Giannis' Injury, Knicks-Celtics, Playoff Seeding Possibilities, and the MVP Race 01:20:25

And now, The Low Post. Welcome to The Low Post podcast. It's Thursday afternoon.

And it's never good news when we have Jeff Stotts from InStreetClothes and Smart Injury Analytics on the pod. My go-to source for whenever someone falls in a game, whenever something bad happens in a game, I go to him. He's got the database. He's got the knowledge. He's got the athletic training background. And obviously we're on here talking two days after Giannis Attentacumpo in a Milwaukee blowout win over the Celtics, a win that the Bucs really needed.

Crumpled to the floor, non-contact injury, was kind of jogging and just fell and sat and grabbed his left calf and walked off under his own power. You know, needless to say, on a human level, I think we were all a little scared, to be honest, because we know what that injury kind of looks like. On a basketball level...

It's not a stretch to say that this is a seismic event that could swing the entire NBA championship picture as uneven as the Bucs have been. I still think at full health, and who knows if we'll ever get the Bucs at full health, they are still the team, maybe the only team, positioned to challenge Boston in a seven-game series. I would pick Boston. I'd pick Boston to win the title all season. I think Boston's better. But you simply cannot discount a team with Giannis as an MVP candidate averaging 30-11 points.

at the head of it. And look, well, let's just start here. Jeff Stotts, what in the world is a soleus? And why have I not heard this word in my life until two days ago? And am I even saying it right? You nailed it, man. It sounds great. So

The thing with the soleus injury specifically is you probably have seen it or covered this type of injury. It's just been called a calf strain because the calf is a muscle complex and it's made up of multiple muscles. We see this a lot with a lot of the injuries and the way they're reported. The hamstrings are not one muscle.

or not one muscle, it's multiple muscles. The quad, four muscles. The rotator cuff, multiple muscles. The groin, multiple muscles. We just kind of call them a groin strain or a hamstring strain. So we probably had a lot more soleus strains than we realize. They've just been called a calf strain.

But the Bucks did us a little bit of a favor, at least guys like me who like tracking this kind of thing, and specified which muscle was involved. So the soleus is the smaller of the two. When you look at the calf, the big, thick, meaty part when you see, that's the gastrocnemius. It's a two-headed muscle. It crosses the knees, so it plays a role in knee function. The soleus sits underneath that.

and attaches to the underside of the knee. And it's actually involved in making sure you can stand up straight so you don't sway forward when you're standing. So they have a shared conjoined tendon, which you're well aware of, and that would be the Achilles. So the calf muscles all share that tendon that attaches to the heel. And that's the one everyone was fearing when Giannis went down. And we saw him kind of grab the back of that leg there in a non-contact injury.

So I did the thing that I don't like doing, which is I Googled soleus strain and calf strain, and I would never actually use what I found as gospel. I was just sort of curious. And then you have to make sure you're looking at a credible website like Mayo Clinic check, Cornell Health check, somethingrandom.com.org, maybe not.

And obviously, as is the case with most of these things, there are different grades and severities and some strains have fiber tearing in them and some don't. Some are, I guess, are complete ruptures of something or other. Can you explain in vague terms what separates one strain from a tear, a strain from a strain, and what it seems like sort of this might be and what the timetable typically is?

So anytime you hear the term tear or pull, basically that's a strain. It's just what degree, what grade. So a low-grade strain is microfiber damage. So muscle fibers are a lot like fiber optic cable or a rope where it's made up of individual fibers. For a low-grade strain, we're talking about maybe less than 10% or even no damage to the fibers, but some overstretching of those microfibers.

It's going to be intact, but there is some overstretching and some damage done. A grade two, better known as an incomplete or partial tear, that is where we're having a significant amount of true fibers torn. So you'll get some actual damage to those fibers. It can lead to significantly more loss of function, more pain, more swelling. And then depending on the muscle, grade three or higher is often a complete tear or a rupture where you're

the muscle itself is torn. And now we're talking significant injury, significant loss of function, potentially surgery, depending on the muscle to repair those fibers. So that's kind of your basic, basic what we're looking at given kind of what we know, which, which is limited at this point, we know it doesn't involve the Achilles. They we've, we've seen multiple reports say that the Achilles does seem to be intact, which is a very good thing because the,

When you saw Giannis grab, he kind of grabbed near that mild tendinous juncture where the muscle belly, the muscle itself kind of transitions to the tendon. And I was...

