Navy SEAL Debates Liberal on Defunding The Police
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So policing in America, something I thought was really interesting based on statistics from the FBI. In 2019, 89 law enforcement officers were killed in the line of duty. 48 of those died as a result of felonious acts. 41 of those died in accidents. However, they killed 1,348 people in the U.S. alone.

If I'm sitting right here and I pull a gun out of my pants and I go like this and I look this way and I start shooting at you, what are you gonna do? I'm gonna shoot at you. You're gonna fucking kill me, aren't you? So it's, I do not and will not

agree with this narrative that the police are just current, like constantly under, they're at war and that they are under fire all the time and that they're being hunted. It's just not fucking true. The data, there's no data to support that. Well, there is video footage of Los Angeles that just happened a couple weeks ago of a man that walked up to the vehicle and shot two fucking officers in the head, correct?

Shadow cabal of fucking like really violent protesters that are just there to incite violence. I think that's bullshit. I participated in some of those protests. I did. Peaceful ones. Protester in Portland who threw a Molotov cocktail at a fucking cop, but he missed and the fucking thing set his own leg on fire. Who saved his ass? The fucking cop saved his ass, didn't he?

There's some good. You want to go protest? Go ahead. Let me put your fucking leg out. Then you can throw another fucking Molotov cocktail at me. So maybe it is. Maybe we do. Maybe we defund them and we pull them out of all of the neighborhoods that don't want them. And they'll just sort it out. I think that would go poorly. I think that would go extremely fucking poorly. But sometimes, you know, maybe the best thing to do is just let people live in what the fuck they created.

Yeah, no, I agree with that. Give them what they want. You don't want any police, you won't get any. None. So policing in America, something I thought was really interesting, based on statistics from the FBI, in 2019, 89 law enforcement officers were killed in the line of duty. 48 of those died as a result of felonious acts. 41 of those died in accidents. However...

They killed 1,348 people in the U.S. alone. So looking at that, I think there's a big... The police think they're at war. A lot of the training I see kind of pushes that narrative. But based on the data, it looks like police are actually rather safe in their line of work and that they're civilians or not. So with that in mind, and with the fact that we've seen...

From 2010 to 2015, $1 billion has been paid out in public lawsuits over police misconduct. And with the recent protests, there's been 10,600 demonstrations linked to the Black Lives Matter movement in all 50 states, according to the ACLU. And 95% of those were peaceful and peaceful.

Fewer than 570 or 5% of them involve demonstrators engaging in violence. So I guess what I'm getting at here is that like the narrative, it seems, is on one side, you've got the police who feel, you know, that their job is very dangerous and they're not well liked. But from the civilian side, it looks like they're fucking civilians up. I mean, what do you think about that?

Well, for starters, what were those statistics again? So you said, did you give a percentage of how many Black Lives Matter protests wound up violent? Yes, that were linked to black. The protest itself was linked to Black Lives Matter. 5% of those, out of 10,600 recorded demonstrations, 5% of those resulted in violence. So I wonder, not that this is...

an excuse, but I wonder how many police calls there were, how many times they responded to something, and what the percentage of that wound up, you know, being bad. Yeah, so, I mean, that is something to account for. The, you know, police do interact with people a lot. And so, you know, maybe the statistics gone, like, it probably seems to be that the overall majority of police interactions with civilians are non-fatal. But

following back on what the FBI said, you know, there are instructors that go around. I'm sure you know some of them that teach police training. And a lot of that narrative is pushed that they, like, have a very dangerous job. They're at war. And I think that's the wrong way to go about it. I don't think that's the type of precedent you want to set for the police. You don't want to put them in that mindset. And especially when I can't personally reconcile that 89 law enforcement officers were killed in the line of duty.

half of those being accidents not related to crime. But over 1,300 civilians were killed by police. Yeah. That's pretty staggering to me. It is staggering. I would like to know the statistics of, you know, if we're going to talk about percentages, you know, what is the actual percentage of...

of police responses that have gone bad. You know, is it 1%? Is it half a percent? Because if you're, if anybody is looking for a perfect response

percentage, 100% perfect, that just isn't going to fucking happen. Nothing is perfect. People will fucking die and that's unfortunate, but I would like to know that percentage. And I think it's unfair to know the percentage of how many BLM protests went bad, which is only 5%, correct? And that's, I mean, pretty good.

I think we need to know that percentage as well. You know, the other percentage. Is it 5%? Is it 1%? And, you know, as far as like the fatalities that they're responding to, what are they responding to? You know, I mean, I don't believe they think they're at war. But with that being said, police don't get called to respond just to bullshit. A smoke detector that's out of batteries.

What are they being called to do? Domestic disputes, domestic violence. Look at the crime stats in the areas where this shit's happening. What are those like? If you go in there thinking everything's just going to be just fine, like Chicago, for example, certain neighborhoods of Chicago, violence there is through the roof.

And there are gun laws that you can't even own a gun there, correct? So do you think, I want to ask you a question, do you think it would be foolish to go into that neighborhood, into a neighborhood with a very high homicide rate, thinking everything's okay? No. I think there can be a middle ground. I don't think police should look at civilians that they are meant to protect as enemies, all of them.

And they shouldn't assume that every situation they're rolling up on, you know, you take Tamir Rice and Rayshard Brooks, you know, these were kids. Tamir Rice was 12, I believe, and was on a playground with a toy gun and he was shot by police. That's absurd to me. Yeah. Bad intelligence, maybe. I mean, take, you know, another one I think that's definitely on everybody's tongues now is Breonna Taylor, you know.

I think a big problem with that was they were operating on bad intelligence. Yeah, I wouldn't say, you know, and I think it does depend. Now, to my knowledge, Breonna Taylor, when they responded to that or served the warrant or whatever the hell happened, I'm going off opinion and you're spitting facts and I'm taking your facts as 100% truth. But they were fired upon first, correct? They were. So...

What are they supposed to do? Let me ask another question in that regard. What is the homeowner who gets a no-knock warrant, doesn't know it's the police, like any gun-owning American has the right to do with a stand-your-ground law, which Kentucky has? What are they supposed to do? They might want to ask who the hell it is before they fucking shoot. What if that was her mom? What if that was his mom? What if that was a kid?

They're just fucking gonna shoot blindly at the door for no fucking... Just... You know what I mean? Same deal with the cops. They shot into several apartments, and that's what actually one of the officers got indicted on. But they shot after they were fired upon. I'm not sure of the round count, but I remember it being pretty high. Well, I don't know the round count either, but...

And and it's a bad situation. It's extremely hard to backseat quarterback these things without actually being there or, you know, and getting the full scope of what happened. But as a person that's been shot at several more times than I can count, shit goes out the window. You know, when somebody is trying to kill you.

And that's what that person was doing was trying to fucking kill them for serving a warrant. They have to defend themselves. They have to defend their brothers, you know? And it's very, obviously it's very unfortunate what happened. But, you know, when you're being shot at, you can't sit, you're making a decision. You're trying to make a logical decision while you're,

bullets are flying past your head. And when bullets are flying past your head, the only thing you're thinking about is I want to go home tonight and I want my, you know, my, uh, whoever the hell they're, you know, their colleagues, they want them to go home tonight. They're, they're approaching that door for a warrant. What was the warrant for? Do you know? It was an arrest warrant. I don't remember what the crime was. Um,

But unfortunately, who they were serving the warrant to, they were at the wrong house and the person was already in custody. So bad intelligence. Yeah.

- It was that intelligence and there's no excuse for that shit. But they were being shot at and you can backseat quarterback that guy too. You know what I mean? It sucks 'cause you don't know the whole fucking context behind what his thought process was. But generally if I hear somebody tampering with my front door, I'm not just fucking slinging lead through the front door at whoever it is.

