nervous with every single performance I've done, but I've learned to cope with it. And also, when the music starts and you walk on stage, the nerves become... It's more like that little shower that you go through on the way to the swimming pool, you know? The hygiene shower. Well, they spray you with sulfuric acid. That's what they do in this country. Yeah.

You know, you walk through it. It's like a shower bath that you walk through. And you come out and you walk on stage and the music starts and the nerves just recede into the darker back part of your brain. And suddenly you're there with the music and the audience. And in a way, the importance of that overcomes all the rest of it. We'll be right back. All right, back to the show.

One of the other things I would think that you would need and want is the desire to be out there and to be playing the same set every night could get monotonous. Same thing with theater, right, Sean? Where you're doing the same material every night. How do you find the excitement to...

to do it as good as or if not better than last night. It's a good question. It's a really good question. Are you channeling into the audience? There's more to it. No, no. No, I think what it is, is I think this, so you have to, the audience is part of it, I think.

Because that's the audience's one time to see you on that tour. Maybe some of them will come back next tour. A few of them will come and see more shows on that tour. But for most of the people in that room, it's their one time seeing Duran Duran maybe for two or three years, four years, five years. Maybe the only time in their lives they're going to see Duran Duran. And just remember that they deserve the best show they can get.

And then you start to, then you let the music, you just have to give yourself to the music. I've got another, I've got a little mantra before I go on stage as well, and that is let the songs do the work. I don't have to go out there and give a performance. I have to let the, I just have to serve the songs. And then everything else about the performance falls into place. Mm-hmm.

Yeah, that's a great point. And when you do that, and the music has got a great way of putting you right in the moment and you're not thinking about what you're going to go and have for dinner in a restaurant after the show and you're not thinking about what somebody said to you back in the hotel or something else. You become very much in the moment.

And when you're in the moment, you can't be bored because every little thing that you're doing is so important. As I said, you're serving the songs, you're doing the best you can to deliver these...

really good songs in the best way they could be presented. I'm the opposite. When I'm on stage and doing a play or a musical and it's performance, you know, 135, I'm completely thinking about what I'm having for dinner later. All right. I know it does happen. I know it does happen. We call that autopilot, right?

-Right? -Yeah, yeah, for sure. You just go into auto. That's when it's time to move on and do something different. How involved are you in another part of the shows that I always love in any rock show? Is the show around it, the lighting, the stage work? Well, I was gonna get to that. Jason, do you know that these guys-- I mean, Simon, you guys were one of the first acts

to really incorporate the video aspect of the show. Video wall. We were the first actor to use a video wall behind us. Wow. We're very involved in it. We work with the designer. We've got a fantastic guy called Vince. He's an amazing designer, amazing sets and lighting. And he does that. But we're sitting with him

all the way up to the production rehearsals, looking at the stuff he's doing because he's always redoing it and developing it.

And the imagery, the actual images. Oh, yeah, absolutely. That's another thing. The synchronization of that with the music, with when you're going to go with the upbeat or the out or whatever the heck all that stuff is. Jay, do you remember the reflex, the video for that was from a concert and used the video wall and had that image of the wave, yeah, Simon? Yeah, right. The wave that came out of the video screen.

And the one guy in the audience who got a bucket of water thrown in his face. Yeah, yeah. I remember that. But it worked. It worked. And people came up to me. People were coming up to me in, you know, in the street or in shops. I'd go out to, like, record shops in Toronto and somebody would come and say, hey, that screen, how did you make the water come out of the...

video screen because they were so taken in by the effects that they really thought it was real. Of course they did. And of course now we watch it and it looks so, you know, compared to modern CGI, it's obviously very fake. That was me. I was the guy in Toronto. Oh, that was you? Yeah, who came up to you. I was living in Toronto. I grew up in Toronto. I thought I recognized you. Yeah. And God, I remember that so vividly. That video was so huge. And it ends

The other thing I want to know in that time, so you do all these great things, and then walk me through a little bit getting the phone, the call from Bob Geldof to appear, because I played it a little bit in our intro. Oh, that's what you're playing, yeah. In Do They Know It's Christmas? Yeah. One of my... I have tried to...