Crossing my fingers it was not a kid. That was a stomach drop. I was watching that game live as it happened, and Stephanie Reddy was doing a sideline report. And you always feel for those sideline reporters when they've done this reporting off the camera to get this interesting thing to say. And while they say it, something massive happens during a game, and you're just like, okay, that's over. And so that is what I'll always remember. And then you just spend the rest of the night

Texting waiting on the tweets and just you can't focus on watching a game because this is one of the gods of the game. I mean, so your stomach your stomach drops when anyone gets hurt. But this one obviously has implications in 45 different directions depending on what it is. And you're right. They have for now they have ruled out Achilles.

Yeah. And here's the thing is this is a little bit secret for you that are following this and really worried. If it's an Achilles, they know pretty quickly. There is a simple manual test we do. It's called the Thompson test. You squeeze the calf. And if there is a tear, the foot doesn't move. So it just kind of sits there. But if it's intact, even if it's partial tear, you'll get some kind of movement. It's really wild to see.

So and then at that point, MRI is just confirmation. So a lot of times in those cases, the report started to trickle out pretty quickly that they fear an Achilles injury, those kinds of things. The fact that we didn't hear that early on. And then, in fact, the bucks came out pretty quickly and said, solely a strain made me feel a little bit better about what this was going to be long term. We still haven't heard the degree of which Giannis's injury is actually real.

in this case, but my guess is it's a low-grade strain, kind of the optimism that we've seen, which looking through the numbers, the average time loss is about two weeks, which would put him kind of potentially missing first two games of a first-round series, maybe a little bit longer. This situation reminds me a lot of Luka Doncic's situation a couple years back, right before Dallas went on that run at the Western Conference Finals. He was injured, I believe, in the last game of the season. He was not supposed to play. The technical got rescinded. He played defensively.

He strained that calf. And then Jalen Brunson went supernova against Utah to start that series. And he came back and they had a 2-1 lead. And that was kind of the same thing. We were really worried. And Luka missed about, I believe, 13 days there. So that's kind of the comps and where I've got in my head right now and hoping that's the case for Giannis moving forward for sure. Now, if that's the case...

You know, it would be, I think, 11 days from date of injury to game one of the playoffs, maybe 12, depending on which day of the week, Saturday or Sunday, the Bucs start on. And Giannis has been a superhuman healer in the past. I mean, we all remember the Hawks conference finals when his knee buckled. You were like, oh, well, that could be it. And it's like, no, I'll just like miss a very like a game or two and I'll be back. I'm fine. I'm made of titanium.

So you never know. Um, it could be again on this timeline that you're suggesting. It could be game four, game three, game five of the first round series. And look, the bucks right now are second. They are not locked into second. Uh, the projection systems have them very optimistically in second, but the projection systems don't know that Giannis is hurt and all they did beat Orlando, uh, without Giannis two nights ago, the night after the injury. Um,

They have Oklahoma City and Orlando again, two teams that may really want to win these games. If they go 0-2 in these games, the Knicks, who are playing Boston tonight in a big game, we'll record the second part of this podcast after that, could jump the Bucs into number two. I mean, everything is in flux in the East, but my long story short is whether they're 2-3 or

There's some chance you're looking at Philly or Miami. It more likely Philly if they're three, the 60 and 70 is all in flux, but you could be looking at like a, like a, a team with some pedigree and some threat level to it in the first round and

And if you go down 2-0, like the Mavs hung in that series against Utah more than hung in without Luka. And he comes back and they just wipe away the Jazz. You go down 2-0 to a team like that, you're like far behind. I mean, this happened with Embiid against the Heat in the 2022 playoffs when he missed the first two games. They go down 2-0. You play him even after that. Doesn't do you any good. You're out. You lose 4-2.

And the implications of that could be seismic for a team that went pretty much all in with whatever it had left. And Drew Holiday is sitting there on your rival and Damian Lillard's on your team and it hasn't gone as planned. So what are they? My question then would be, what are they looking for between now and green lighting him to come back whenever it is, if it happens?