You know, even if somebody broke into my house and was in my fucking door entry, I would illuminate that person with a light and I would figure out who the fuck it is before I start throwing lead downrange at them. Wouldn't you? And so if somebody is shooting at you, they are trying to fucking kill you and they had to make a judgment call. Well, I think your tactics are perfect.

the most appropriate to identify the threat before you shoot. If we made that in the law, I think you'd have a lot of cases where homeowners did shoot somebody that was actually trying to break in and hurt them. Those would be overturned very quickly. Many, many people have, and that is why that stand your ground law exists.

And it's been shown in court cases and by precedent that if in the middle of the night someone breaks down your door, you can assume that they are there to cause imminent danger to your body. And that's where the self-defense comes in. And I get it. I mean, I see it from both perspectives of the police and the guy. The guy, I believe the court testimony says,

said that they, you know, didn't hear a knock, just heard a door bash in. So he grabbed, started firing. Police said they knocked, announced themselves, and then busted in and got shot at. So, yeah, it's a pretty shitty situation. What I'm curious is of is...

If the police it's a bad situation, but how did that how did the guy survive he shot at the police? How did he walk out of there with his life? Yeah, I you know, I don't know. I don't know where he was positioned Yeah, was she right next to him? Was she in the other room? I don't know, you know and that I mean it's fucked up, you know, there's no something you can't say like oh, you know I'm not I am NOT giving them a pass what I'm giving them a pass on is

They fired after they were shot at. They didn't come in there guns blazing. They were fucking shot at and they returned fire. Now, you know, if they returned fire and she was standing right there, that sucks. If she was in another fucking room from where that guy was, then that's even worse. You know, and that's inexcusable. And it does. It comes down to...

fucking training, which nobody seems to want to pay for. And me and you had a discussion about this earlier, uh, where you did your research and you said, you know, the, the, the, the, the funding goes to the equipment. It goes to fucking night vision. It goes to armored vehicles. It goes to all kinds of shit, you know, and it doesn't go to training. And I'm,

I found that out when I had a law enforcement agency ask me to conduct training for them. They had just gotten night vision, dual tube night vision, PBS 15s, which are about $10,000 a pop. And they did not want to pay me to teach these officers how to utilize night vision.

And, you know, and that that proved to be right there. It's like, wait a second. So you have the funding to buy your entire fucking SWAT team $10,000 pieces of night vision when, to be honest with you, I can't fucking see a reason why you would need night vision in the middle of a major fucking metropolitan area. But, you know, whatever. They have it. And, yeah.

But you can't pay a fucking trainer to come teach him, you know. And just for the record, my price was $350 per head. That's it. Which I think is a very fair price considering the training that they wanted, you know. But I'm not the one making the rules. But, you know, you can buy $10,000 fucking pieces of night vision equipment

per officer you can get these two hundred thousand dollar fucking vehicles that you really don't need but you can't afford to fucking pay me 350 to fucking train your officer how to utilize the fucking night vision now how pathetic is that shit you know and kind of continuing on with that part of you know we had talked about earlier but where a lot of the funding does go is

is into gear, obviously. Night vision is not cheap from what you explained, but also it goes into settling public lawsuits over police misconduct from 2010 to 2015. According to the wall street journal, $1 billion, uh, between the, between 10 cities with the largest police departments. Some of those being like Los Angeles, New York, um, they paid over 1 billion, $1 billion, uh, and, and,

in funds from the public for lawsuits. So given what you just told me, would you say that police are under-trained? And if so, and if yes...

Fuck yeah, they're under-trained. Police are absolutely under-trained. There's too much fucking concentration on the fucking equipment that they have and not enough on the training. Like I just said, they want to spend fucking $10,000 per head to get the fucking guy's night vision. You know, I don't think they need them. Who gives a shit what I think? But you can't fucking buy $10,000 pieces of night vision and then not fucking pay somebody to fucking train them how to use it.

like i said my price was 350 to train them per head how to use their night vision how to do room clearance how to make entries how to breach doors whatever you want to you know how to operate under night vision and they they they didn't hire me it was too much but they can afford ten thousand dollars a head for night vision now what the real problem is is the accountability

It's across the fucking board. I think that's wrong with what's wrong with America's fucking accountability. But, you know, what happened to George Floyd? You brought up George Floyd earlier, right? Now, what did we do? We fucking took that cop.

And threw his ass in fucking jail. And don't get me wrong, what he did is fucked up. I don't give a shit, you know. People are saying, oh yeah, well that guy had a fucking rap sheet and he pointed a gun at a pregnant girl, right? Yeah, fuck, that is fucked up. And he is a piece of shit. I don't give a fuck what anybody says. You fucking put a gun to a pregnant woman's fucking stomach? You're a piece of shit. Now, the facts are, whatever the fuck happened in the past, that has been dealt with.

Correct? That's done. That's over. He's fucking paid the price. I don't know what the hell he did if he went to fucking jail or prison or whatever the hell happened. You know what I mean? He's done. He has paid the price for that and he is a fucking free man now. Right? So you don't take a free man and fucking put your knee on the back of that fucker's neck and kill him.

For what did he do? I can't remember. He was phony check or something. Yeah, phony $20 bill, counterfeit bills while they were called. You don't fucking do that. It doesn't matter what he did in his past at that point. He has paid the price. He is, you know, justice has been served for whatever that incident was that he did in his past. And he is now a fucking free man and was not treated as such.

Now, what did we do? We fucking threw the guy in jail, you know what I mean? And they prosecuted him or whatever the hell happened. But where's the fucking accountability? That guy had, if I remember correctly, he had a lot of disciplinary actions against him, correct? So what the fuck happened to the chief of police there? What the fuck happened to his supervisor? What the fuck happened to the mayor there?

who's not on top of the fucking police department there. Nothing. Not a fucking thing happened to anybody above that guy, did it? No. What did they do? They took the easiest fucking road they could and they got the grunt and everybody else walks when the fucking documentation is there. The documentation is there and nobody's fucking talking about that, are they?

So with that, you know, a big problem that leads into that is police unions and qualified immunity. Police unions are extremely powerful. I think it was in Los Angeles County alone in 2019, over a thousand officers were fired for misconduct, but 458 of those

their cases are still in arbitration, so they're still patrolling the streets. And that's because of the enormous power they have and backing by police unions and qualified immunity. And I think this is a good thing to talk about, especially where the contrast is with, you know, I think about the military, you know, you've been deployed and at least from what the news that's available to the public,

In some of the most harsh conflicts, Vietnam may be a little bit different story, but generally the military holds themselves pretty well. And especially given that they're in a war zone, the way they're able to police, and especially with the Iraq war, be able to police and handle a civilian population without a lot of needless killing,

Why is it that the... Maybe you can give me more on this because I just don't know, but the rules of engagement seem to be stricter for our military who are in war zones, where we have said that we're at war here. The rules of engagement seem to be stricter than that of our own domestic peacekeeping force. That doesn't make any sense to me. Could you elaborate on that? As far as accountability goes, are the rules of engagement, what are they for the military and military?

And what does accountability look like if you break those rules of engagement?

Well, the rules of engagement, they change. They change all the time. They change with who the president is. They change, you know, they change per situation, per area of operation. Generally, the rule of thumb is do not fire until fired upon if it's just a regular gunfight, which happens all the time.