I bastardize what you do, but I love your solo at the beginning of that. It's so fucking good. He has literally sung that a thousand times. A million times. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What was that like, that process of getting Bob calling you? Well, I was at home and I got a phone call and Bob goes, Simon, did you see it last night?

I said, well, Bob, this is the African thing. I said, no, I didn't see it, Bob. He says, it's terrible. He says, in Africa, in Ethiopia, they're starving, they're dying. I want to do something about it. And I thought we could make a record. We could all make a record together. Would you be up for being on that record? I said, yeah, absolutely. Mm-hmm.

And Bob later told me that he called two people. He called me and he called Sting. And he reckoned that if he got the two of us on it, then everybody else would say yes to it. And this was all planned. He had the whole thing planned. I went and did the demo. I went to a little studio, I can't remember where, in London, and worked with Midge, Ewer, and Bob, and did the demo.

So when we all arrived at the studio, Psalm West, I thought I was singing all of the verses. Oh, my God. What's that Bono guy doing here? I thought I'm singing that bit. Well, it's funny because it's you and Sting are singing and then all of a sudden when they cut back, Bono's between you and Sting.

Yes, that's right, yes. And then you see like all my... God, I remember at the time too, I was such a fan of The Jam as well. And I see Paul Weller was just making the move to Style Council and I was like, oh my God, fucking Simon Le Bon and Paul Weller and Bono and Sting and they're all in the same frame. Nobody had ever seen anything like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was wild. Did you guys, did you feel in the moment how that it was really, could you...

Did you recognize in that moment, wow, this is something amazing? Yeah, because no other time...

had all those, that variety and that number of hugely successful rock stars being in the same room together doing something like that. Not even on Saturday morning TV shows. Yeah. You wanted to know, but I remember the story, the absolute worst thing that happened on stage. Yes. Yeah. Well, there's been a few, a few mishaps, but there was one.

I don't know if you know this, but I went commando for 20 years. Mainly because some other bloke... I was not kept up to date on that. I'd mentioned throwing a pair of underpants behind the headboard of this hotel that all the bands used to stay in and going back there two months later and finding them still there behind the bed. And I was telling this to another rock star and he says, oh my God, I'm shocked. I said, yeah, it's disgusting. He says, it's not that.

You're a rock star. Rock stars don't wear underwear. That was in 1983. And I went commando for the next 20 years because of that. No way.

Yeah, absolutely. Anyway, at some point in that, I was on stage in the Ahoy Theatre in Rotterdam. Do you remember Madonna's pointy bra? Sure, of course. The Jean-Paul Gaultier bra with the cone thing on them? Yeah. Well, he'd made the same sort of corresponding pants for guys with the kind of cones on the butt cheeks.

And they had, instead of having one zip up the middle like normal trousers do, they had two zips, like one coming down from each hip, which meant they had a seam down the front. And so in between, right in between your legs was this kind of cross seam where four bits of material joined up. Anyway, I came running across to do my star jump in Hungry Like the Wolf where I jump off the rise and put my arms out like that.

And I'd never worn these pants before, and the sweat on my knees kind of grabbed hold of the jeans material. I did the star, and this seam in the middle of the crotch opened like a flower. And there's me and my junk flying towards the audience at velocity.

And I'm thinking, holy shit! And all the girls are thinking, finally, this is what we've wanted forever! The horror! Finally! And I hit the stage and I actually managed to kind of cover up my modesty or cover myself modestly.

Just as the first flashbulb went off. Wow. Running backstage, grabbing a towel and coming back out. And I did. Yes, I did. We had these little bar towels, these kind of like tartan bar towels on the stage. I shoved one of those down the front of my waistband. And then I was very coy and very fey. Oh, I'm totally naked under here, everybody. What? What?