You definitely want full strength and full range of motion. Those are the things we focus on first, especially with dorsiflexion. So the ability to move the foot up, because that is a big indicator for a lot of our ankle and our other injuries along the kinetic chain of that leg.

You're going to want to have him do some sports. Slow down, slow down, slow down. Remember who you're talking to. So you said a big indicator for the ankle and other injuries on the kinetic chain of that leg. So to me and my brain, that means if this thing ain't right, those other things could be exposed to being maybe more vulnerable. Give yourself more credit. You got it. So we're talking about the calf.

going up the kinetic chain to the hamstrings, which he has had a history of hamstring injuries on this site this season. He's missed some time with a hamstring tendinopathy, I believe is what they called it. And then he's had some other injuries in the past, some soft tissue injuries there as well. So you want to make sure that that is all working because again, the reason we call it the kinetic chain is if there is a weak link in the chain, the whole chain is affected. So we're trying to make sure we're not

his risk for an injury someplace else along the kinetic chain. You know, and then for a guy like Giannis, it's explosive. You need to make sure that he can load that muscle, do the things that he needs to do, jump, run,

dunk without there any kind of hesitation, without any kind of pain. If you recall earlier in the year, they had him working out pregame and he kind of did a move and then you saw him wince and he kind of, I think that was basically them kind of doing him through some sports specific testing to see if he was ready to go. And that was a clear indication that he wasn't. So, you know, I have a lot of respect for Scott Faust and his staff up there in Milwaukee. I think they're going to make sure they do everything they can to make sure he's healthy. I think they'll,

Obviously, green light him if he hits all their checkpoints. And if they don't feel comfortable putting him out there, they're not going to. You kind of have to hope maybe Dame and Middleton can put something together for them for a long period of time and just buy him as much time. Again, if they can jump out to a 2-0 lead, maybe that buys Giannis some more time or even a split. Maybe that means that he can have a couple more days off to rest and recuperate.

So when you say testing this and that, I assume there are baseline tests, physical tests. I don't know what they would be like. Describe something that he's going to do to test something in the next 10 days. So that they might have what we call force plates where they literally stand on there and jump and it measures the amount of force generated. They might have baseline measurements for that before the season started, as the season progressed. I know some teams do certain measurements throughout the year on tendon strength and things like that just to ensure that everybody's

healthy and feeling good. And there's no change in any kind of those structures. So yeah, I think they're going to have a whole plethora of information to utilize to get a good gauge on the health of Giannis at any point along the recovery line. And again, it's very fluid. It might change day to day. He might feel good one day, looks good. And he comes in and he's sore and stiff the next day. And okay, that we got to readjust our timeline based on some of that subjective information that comes from the player.

Last question. You mentioned previous issues. I'm looking at now. March 17th, he missed a game against the Suns with left hamstring soreness. March 4th is the game you're referring to in warm-ups, I think, against the Clippers.

The AP report of that game says, quote, I actually don't know if the Bucs listed it as left Achilles tendonitis or exactly where that description came from. They may push back today and say, no, it was a calf that was misreported as Achilles, whatever it is. The A word is in the AP report. My question is this.

As soon as this happened, lots of the media flashed back to 2019 when Kevin Durant suffered a calf injury against the Houston Rockets in the conference semifinals, grabbed his leg, said he felt like someone kicked him and, and, you know, everyone feared the worst. And, and it turned out it was a calf injury. And then he's out, he's out, he's out. Everyone's sort of wondering, um,

Is he going to be able to come back? Is he healthy enough to come back? Does his leg feel healthy enough? He comes back in game five of the NBA finals and after looking very good at the beginning of game five of the NBA finals, tears his Achilles in the same leg and misses a year.

You said the word kinetic chain earlier. No two situations are equivalent. I literally have no idea. I just wanted to ask an expert instead of asking a non-expert. Is that a reason for concern given these prior issues he's had in a couple of these games? Or is this just people fearing the worst and speculating wildly?