But now, if it's a capture-kill mission, that's completely different. And I'll tell you what generally dictates rules of engagement are where you're operating. So if you're operating in an environment where it is extremely hot,

And it is known that there is, it's extremely heavy Taliban or Al-Qaeda or ISIS or whoever the fucking threat of the year is. You know, those ROEs get loosened, you know, because it is so fucking hot. And I think that's what people don't understand about, that's where I'm definitely going to take the police officers back is, you know, I'm sorry, but responding to a,

well-to-do, wealthy neighborhood with a fucking low crime rate like Franklin, Tennessee, you don't have to fucking...

you know, be as worried about what's going to happen to you wearing that uniform. Now, you go into what, East Nashville? Is that where it is? Antioch? That fucking neighborhood? Every fucking morning I turn the news on, there is another murder. At least one. Every morning. That's what I drink my coffee to. I want to see who's murdered in Antioch.

Yesterday morning. Now, if you're a police officer responding to an incident, fucking Antioch, guess what? You're going to be a little more amped up, aren't you? Because the fucking crime rate is through the roof there because nobody can seem to get a handle on it. Now, you know, people are going to when you're stressed, you know, and you're under pressure like that and maybe your life is under duress.

You don't have time to sit there and weigh the options. You have to react to save your fucking life and that's it. And the bad thing about police now is now they have even more pressure on them because they're under public scrutiny. So not only are they – we've just chopped their legs off.

And you made it more stressful for them, you know, by talking about defunding them. And the decision-making process becomes – it becomes even more difficult. They're already stressed. Then, you know, they want to do the right thing. I honestly believe that the majority of police officers want –

to make a difference and they want to do good. Yeah, of course there are fucking bad apples out there. We've, I've seen them, you've seen them, shit, they're all over the news, you know, but, but, you know, as a police officer, you have to, you have to, I mean, you can't backseat quarterback every single fucking incident that happens. You just can't do it. And, and,

And at the beginning of this, I was asking you for percentages. You know, when we were talking about the BLM protests, 5%, only 5% of BLM protests went violent. I want to know the facts on how many police incidents went bad. I'll bet you it's less than 5%. I'll bet you it's less than 1%. And those are pretty good fucking numbers. With all civilians in the whole of the country?

I'll bet it's less than 1%. I think it's kind of difficult to compare to the Black Lives Matter protests because those are an isolated movement versus a day-to-day policing of civilians that we've had in this country for, you know, gosh, I guess nearly 100 years now. But, you know, still on the rules of engagement, I understand, especially, you know, that the rules of engagement are going to change depending on where you're operating, but

But regardless, if you fuck up, if you break that rule of engagement, whatever it is and wherever it is, is the system lenient for our armed forces? To my understanding, it's not. No, it's not lenient. And the reason you don't see that in the military is because the accountability system is so stringent that people know if you fuck up even a little bit, you're going to be breaking the rocks in Leavenworth. So do you think there being consequence...

in the military, is that a contributing factor to why, at least to the knowledge that's publicly available, our civilian casualties directly, at least in gunfights, are low compared... The police are operating in America, in their home turf where they live. And they're certainly not following the rules of engagements of don't fire unless fired upon.

Especially with, I look at in 2019 of those 1,348 people that were killed by police, 55 of them unarmed. And since that data has only been tracked by the FBI since 2015, in 2015 it was 94 people were unarmed. What happens in the military if you shoot an unarmed person? I mean, that depends. Osama bin Laden wasn't armed.

Put it maybe in the situation of you're at a traffic stop. I'm sure you may have stopped some people in a vehicle in Iraq or wherever. I'm sure that may have happened. There are times when you fucking kill them.

Then the consequences for that are? That is, it's always situational dependent. Now, let me give you a scenario. All right. So you're familiar with car bombs, correct? So if I have a sign and you have, you know, I have friends that have been, tons of friends that have been killed by fucking car bombs, right?

And you can't tell if that's a fucking car bomb. There's certain signs you can see, you know, maybe the trunks on the Toyota Corolla or the taxis sunk in because there's so many explosives packed into the back of that thing. But if you have a fucking sign out and you have a translator yelling, you know, hey, don't fucking come any closer or you will be shot.

There were signs everywhere. If you come within 100 meters of this vehicle, you will be shot. And you have some fucking guy who ignores all of those warnings and is hauling ass at your vehicle. And it fits the exact profile of a fucking suicide vehicle born IED bomber. You know, then you're going to fucking shoot him.

He's coming at you. He's gonna blow your ass up. Now sometimes, there were no explosives in the car. Am I fucked up? No, and the reason- Or should I have taken the chance and go, "Well boys, this guy isn't paying attention to the signs, he's not paying attention to the verbal warnings, so let's just see how this pans out." If he gets here and hits the button, we're all fucking dead. Alright, here he comes.

Hopefully this isn't one. Or do you fucking shoot him? You gave him a verbal. You gave him a warning. Not to mention he's got lasers on his fucking chest. He has guns pointed directly at him before there's a shoot. Right. Why would anybody keep driving towards a fucking vehicle that says do not come within 100 feet or you will be shot and a verbal.

And people are throwing rocks. And people are throwing water bottles. And he has lasers on him. And he has guns pointed at him. Would you, like, maybe assume that that's a fucking bomb that's getting ready to blow up? Me too. And guess what you're going to do? You're going to kill that fucker because it probably is a bomb. Now, there have been times where it wasn't a bomb. But what am I supposed to do? Jeopardize my fucking life because this guy can't fucking...

Look at the context clues of what's about to happen, you know, and then there's the argument, well, maybe he can't read. Okay, well, there's a fucking verbal. And here's the biggest sign that's universal. No matter where you're at in the world, if there's a gun pointed at your fucking head, you know, that probably isn't a good idea to proceed, right? So there are situations where innocent people die, you know, because of, you know,

a poor decision that they've made. You know, I think it's important to distinguish the context. I mean, you are in that situation, you were at war. That's much different than, you know, this most recent shooting in Kenosha where the guy was shot in the back walking to his car where he may have had a weapon, may have had a weapon. That's a totally different situation. And again, I think the enormous restraint

to that our military shows in war zones where they don't kill people is incredible, given that they're not home. They're in a place where they have been briefed that you were here to fight a war and eliminate a threat. The police are briefed to protect and serve their communities that they live in. Protect and serve. Now, Kenosha, let's go, let's,

Tell me the facts. Other than he was shot in the back, what were they responding to? They were responding to a domestic call. The guy did have a rap sheet, and I think, I believe he had a warrant out for... A domestic violence call? Mm-hmm, and he had a warrant personally for, I think, sexual battery. Yeah, sexual battery. What is sexual battery? Do you know what that is? It's a lower degree of sexual assault. Okay, so he has sexually assaulted somebody.

in his past and they're responding to a domestic violence call. Okay. And I don't know every single detail, but there was an altercation with the police. He attempted to, it seemed like he was attempting to flee and by police testimony, they thought that he may have been going for a weapon in his vehicle, which housed his two children.

And they opened fire and shot him seven times in the back. Okay. Before getting to the vehicle. That, by precedent, it actually happened in Knoxville, Tennessee, I think two, three years ago. The police shot a fleeing suspect in the back who was unarmed. You cannot shoot... One, you can't shoot unarmed people, and you can't shoot fleeing suspects. You can't do it. It's by court precedent. That's what the law has set. So...

Looking at that situation, and again, this is all in contrast to our military, it seems our military, with what you just described, there are a lot of warning signs before they actually go lethal.

The police have been more and more in all these situations we see skipping the taser, skipping, you know, putting time, distance and cover between them and what could be a supposed threat. And they're immediately going for a gun, you know? And I think personally, a lot of that is to do with that. The military does have a stronger accountability system. If you fuck up in the military, you, you go to prison for it. And, and,

you know, with the police in America, when they kill someone that first they get to go home. If I kill somebody where I'm suspected of killing somebody, I don't get to go home. I'm taken to jail and I'm held on with or without bond. Police get to go home with pay. And there's an investigation that takes place. That's where kind of the qualified immunity comes in. Now, while they're obviously, I think there should be, you know,

the police and civilians should have some different expectations. I think it is a little, it just doesn't, it doesn't make sense to me that we expect less violence from our men and women serving in war zones around the world, but our peacekeeping forces in our own country are not held to those same standards. They're not.