Guess what I've got under here? Sean, do you have any of your pop... You know, Simon, you don't know this, but Sean at one point decided he was going to be a pop star and he wrote a bunch of pop songs. Yes, I did, yes. And, Sean, you don't have any of those handy, do you? Are you serious? Oh, my God. Sean, just sing just for Simon because he's one of the great rock stars of all time. Oh, I love this. Ready? Well, the lyrics are, I'll do, isn't it rough enough without feeling the torture of love? Wow. Wow.

There's music that could go to that? When she was five years old, my daughter Tallulah came up with this one.

Oh, my fucking God, I don't know what to do anymore. And I have to say, I prefer my daughters. Yeah, I get it. I get it. I get it. But that wasn't bad. I'm being... Well, I'm not singing. I'm not doing... It's so embarrassing. These guys will hear it, but nobody anywhere ever has heard these songs. And now the world will. And now the world's going to hear. Yeah. I'm honored. I'm honored.

Simon, I know that we've kept you too long and you've got to go. Again, what an unbelievable thrill to have you, man. Yeah, this is amazing. It's so great to meet you. I'm such a massive fan of everything you've done all the way along. Best of luck with the new album. We didn't even get to the... Future past? To the boat crash. We didn't even get to the... We'll have to do that next time. The nautical disaster. I'll come back and I'll tell you all about the boat disaster if you want me back. Okay.

I would love it. We want you back repeatedly. Thank you. Part two. Part two with Simon Le Bon is coming sometime soon, and we're going to talk about the nautical disaster. In the meantime, we've just enjoyed having you so much, man. Yeah, thanks for stopping by. It's been a huge pleasure. Thank you, fellas. I've really enjoyed it. See you soon. Come and see us on tour. We're really good. Yeah, for sure. Bye. Bye. Bye-bye. We're really good. Sean, um...

You know, again, as an aspiring pop star, can you imagine young Sean Hayes, who's got a handful of songs written on the backs of what I'm guessing are napkins. It's so, these songs are so, by the way, I wrote these songs with Jordan Roseman, who's known as DJ Earworm now.

No way. Yeah. Do you know DJ Earworm? Of course. He did that. The mashup. All those mashups. Yeah. Oh, yeah. So I wrote all these songs with him. And... But there's so... I said... By the way, this is so bizarre. I sent these songs to Bennett and Rob last night just to have like...

Right? Just so I could play them for you guys. I didn't know Simon Le Bon obviously was going to be on today. No, and I didn't know that you would send them to Ben and Rob. I did not connect with them. Oh, really? This was not a setup. No. Oh, I thought maybe you heard that. But I remember when you were saying that you had them, you called me after we talked about them one time and you said, I found all those songs. Can we just hear a little bit, please? Okay, so we'll play like a little bit of the song. No, this is terrible. Hang on. Shut up. Listen to my chipmunk vibrato. Oh, shit.

Why did it sound like the Peshmerga? Oh my God. It sounded like a goat getting hammered. Wait a second. Wait a second. Here comes the drop. Here comes the drop. That's right. And you're in shorts with suspenders, no shirt. Lederhosen. There's the drop. Oh.

Oh my God. It's so 80s. Glow stick in the teeth. You didn't want to be professional. You were trying to be Andy Bell. Let's be real. You were trying to be Erasure. 100%. I was totally trying to be Erasure. And we can cut that now. Wait, that sounds pretty great, Sean. It's a pretty good shot. Now, what are you singing? What is the, I want to what? It's so bad. The words are so bad. It's like, I walk the road. I walk the road. I walk the road. Between my happiness and despair. Like what? How old were you when you were writing this?

There should be some sort of a reward program for diehard Smart List listeners that you get. How many songs are there? Three or four? There's two that are done and then two that are kind of... They should be able to get those two songs. Now, if I could say to you... Well, hang on. No anyway. No fucking anyway. Hang on a second. No.

How happy would you be if we dropped your tunes, but we brought in, and here are some of the names who are going to come in and sing and we re-record them. You ready? Okay, okay. It's going to be you, Andy Bell, obviously. Oh, my God, I would fucking die. I would love that. He's like my hero. Andy Bell. Andy Bell's the lead singer of Erasure. And also, we're going to get, what's his name? We were just talking about from Erasure, who used to be... Oh, Vince Clark. Vince Clark, one of the founding members of Depeche Mode and who founded Erasure. Yeah.