So I think it would be completely unwise to say no, right? Like they always not going to affect anything. You know, there's not been a huge direct correlation between a calf strain and an Achilles tear. I looked through over 300 calf strains in my database before we talked and then looked through the 20 plus Achilles tendon tears I've had and I

Durant was the only one that had a calf strain in the same season prior to tearing that Achilles. We're looking at guys like Kobe, Wes Matthews, Dwight Powell, JJ Barea, all those recent Achilles tears that we've had in season. The tendonitis is what worries me maybe a little bit more than the soleus strain, just because that does indicate there's some potential issues with the tendon, whether that is inflammation or some micro-tendon tearing. If it's something like a tendinopathy, and I say tearing, I mean just some general issues

something's not right with the tendon. Um, and I had Achilles tendonitis as well for him in that game or when the game was written down. So, I mean, that was in my database as well. Um,

So I think it's not something you can ignore. I don't necessarily think his risk is substantially higher. I do think there is a red flag and you have to take everything into consideration. And look, I say that knowing there are a ton of intrinsic factors, both internal and external, that can influence the health of the Achilles tendon.

There are certain antibiotics that can make you susceptible to an Achilles tear. You know, footwear can do it. All these kinds of different factors come into play. What you're trying to do with a guy like Giannis is you're trying to mitigate the risk and you do everything you can with, with your performance team to, to reduce that risk.

He does have a degree of risk now that he's got multiple injuries on that leg. I mean, there's just no way to ignore that. But does it mean that he's likely to tear an Achilles? I would say no. And I would say his risk is elevated but not drastically elevated, nothing that I would necessarily be overly worried about if he went out and played.

Jeff Stotts, just invaluable. The knowledge, the resource. Follow him at InStreetClose on what is now called X. I just, I learn a lot and it's good perspective. And it's also a reminder. I mean, Bob Myers was talking about it on the broadcast of Nuggets Wolves last night. Like the healthiest team wins. Like we don't, it's, it's, it's,

It's not a pleasant topic to talk about and it's not, it's in a lot of ways kind of obvious and dumb, but like health is going to be a variable every year and knock on wood.

Giannis comes back sooner rather than later. Bucks are in position to not far behind the eight ball and give it an honest run and see what happens. But I appreciate the insight as always, my friend. Not a problem. You can have me on to talk MVP or any kind of awards or anything. You don't have to have me on to talk injuries. That's for sure. I'm always going to be the harbinger of doom. No, no, no. You're the harbinger of knowledge. Jeff Stotts, everybody. Thank you, sir. Appreciate you.

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Alright, it's 9.30 Eastern Time. The Boston Celtics just got destroyed by the Jalen Brunson mid-range machine. Big Body Brunson, as Perk liked to call him. 39 points on 15 of 23 shooting. Lit up. Everyone in the Celtics threw at him. Second straight loss for the Celtics.

They got blown out, kind of blown out by the Bucs the other day. Not kind of, blown out by the Bucs in Milwaukee the other day. Sad a couple people. They had a five-game winning streak before that. And before that, they had the mini two-game losing streak baseball series to the Hawks. That's four losses in the last, I don't know, 10, 12 games. For the Celtics, that amounts to something unusual. And the New York Knicks, with this win...

Make it very likely that they will stick in, in the two, three part of the bracket opposite Boston and put a little pressure on the Milwaukee bucks for the two seed. The Knicks last two games are home to Brooklyn, home to the bulls, probably going to win both of those. If they want to, that'll get them to 50 wins. The bucks have the tiebreaker over the Knicks, but they have a relatively tough schedule going down the stretch. Not the last two games at Oklahoma city at Orlando. Uh,

You know, if they stumble, if they go 0-2, the two-seed is there for the Knicks. Moe Tickeel of The Athletic, of Bleacher Report, of One Moe Thing, of Twitch, which I don't understand, formerly of the Clippers and the Spurs video room. How are you? I'm doing great, man. This is the best time of the season where it's – I feel a little bit like Charlie Day from Always Sunny in Philadelphia trying to figure out the standings.

And right now, I think the last few days, we're beginning to – right, the cork board. Okay, who has the tiebreaker? If it's a three-way tie, what's the tiebreaker? Four-way tie, oh, crap. And at a certain point, I just give up and I go like, they'll let me know. I'll give up. We are recording this about 30 minutes before tip-off of a very important Pelicans-Kings game that impacts the race for – some of the big questions we're going to get to are –

Can the Suns get out of 7th and up to 6th? Can the Lakers get out of 9th and up to 8th? Both of those questions will be impacted by what happens in the next three hours. In that game, we are recording this...