I think we're missing a lot of context with this. I really do. You know, okay. Now, what I want to say is, if you have been reported for a domestic violence call, which this guy knew why they were coming. I'm not saying this was a good shoot. So I want to be very fucking clear on that. I'm not saying this was a good shoot. But you just beat the shit out of your girlfriend and the cops are on the way. You know why they're on the way, right?

You know why the fuck they're coming over. They're coming over because you just beat the living shit out of your girlfriend. Now, they show up and they say, get your fucking hands in the air now. And you're at gunpoint. What are you going to do? Put my hands up. You're going to put your fucking hands up, right? You're not going to go turn around and start digging in your car, are you? No. Because why not? They might think that you're getting a gun.

And if they think their life is in danger, they are going to fucking kill you to save their own life and the life of their partner, which is exactly what they should do if it's real. Now, I don't know the context clues. I don't know how far away that guy was from the vehicle. I don't know if the taser was even within the effective range.

Taser might not have been an option. I don't know. And tasers do fail on many people. That does happen. You know, but so, you know, being a responsible civilian, even if he did beat the shit out of his girlfriend, oh, I guarantee you they didn't just fucking shoot him. They probably said, stop, put your fucking hands up, get on the ground, right? Yeah.

I seriously doubt they just showed up and this dude just turned around and they just fucking shot him. I guarantee you there was some kind of verbal. Yeah, I believe there's a verbal, you know, there were orders given. But... No, with that being said, I'm not excusing that. I'm just painting a scenario. Sure. You know what I mean? Yeah, no, that's... You're a police officer. You're going...

to respond to a call of somebody who already has whatever, assault or battery or sexual assault, I can't remember what we were just talking about, but it was something with violence. And now you're responding to another call with the same individual, which once again is violence. And I'm just trying to paint you a picture that is different than what we've all seen. Now, with that being said, was there a gun in the car? No. I don't know. There wasn't.

I'm not, you know, it was obviously a fucking bad shoot and that sucks. It does. But you do have to keep in mind their mindset and what they're responding to. And just like what Travis house was saying, you know, earlier, I mean, one minute he's on the, he's in the middle of the street getting his face beat in, you know, by a fucking criminal. And then two minutes or not two minutes, five minutes later, after that one's done, he's responding to a call of a lady with a,

fucking smoke detector and she's all she's all pissed off because he's in a bad mood but what she doesn't see is he was literally fighting for his fucking life in the fucking street five minutes prior to to to responding to that call you know and no human can can be trained to overcome that we're not we're not supposed to have to deal with that kind of shit as human beings do you think that

I mean, but would you agree with the sentiment that, and this could be for a lot of reasons, training being probably the bulk of it and accountability, I think, being another part of it. But our military does seem to handle these situations better. They do. I mean, you served. I wouldn't know. And honestly, a lot of that information, like the nitty gritty of the, like, it's not, we don't hear about it. Can't find anything on it.

but I haven't read any mass... This is like comparing apples to oranges, though. Is it? I'm a fucking SEAL. I've had millions and millions of dollars worth of training. Shit, it takes three years worth of training just to get out the fucking door and be able to even go to war and serve your country, serving in a unit like I served in. Now, if...

And I'm fortunate enough to be able to, you know, to have served in that capacity. But I don't think that we can spend, you know, $5 million training every street cop out there. So that's why I'm saying it's a little bit different, you know. We can't even get these guys ammo to fucking train with to get proficient with their guns. These guys are—a lot of these guys that are—

They're paying for their own training out of their pocket. A really good cop is paying for his own fucking training out of his pocket. And we all know cops get paid shit, you know? So yes, they do. They need to fucking up the training budget. And, uh,

And I do think this goes back to accountability. I mean, yes, the George Floyd case, the Kenosha case, like, yeah, those guys, the guys on the ground, they definitely need to be held accountable. But you know who else needs to be held accountable is the fucking, is the politicians, you know, who aren't overseeing their different departments. Why aren't they allocating a fucking training budget? I think that the police budgets are...

They've actually continued to grow, especially here in Tennessee. And they do spend it on things. Like Nashville, I remember two years ago, bought a mine-resistant vehicle. That's what it was labeled as in the news report. A mine-resistant vehicle needed in downtown fucking Nashville. There's a lot of mines there. I'm just kidding. And so I think you've got police unions that are systemically just too powerful. And...

They're not able to fire bad officers. It's not able to do it. There's, I watched the body cam footage myself. There was a police officer in Sevier County, small County, low crime rate County. My mother covered this story. He had, he was there to serve a, an arrest warrant on somebody missed their court hearing, the failure to appear. And the guy walks out his front door with a cell phone in his hand and

cops start shooting. Thankfully, nobody dies, misses him. On body cam, has a panic attack, drops his gun, has a panic attack. EMTs show up, he's having a panic attack, and they give him back his gun, and he continues on, and it's a bad situation. But everybody leaves alive, thankfully. But Sevier County was unable to fire that police officer, and turns out he had been fired from two other departments coming to Sevier County. So

Police, because of police unions, what they've lobbied for, police departments are not required to report that they fired officers or the conduct. That's why bad officers get into some of these departments. It's very easy to do. So, you know, I do think the problem is systemic for sure. I think it's not just cops are bad. I think that's a gross, you know, simplification of it that, you know, things like defund the police and shit have done. But,

I do understand on that, you know, I do understand where the terminology comes from because the goal of defunding the police is actually to redirect these overinflated police budgets into community policing and, you know, I think mental health is something that is... Police respond to a lot of mental health calls, like homeless folks especially,

And they're acting erratically. They will not respond to verbal commands. And as we've seen historically, that's how shit gets violent. You know, if they don't comply, that's when the police have to use some type of force. And unfortunately, sometimes that leads to lethal force.

But I think this moves on to a bigger point, is that do you think we do ask too much of the police? Do you think they're spread too thin for what they're trained for? I don't know if they're spread too thin. I think the budget needs to be redirected to where it needs to go. I hate the word defund, but I think there are things that we could do that would. I mean, look, you're never going to have a good encounter with a cop.

That's not what they're there to enforce the law. And if you're breaking the law, you're going to have an encounter with a cop. That's just the fucking way it is. Nobody has good experiences with police officers. Very few. But but I think the budget needs to be redirected to where it needs to go. I think there are things that we could do to minimize exposure with police, which I

People have different St. Louis did it. I believe it's St. Louis traffic cameras. You know, you don't want to deal with the cops. OK, we're going to put fucking cameras on the red lights. We're going to put speed traps on. Oh, but then when you get a ticket, guess what? That doesn't fit your fucking agenda. And so we can't have that. So what do we have to do? We have to bring all the fucking cops back and.

to be able to basically turn them into meter maids. Oh, you got a speeding ticket. Oh, you ran a red light. And then now we have a ton of interaction that doesn't even need to happen because we as civilians just fucking threw a temper tantrum because we got to pay a $50 fucking red light ticket because we ran a red light and there's a picture of our car running a red light. You know what I mean? So...

We've tried that and nobody wanted it, you know, and now you see what I'm saying though? I mean, if you increase the amount of, you know, interactions that police have with civilians, that by statistical fact will lead to more, there will be more violence because there's just more interactions. And I think that's completely fair. You know, and I think there are, and that's kind of, I think,

I also disagree with it too. I think it's the worst fucking phrase they could have gone with. But redirecting the budgets and auditing them, frankly, because there's waste. From our Defense Department, we know, we know.