And Yaz. And also Yaz with Alison Moyet. So we're going to get Vince Clark. We're going to get Andy Bell. So everybody from Razor. We're going to get... How are you going to get these people? Martin Gore. Okay, Martin Gore. You just got Simon LeBron. Dave Gahan. And we're going to have Simon. And we're going to have... What's his name? Is it Jimmy Somerville from...

Jimmy Somerville from Bronski Beat. Who actually did Band-Aid 2 when they did a second one in 1989. Jimmy Somerville was on that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right. I don't know all this. Because I love music. Will is like showing me a side of his Canadian youth. Did you have one of those mopeds with the raccoon tail and everything? Yeah.

No, I wasn't. I rode around like I was in Quadrophenia, you know, with a long parka. No, I didn't have that. I was a huge Smiths fan, obviously. Huge, yeah. Massive. We listened to the exact same music. I know, I know. That's crazy. Yeah. Wait, so yeah, no, but it was, I'm so glad we didn't play that while Simon was on. We waited until it was on.

I mean, Simon Le Bon, when I remember seeing that video for like Hungry Like the Wolf in Rio, and he talks about nerves, he was so confident. That was the other thing. Everybody in the band was so confident and cool, and they were kind of doing like, they were wearing mascara in their things, and they were just kind of like, they were just like these. It's also the start of MTV. It was really the first time our generation really got a look at

That's right. And what they do and how they do it. But they weren't a boy band in the sense that, like, and no offense, but they were actual musicians and they were actually really good and handsome. They weren't like a corporate transaction. No, those guys formed, I mean, they all kind of came together, like put ads out in, you know, Melody Maker magazine and they met each other and had a bar and they formed the band and they worked at the bar. Like they...

they really earned it and wrote all these great songs. But it's a testament that that's why they have longevity, I think, right? Because they're the real deal. I'd love to hear their new album and see how their musical styles have changed. But they, I mean, they had hit records, hit records, hit records. Then they break up, do other things. Then they come back and then like 10 years later have another huge smash hit record in the middle 90s with the wedding album.

They just keep doing it. And yeah, it's a testament to how... You're going to their show when they come here, yeah? Guaranteed. Oh, for sure. I didn't know that they were at the Hollywood Bowl last year. And somebody said to me like, Will, you're definitely going to Duran Duran, right? I was like, what? I'm going to that. I'm going to Depeche Mode in September. I was out of town. Yeah, we're going to Depeche Mode together. Wait, Depeche Mode is playing in September? Do you really love... I know every word. I love Depeche Mode. And, you know, one of my biggest regrets, I have a lot, as you guys both know. I think...

I think I'm looking at one right now with that sweater. Just look at your hair. One of my biggest regrets. We didn't miss that. We both swung hard at that one, Sean. I mean. You can't get a softball by us. Go ahead, Will.

I mean, Jesus Christ. Thank God I'm batting cleanup in this crew. You know what I mean? We're so eager. Is... In 1995... God, I might have messed up on the date. I can't believe it. But because it's so hurtful still to this day, I had...

I had the ability to go see the Smiths play one of their only shows they ever did in Canada. And I couldn't go because I had to leave with my family. And I was like, can we just, can I just stay an extra day to see them? They were playing at Canada's Wonderland outside of Toronto. And I couldn't go see them. In 95? Yeah, 85. Did you go on a family vacation? Go out, yeah, go be with my family for the summer. And then, of course, you know, within two years, they released The Queen is Dead, then they break up.

Thanks, Jim. Thanks, Alex. But anyway, I want to stay in the present because I don't want to spend a lot of time talking about... Bye, guns! Bye, guns! Bye, guns! Bye!

SmartLess is 100% organic and artisanally handcrafted by Rob Armjarv, Bennett Barbico, and Michael Granteri. SmartLess. If you like SmartLess, you can listen early and add free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.