There's waste there. There's waste in our police budgets. There's waste in our city budgets. We're really fucking bad about that. I don't know why, but we are. I got a friend who is a little off topic, but I had a friend who part of the National Guard and before their budgets roll over, he had to go out with his unit and shoot fucking bullets into the ground to get rid of ammunition so they could, their budget wouldn't get, you know, they didn't have a surplus and get cut.

thousands and thousands of dollars of ammunition. It's fucking waste. So I think I look at it more like let's audit this shit. Let's see where really that police department buying night vision in a metropolitan city, probably a waste of fucking money. It's absolutely a fucking waste of money. And I bet that money could go to... What they could have done instead of

by every member of the SWAT team fucking night vision for $10,000 a pop is gone white light and give everyone the best fucking training that they could receive. All it could have gone used guys like me. I could have used guys like Ronan tactics, uh,

There's a ton of them out there. Mike Glover with Fieldcraft. These are guys who are operating at the fucking pinnacle of tactics, of entering houses, clearing rooms, and

You know, they could have done that. They could have used that budget for those fucking night vision goggles and put it into the training and done white light, which would be better anyways, considering, you know, I don't know any cities that have zero power or anybody that cuts the power to where they go. Um,

And you operate faster on white light anyways. But they didn't want to do that. I think where there's a breakdown is because we've been at war for almost 20 years, people are starting to see they, for some fucking reason, people are comparing police to military too fucking much. It's completely different. We need shit that they don't need. And

They're seeing what we use and they think that they need what we use and they do not need that. They're not fucking operators. There are police officers who are supposed to protect and enforce the law. And and I think, you know, I do believe that, you know, the.

The vast majority of law enforcement does that very well. Now, yes, there are fucking bad apples, and we've seen that. But I think—I'm getting off topic here, but I think redirecting the budgets to where they need to be and quit with the bullshit. We're not in fucking Yemen over here. We're in the U.S.,

We don't need a lot of that shit. What they need is fucking training. And, and, uh, and as far as, and, and accountability, we need fucking accountability and not just at the lowest level. If an officer shoots somebody in the back and that person dies and that was a bad shoot and there is no excuse for it, which sometimes there is a fucking excuse for that. I'm sorry, but there is, but if there was no excuse for it, uh,

More people need to be held accountable than that one particular officer. The fucking...

They need to dig into his background. Like the one guy, you know, why are you there? You have this many disciplinary actions. You were fired from that many fucking departments. Why was that? You know, you can run a fucking background check on me. Why can't they run a background check on who the fuck they're hiring? You know, so whoever does the hiring, maybe they need to be held accountable. Why the fuck was this guy hired?

Why is the mayor not overseeing this shit? Why is the chief of police not seeing this shit? You know what I mean? It's your fucking people, right? But that's not happening. And then we also need accountability as civilians. I'm sorry, but if you're told to get your fucking hands up, then put your fucking hands up. Don't run away. Don't start digging through your car and shit. That's, I mean, they're going there already.

Already stress the fuck out hoping that they don't die, you know or get shot and so the minute you give them and you know You make them even more nervous They have to make a judgment call and we are humans and you're not always gonna make the right judgment call So if you fucked up own it just like we were talking about earlier you fucking own that you know if you get pulled over and

for speeding, you're not just digging around in all your shit when the cop comes up. You already know. It's all over the news. You know, put your fucking hands on the steering wheel. If you're a CCW, if you're carrying a concealed weapon, you go, hey, I just want to let you know I have a concealed weapon. It's right here on my pants or it's in that glove box. Are you sure you want me to reach in that glove box and get my fucking insurance out of there?

Sadly, on that specific instance, we saw Philando Castro, that very thing, and it's on tape where he said, "I've got a firearm in this location," identified it. And when going for his wallet, as instructed to by the police officer, he was open fired upon while there's a kid in the car and his wife sitting next to him. He died. That cop is not in jail. So I think we're failing on the accountability desperately.

I want to talk more about accountability before I do training specifically. You had said, you know, you went through millions of dollars of training and it took you how many years? I think you said it's going to take you three years from joining the military. If you want to be a SEAL, it's going to take you three years at a minimum to get out the door and go fight a war because you need that much training. Two and a half, three years.

You're from Florida, correct? I'm originally from Missouri. Missouri, okay. Well, speaking of training, and we invest very much in our military. And I think that's a good thing. We need to. Our police, not so much. Florida, the hour input it takes to become a street cop, 770 hours.

By contrast, to be a licensed interior designer in Florida, it takes 1,760 hours to get that license. California, high crime place, 664 hours to become a police officer, 1,600 hours to become a cosmetologist. North Carolina, very close to our state, 620 hours to become a police officer, 1,500 hours to become a licensed barber. So somewhere along the line, we as a society have...

said, and I think this affects the type of people we hire to protect us and to enforce the law, you don't need a lot of qualifications and not a whole lot of training. And for damn sure, I know, and I think they should, the police do not have to have any type of law training at all, but they're supposed to enforce something that they don't know anything about. That's a problem to me.

It's a problem to me that in North Carolina and in this state, it takes double, more than double the amount of hours to become a fucking barber than it does to walk around with a badge and a gun and to fuck with people's rights. I think that's absurd. And I don't see how anybody on any political side of any spectrum can't look at that and think that's fucking crazy. It's crazy. I think so.

I mean, I got nothing. I agree 100% with you. But, you know, what's going to have to happen is we can't defund them. How many hours did you say it takes? In North Carolina, 620 hours. Okay. Well, if you defund them, now it's going to take 310 fucking hours. And then it's going to get worse. And then we're going to defund them more. And it's going to be 155 fucking hours. And it's going to get even worse.

You're going to have to give them money. Yeah. If you want, just like anything in life, you get what you fucking pay for. And if you pay a person that you expect to protect your life and uphold the law, fucking minimum wage, you are going to get shit as a product. Let's look at budgets. I mean, the state police budget for North Carolina where it takes $600,000

20 hours become a cop. Their budget in 2019, there's a few line items here. I'm looking on the government's website, but it's several billion dollars. So I don't think it's a matter of that the money's not there. I think the money is being, just like with anything, just not being used very well. Yeah.

And I mean, that just kind of seems to come with the territory of being an American sometimes. You know, it's just the money, it seems to be in few hands. And I think a lot of it's going into unnecessary gear. A lot of it's going to settlements. A lot of it's going to their fuck ups. So.

The public can actually save themselves money by investing in more training. And I don't think it's also just a matter of, and let me know what you think here is, it's not just more training by frequency. It's also more comprehensive and the quality of the training. I mean, I'm not a cop. I've never been through the police training, but most of the guys I went to high school with are cops now. And I can tell you, they're not very bright. So I don't think,

policing in general, as it stands, attracts a model citizen. It's not a fun job. It's a low-paying job. But also, do you think power dynamic is a problem? Do you think just the very nature of being a police officer can... Do I think that the power can go to their head? Sure. Absolutely. I absolutely believe that. And anybody that doesn't can watch fucking Don Bradley's episode...

and see what happened there. And do you think the solution, you know, so we've kind of landed on, maybe for the camera, you can reiterate some of this, but they need more and better training. They need stricter accountability, and we can talk more about that too, you know. And I think we need getting, you know,

To be a Navy SEAL, that was not an easy selection process. You had to prove yourself in very demanding training. I don't think we do as much there with the police in terms that they'll take anybody, really.

In some states, having a criminal record doesn't disqualify you from becoming a police officer. That makes no fucking sense. Personally, I kind of get that because people do make mistakes. They might want to better themselves. But regardless, I think... So yeah, more training, accountability, and we need to have higher standards when we're hiring people. And...

If we find a bad cop, we need to be able to fire them and not have them tied up their cases in arbitration while the public is paying for it because they've got a big-ass police union behind them. And qualified immunity is a really... In its essence, I think, was a good thing. Like, you know, it essentially protected the police were performing within the line of their job. But...

It's become now just a blanket. So the cops seem to be getting, and I think that's why you see, I don't think that there would be over 10,000 demonstrations in all 50 states if there wasn't a problem. Because, you know, on one hand, we can't say that like,

Especially, you know, my age group and generation, like we're all, we're all fucking lazy and don't have the resolve to get any work done. But on the other hand, they're this like shadow cabal of fucking like really violent protesters that are just there to incite violence. I think that's bullshit. I participated in some of those protests. I did. Peaceful ones. And I can honestly tell you that

What we see on the news and what I have seen from my sister being a public defender and listening to her cases, my mother being a reporter, the cops fuck people up a lot unnecessarily. Not just murder. You know, we've been we've been talking about police killing people. You know, police brutality does extend beyond that. So, you know.

George Floyd was a prime case for that. In fact, Minneapolis had outlawed that very tactic. I think it's called the Courtoid Hold. I don't know if I'm pronouncing that correctly. But chokeholds and those things have been outlawed in many states, including this one. But they're still used. And when they're used and someone dies, there's a lawsuit that the public pays for through our taxes. But the police face no criminal charges. Do you think the police...

I guess my question on the accountability side of things is, have you, you know, you maybe don't have to name them specifically, but would you say there have been cases in the last few years where the police have been under the microscope where criminal charges weren't brought but probably should have been? I know if I shot someone in the back under any fucking circumstance, I'm going to prison. It'd take one hell of a defense attorney to get me out of that.

Yes, I do. You know, I agree with you. Now, at the same time, once again, there are scenarios where you may shoot somebody in the back where it's completely fucking justified. And I'm going to bring up that. I think it was Atlanta. That guy got shot. Was it McDonald's or some shit? Wendy's. Yeah, I saw. He took a fucking weapon out of a police officer's belt right there. You're done.

You don't think that fucking guy didn't know better than to pull a weapon out of that police officer's fucking belt? And then, yeah, he did. He got shot in the back, didn't he? Yeah. Did he get shot in the back? Mm-hmm. Okay, well, if I'm running away and I turn like this and point the gun at you and you shoot me in the fucking back, is that a justified shoot? According to court precedent, now I can only speak on...

The court cases that I've personally reviewed, my sister had a client whom a guy broke into her client's house, shot at him. He returned fire. As the guy was turning to flee, one of the rounds hit him in the shoulder. Her client is now in prison for attempted murder. Convicted.

That's the law. Do you think that's right? No, I don't. Especially in that instance, no. But if we're not going to extend that, if the law will not extend that to civilians... If I'm sitting right here and I pull a gun out of my pants and I go like this and I look this way and I start shooting at you, what are you going to do? I'm going to shoot at you. You're going to fucking kill me, aren't you? And I would go to jail, more than likely.

Maybe, maybe not. But I'm just saying that's a fucking justified shoot. I agree. But it seems that the law doesn't give civilians...

in similar situations the same benefit as it does the police. That's bullshit. I mean, you know, it's not right. And I think that's where a lot of the anger comes from. But, you know... And that guy in the Wendy's, I got to say, I agree with you there, but the dude did shoot a taser at the cop, a non-lethal weapon. Does that justify murder? Fuck yeah, it does. Really? Now, what if he would have fucking hit him with the taser

And now he's on the ground incapacitated. And then he takes the gun out of his belt and fucking kills him with that while he's tasing the guy. Some would say that's the job. There is no fucking way in hell I am going to let somebody take a fucking weapon out of my belt, shoot me with it, and hope, you know what I mean, that no way. Part of the job is to give your life away for fucking $30,000 a year. That is the oath that they take.

That is what they sign up for. And that's the thing is I think nobody signs up for that. And I think that's where what part of the oath says that it's different for each city. I think that's where some of the disconnect. I don't even give a shit about the oath. So I want to hear you actually say that. So I want to hear you say, I'm going to pull a taser out of your fucking belt. I'm going to shoot you with it.

And you're going to sit there and take it and hope that I don't yank the gun out of your belt and fucking kill you with it while you're incapacitated on the ground as I'm tasing you. You're not going to defend yourself because that's part of the job. From the perspective that I'm a police officer or from the perspective that I'm a civilian? Either one. From a civilian standpoint, I can't honestly say because I think what I would do in the moment, I don't know. Because things you stated, adrenaline and...

having to make split decisions, but I'm a civilian. I think where the disconnect comes from, and this may just be a matter of a younger generation having to learn some hard truths and that being, you know, police have been idolized in our culture, you know, since I've been a kid. There are movies about them. There's so much entertainment surrounded them, and the reason they have and have had so much

backing from the public is because, and same with the military, they're going to do the job that no one else has the fucking guts to do. And they're going to do the hard thing and the right thing, even if it may cost them their lives. That is why we respect these people. And there's a social contract that they're upholding and they're enforcing. And when the people that we look at to enforce the law, even in the most dire of circumstances, fail to do so,

The social contract breaks down and there is no rule of law anymore. I want to go back though. Let's go back. So you would let somebody tase you. You would let somebody take a weapon out of your belt, shoot you with it, incapacitate you to the point where you are unable to defend yourself and with the possibility of them yanking another weapon out of your belt and fucking killing you with it because that's the job?

Putting myself in that... Or would you fucking kill that person who's trying to kill you? I don't think that seeing a guy run away from me, pointing a taser at me, would indicate that he was trying to kill me. Seems he was trying to flee from me. And my partner's right there. It's not an easy situation. He yanked a weapon out of your belt. A fucking taser, Sean. A fucking taser. Do you know what happens when you get tased? I've been tased. You can't fucking move.

It's weird because police say they fail often and don't stop most people. I'm not going to take that fucking chance. Not a chance in hell. I mean, this is an interesting point because I think it, especially people like me, we have a different opinion on what we should expect from our men and women in law enforcement. And my expectations may be unrealistic. They may be.

But the law, the law, the thing that they're supposed to enforce, it says you cannot shoot someone in the back. Court precedent has held that over and over again. And until it's overturned, that's the fucking law. Marijuana is legal in many states. It's illegal here. It's the court precedent. That's the way the law works. Sucks, but that's the law.

I think that's hard to ignore. I mean, you're a police officer. You're here to enforce the law. You're not there to die because somebody fucking shot you. That cop wasn't gonna die. How do you know that? And where's the fucking accountability for this civilian? He's dead. Why did he fucking take a taser out of a fucking officer's belt? He took a, stole a weapon...

out of an officer's fucking belt. Yeah. Oh, no. I mean, it was... Where's that accountability? Like, everybody seems to skip over that. I do think that is fair. And what I would say to that is a couple of things. One, the guy was fucking super intoxicated. We do know that. And two, just the benefit that you give, you had said earlier, you know, about making split decisions. If you're being fucked with by the police and you don't want to be, are you going to defend yourself against the cops if you don't

Feel like you fucking want to go with him? Yeah, probably. So the same adrenaline, the same split, you know, second decision making, I think that becomes kind of a primal thing at that point. You know, I can't give you a good rate. Like, I'm not going to sit. I'm not defending the guy. I mean, he made a decision and that decision costed him his life. That's right. It did. He made a fucking decision and it cost him his life.

And if you think that grabbing a gun out of an officer's or a taser, which looks exactly like a gun when it's in the belt, out of a fucking officer's belt and try to shoot him with it is a good decision. I mean, that's fucking Darwinism, if you ask me. Yeah, now I hear you. I am not going to allow you to kill me because of a fucking law that says I can't shoot you in the back when you're shooting at me.

Not a chance in hell. And I don't think you would either. But here's, and yes, you're right. You are right. I agree with you. But the problem there is that the accountability, and we've seen this with civilians. Yeah, I'm not going to take that fucking chance and I am going to fucking kill you. But I will, but that choice that I make will more than likely land me in prison. For the police, it doesn't. That accountability breakdown right there doesn't make any sense.

Well, I mean, I think the only fucked up thing is that you would wind up in prison and they would not because you should not wind up in prison if that were the case. You're simply defending your fucking life. Well, I just, I think it is kind of, I mean, and you know this from being an instructor. I mean, the, oh man, like it's drilled into you. You know, I'm a new gun owner. Yeah.

They made it very clear, very, very, very clear that if you fucking use deadly force, you better be 110% certain that it's justified. Because if it's not, even just a little bit, you're probably fucked. And you will spend thousands of dollars and a good majority of your life trying to fight it to stay out of prison. The police have been in some pretty openly...

I'm not going to say question, I'm going to say bad shoots, clearly cold blooded murder. And they have walked. And I think that's why civilians are so pissed off. I mean, that I can understand. But these incidents that we just discussed, I just can't. I cannot jump behind the civilian mindset of you shouldn't have shot him. Like, I just can't. I can't. I have to fucking back the police on that one.

No way in hell I would have done anything different. Well, I wouldn't let the guy get to my fucking gun belt. But but you know what I'm saying? If he did and he was trying to shoot me with a taser and some and it was going to incapacitate me to the point where he could pretty much have his way with me. I would have defended my life. I want to come home to my wife.

I want to come home to my kids. I want to see my fucking parents again. And I'm not going to let that piece of shit take that from me. When all's he had to do is just fucking listen and deal with it later. Yeah. You know? And, you know, you'd ask, like, where's the accountability for, you know, obviously in that instance, where's the accountability for the civilian when he's dead? But moreover, there are resisting arrests, accountability, right?

Well, that was a resisting arrest. Sure. I mean. Sure. Fleeing. Another charge. If you look at any arrest record from somebody that the cops have roughed up, oh my God, it's a mile long. I mean, I can't even name them all, but there's a multitude of charges that they levy against someone when they resist arrest. It's not just resisting arrest. There are subcategories within that. So there is accountability for civilians in that regard.

The law is pretty clear. I mean, as a civilian, if you interact with the police and they tell you to do something and you don't do it, you either get arrested for resisting arrest or failure to comply, or you lose your life. There's really no middle ground. There's one in particular, one police shooting of a white man, actually, that really, it's kind of when I, it made me really take a step back and say, hey, I think there's a problem with the police.

And it's still out there. The police officer actually, I think it was like a month ago, was found not guilty of any charges. But it's, yeah, Daniel Shaver was his name. I would like you to watch this. Did they kill him? Did they cut that shit out finally? Yeah. So, I'm surprised they took that shit out.

But I've seen the video a ton of times. It's terrible. So there, you've got a civilian who's on his fucking knees. Mm-hmm. Crying. And their instructions are hard to follow. That's an impossible situation for a civilian. They were called there because... So that's in a hotel. They were called there because someone said they saw him waving a gun outside his hotel window. They were covered. No firearm. But...

They shot him on his knees. And you've got four or five officers with AR-15s aimed at this one guy on his knees. I don't see the fucking threat there, I guess. And after I saw that and the fact that that officer was, you know, it took forever to bring charges against him, but was not found guilty, that's a hard one for me to... I can't find any justification behind that. That a man weeping on his knees, I'm sure people can be good actors, but...

Younger guy weeping on his knees, crawling to you. Very stressful situation for the civilian at that point. Not a whole lot for the cop. You're surrounded by your team in a hallway. You have the tactical advantage in every regard there. The guy's on his fucking knees. Mm-hmm. And they put holes in him. And they walked. That, to me, looks like cold-blooded murder. That's a white guy. That's a white guy. So you can take the race factor out of it, you know? Mm-hmm.

I mean, does that seem like a good shoot to you? No. And so it's, I think, you know, from where you see these demonstrations happening and just the general distaste for police is that on one hand, yeah, you will see a questionable, tough situation like the guy, the Wendy's, who, yeah, probably shouldn't have fucking grabbed the taser out of the cop's pocket. Probably shouldn't have done that. Cost him his life. Well, not probably. Probably.

He should not have fucking done that. Oh, no, yeah, he shouldn't have done that, sure. But the public is no longer willing to give, you know, the benefit of the doubt to the police officer because of shit like that. That man executed that guy on his knees. He executed him. That's what he did. And he walked. And I'd be damned if he doesn't find another fucking agency to become a police officer at again. So...

I mean, I don't know what you want me to say to that. You know? No, sure. It's fucked up. It is fucked up. And that's... Well, I'm trying to put... So I'm trying to think... So I want to get you, like, a thing, a piece, like, kind of recapping what we've talked about. Like, shit like that should not happen. And when it does, that's where accountability should come in. That cop probably... In fact, I'm 100% certain should be tried for murder and convicted. It's on video. But he wasn't. And...

The public distrust seeing shit like that will only grow. And, you know, and this keeps happening. You keep seeing unarmed people. Again, you know, to wrap it back to some of the things we initially talked about, I do understand the police have a dangerous job. I do understand that. And just like, you know, when we had Travis in here, yes, like been some calls where, oh, my God, life was in danger. And then he had to go.

Deal with an old lady. But this narrative that the police are just walking in Yemen is just not fucking accurate. They're not. They're not in Yemen. They're not in Iraq. They're in fucking the U.S. of A. Yes, there is crime here. Yes, there is murder. Yes, there are dangerous people. But according to the FBI statistics, the police officers are not the target of that violence. They're not. Only 48 officers died of felonious acts.

41 of accidents not related to crime in any respect. 1,300 civilians killed. That's 10 times more. So I do not and will not...

agree with this narrative that the police are just constantly under, they're at war and that they are under fire all the time and that they're being hunted. It's just not fucking true. The data, there's no data to support that. Well, there is video footage of Los Angeles that just happened a couple weeks ago of a man that walked up to the vehicle and shot two fucking officers in the head, correct? Correct.

Yeah. So sometimes they are being hunted. Sometimes. Let's go back to Dallas, Texas. Do you remember that one? Yep. Yeah. Sometimes they are being hunted. And the guy who did that. What? Ex-police officer. Well, that doesn't, that doesn't, that doesn't even, that has nothing to do with it. But that made no sense. My point is they are in fucking danger. Am I saying all of them are in danger? No. Am I saying the guy that you just showed me was in danger? No.

Am I saying, you know, I'm not, I can't fucking, I'm not, I'm not even trying to excuse all of them. What I am saying is sometimes these guys fucking deserve the benefit of the doubt, you know, and that particular instance, no, you know, he doesn't, but you know, and there are some places that are like a war zone. There are, if you look at the fucking statistics of Chicago and Detroit and St. Louis, uh,

There were more murders there than there were fucking dead in Afghanistan. So that is just as bad as a fucking war zone. But those murders weren't carried out against police. They were carried out among Chicago specifically is usually inner city gang violence, you know, rival gang members, not police, mostly civilians, you know, bystanders getting killed. What happens when you interject yourself into a situation like that?

It's tough shit. Right? Yeah. The violence gets directed at you. That's what happens. If you interject yourself into that situation, then so maybe it is. Maybe we do. Maybe we defund them and we pull them out of all of the neighborhoods that don't want them. And they'll just sort it out. I think that would go poorly. I think that would go extremely fucking poorly. But sometimes, you know, maybe the best thing to do is just

Let people live in what the fuck they created. Yeah. No, I agree with that. Give them what they want. You don't want any police? You won't get any. None. So look, you know, kind of recapping the police topic. This is all really good, man. So I think we can all admit there is a problem. We are definitely seeing interactions between civilians and police becoming more violent and more lethal. It's just statistically happening. And there are

In 2019, 55 unarmed people, unarmed, shot dead by police. By contrast to, you were asking for this percentage, but how many interactions the police actually have with civilians on a day-to-day basis, yeah, that's probably a small margin of error. But 55 lives doesn't seem so small when you look at it that way, to me at least. Yeah.

It is a fucking dangerous job. It is, you know, and like I'm not trying to excuse all of them by any fucking means, but the police do a lot of good shit too. And that nobody ever looks at the good they do. They never do. All they look at is the bad 55 people. I hate to tell you that is a fucking very, very small number. And, you know,

Unfortunately, fucking people die. They do. Sometimes they die, you know? And I'm not saying that's excusable, but it's never going to be perfect. It is never going to be perfect, and 55 people is a very fucking small number when you look at the grand scheme of people, of how many people live in the U.S. It was like 314 million or some shit, I think. And so 55 people out of 314 million people

What's that percentage? It's never going to be perfect. I'm sorry. It's just never going to be fucking perfect. That number is pretty fucking close to perfect. I would say that, you know, the total death count being, you know, 1,300, yeah, that margin of error is pretty low. But, and yeah, by numbers, yes, 55 is low. There's always room for improvement. And there's definitely improvements that need to be made. A hundred and fucking 10%. I'm with you on that.

There's no doubt. There's always room for improvement. They need more. We need to hold them accountable. You know what I mean? When things are fucked up. Hold them accountable in what way? I want to hear specifically on that. I mean, that guy, the video that you showed me, I mean, that guy needs to be tried. Now, you know, and even commenting on that video, I don't know the fucking context of

Of what happened before that. I don't know if there were more people in the room. I don't know. And I'm not saying that excuses them anyways, because chances are it doesn't. But but yeah, I mean, be held accountable in one way in the same way they fucking hold civilians accountable.

That's the way they need to be held accountable. But, you know, you can't fucking tell me that shooting somebody in the back isn't fucking justified, you know, under certain circumstances. That's just not true. It's not fucking true. And, you know, they do have a dangerous job. They have an extremely dangerous job. They need more training how to conduct business doing that kind of a job. And, yeah.

And we don't give them enough credit either for what they do. I don't believe we give them enough credit. I also don't believe we hold certain ones accountable, you know, to the standard they need to be held accountable to. Yes, there's a problem. And here are the core problems. One, you know, training and accountability. And the solution to this problem is, you know, accountability.

well, increased training, but like the quality and caliber and type of training and accountability as a system as stringent as our military. I just think it should almost be more, you know? Like, it really is fucked up, maybe just because I'm so far removed from it, but it does not bother me one bit to think that, you know, we probably shot some unarmed people in fucking Iraq because we sent you over there to fucking go to war.

We did that. Our country fucking sent you there to go to combat. Different fucking ballgame. We're running around fucking Nashville. Like, shit me, man. Like, it's a different place under different circumstances with a different mission. You're absolutely right, but I'm telling you, like, the context. You have to take the context. I'm saying the context is in your favor, not the cops'.

That's what I'm saying. The context of being in Iraq at war, fucking up there makes sense. Routine traffic stop in a city you fucking work the beat on every day and you shoot a dude several times. It turns out he's unarmed. I don't know. Context seems to be kind of... Yeah. It would make sense to me if you walked up to...

car that you don't know if there's a fucking bomb in there or whatever and you would expect that type of thing because of where you're at but I don't think you can expect the same type of Lethality from you know your everyday American civilian. No you can't from your everyday American civilian but if you know if you're responding to a fucking violence of domestic violence call in Antioch where there's a murder every fucking night

That's different than responding to petty theft. Green Hills. Is it not? It's fucking way different. And you are interjecting yourself into a domestic violence call and you're getting shot at. Now you're at war. It's the same fucking thing. I don't know many domestic dispute calls and domestic violent calls that end with the police getting shot at.

well i'm not i'm just i'm just it's context i'm just giving you context you have to take into consideration where this is happening and where it's not happening you don't hear this happening in areas where there's a low crime rate you hear this happening in areas where there's a high crime rate correct generally yeah when there's a high crime rate the ball game changes that's just they have to i mean they have to protect themselves as well

And so, you know, I kind of want to wrap this thing up, but, you know, I don't think that demonizing police is the right thing to do. That's why I want to know this percentage. If the percentage is 0.5%, which is probably even less than that, I'm really willing to bet it's less than that. You cannot demonize an entire fucking...

police force for 0.5%. You just can't do it, you know? And because you just chop the legs off of every other fucking cop out there who's trying to do good. And a lot of them are doing good. You know, we had a guy email. He is under indictment because he responded to a call where a man drowned

I believe his six-year-old daughter, held her underwater. I think they estimated like three or four minutes. And in Missouri, Kansas City, Missouri, he fucking drowned his kid in a pond in the middle of December below freezing. That officer showed up and saved that little girl's life. The only way he saved her life is, you know, kids, when they drown in this cold water, they're easily revived. But she was fucking dead. He saved her.

And then he knocked the shit out of the guy for drowning his fucking kid because his emotions got the best of him. Guess what? That dude's being held accountable for beating the shit out of that guy. For saving a fucking girl and slapping a dude who drowned a six-year-old girl. It's weird how that works. That's pretty fucked up, isn't it? So, anyways, what I'm saying is you cannot demonize an entire fucking... an entire occupation for, you know...

the point whatever percent that's bad. You have to reinforce the good and discipline the bad. And as civilians, we are not holding ourselves accountable. It is unacceptable to yank a weapon out of a cop's belt. If you are being

Called upon, but, you know, if police are responding to you because of a domestic thing, a domestic violence or whatever the fuck it is, you don't fuck around and dig around in your car. If they tell you to put your hands up, you put your fucking hands up and that's it. And you deal with it later. You know, you need to, as civilians, you need to hold yourselves accountable. And that's not happening. That is not fucking happening. You know, Ed Calderon was just here, talked about a...

protester in Portland who threw a Molotov cocktail at a fucking cop, but he missed and the fucking thing set his own leg on fire. Who saved his ass? The fucking cop saved his ass, didn't he? There's some good. You want to go protest? Go ahead. Let me put your fucking leg out. Then you can throw another fucking Molotov cocktail at me. Fuck you. You know? Nobody's talking about this shit. It's only the bad. And...

that's making more dangerous but um but uh and then lastly you know i think uh defunding is is is the wrong thing to do and and you've said it too you know it's the wrong phrase you need to they need to uh redirect the budget to where it needs to go and they need to hold the

Others, they need to hold the politicians accountable as well. Not just the fucking beat cop that's on the street trying to do his job and made a fucked up judgment call. Who's going to pay? Or maybe he's not going to pay. I don't know. But you cannot just hold him accountable. Not when there's a fucking record. You know, you got to hold a lot more accountable than that. And and that's not happening either.

So, you know, I think a updated budget on where the funds are being spent is extremely important. I think accountability to the police is also important. And I also think accountability to the fucking civilians is also important. And, you know, if you're not willing to take accountability for your actions, then you're just a fucking piece of shit. Other than that, I don't know what else to say.

It's good shit man. That's really good shit. Especially that... Yeah, um, absolutely. It's really good shit. And it's true. It's all true.

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