24 hours ahead of a massive Friday night. I believe every single team plays on Friday. And some of the headliner games are Orlando, Philadelphia is probably the biggest game of the night. Well, maybe not. There's also Indiana, Cleveland is a big one. And Phoenix, Sacramento to round out the night is a huge game for all the reasons we just discussed. But look, we're going to start with Knicks Celtics and the Knicks game.

increasing their chances very heavily of getting third outside chance at second and the Bucks obviously just lost Giannis Antetokounmpo to a calf injury I just had Jeff Stotz on to talk about that

Everything hinges on that for the Bucs and when he can come back. But hovering over all of that, the two, the three, the six, the seven, is where is Philadelphia going to end up? And can they get to sixth? Step one for them is winning out. And winning out happens to hurt Orlando if they beat Orlando tomorrow night. All of this is a mystery. And Philly seems like a team you'd very much like to avoid. Where do you want to start on Celtics? I guess I'll just start here.

Are you worried at all about the Celtics? Do you just chalk this up to late season malaise? They're sitting guys almost every game. Tonight they played the full gang and got shellacked at home. Any of this concerning to you or are you just like, let's wake me up in the playoffs?

I think I'm now more on the wake me up in the playoffs. Listen, they're up 13 and a half games right now in the standings. I mean, like they're going to win the East by, you know, a gazillion games. And at that point, like, I'm not going to panic too much about,

about this yeah there were things i didn't like in this game tonight against the knicks but i think it has to do more with just the knicks really needed this win more than the celtics beyond the standing stuff they hadn't beaten the celtics at all this season if they have any aspirations of of at some you know hey we're gonna make the finals you want to at least have one win against the team that's on top of the east and have some sort of uh confidence against them and i think that was kind of

The deal there, but it is interesting that they did play everybody. They brought out those starters. They came out, really looked like they wanted to try to get this win. And then once it looked like it wasn't going to happen, you can kind of just feel it sort of peel back. And for them, it started to fall off. And I'm not going to worry about them at this point. I'm not worried either. We know this team's going to hit another gear the minute the real games start.

That's just human nature. They know what their gear is. They're going to hit it when it matters. I will say it's interesting, you know,

There will be noise about a little bit of noise won't be much, but there'll be some media like, Hey, are you guys getting rusty? Is like the, is, is the kind of looming specter of the playoffs is getting in your heads at all because they've addressed pretty head on, particularly Joe Missoula. Like we're going to be under pressure this year and I want us to enjoy the pressure and live with the pressure, but the pressure is, is going to be there. And again,

They're not going into the playoffs playing their best. I don't think it matters, but they'll be asked about it. And there's this sort of self-fulfilling cycle that starts when you're asked about it. But I think they'll be fine. The one thing I'll say is...

The first signs that their playoff run last year was going to be a little wobblier than anticipated came on defense. And it came after they took a 2-0 lead over the Hawks in the first round. And the Hawks kind of blazed their way back into that series. The Celtics, A, had no answer for Trae Young. And B, started conflicted.

But committing the kind of miscommunication, sloppy errors that are not characteristic of their team, a team that really for all the hullabaloo about their offense and it's deserved, their baseline, their floor every single night is we should be damn near the best defensive team in the league other than Minnesota, who's been number one. Definitely the best defensive team in the East. I'm not worried about their defense.

on defense, their schemes on defense, their communication on defense. The one thing I am worried about is they were 16th in defensive rebounding since March 1st coming into this game. This game with the Knicks just brutalizing them on the boards is going to drop them lower than that. They do play small. I think one of the big decisions they're going to face in the playoffs is how often to play Horford and Porzingis together.

And when you're getting mauled on the boards, that's one thing you can do. But I'm not worried. They're still my pick to make the finals. I don't even know who I would say would push them the hardest. I'll tell you, Mo, I don't have a ballot this year. I'm still deciding the awards and writing my columns. I've written seven of the nine awards tentatively. I have drafts. The only two I've left unwritten are MVP and the three all-NBA teams.

And I've had Jason Tatum and Pencil in the fifth spot for All-NBA. There's been a few guys hovering in Pencil. Anthony Davis is there. Kawhi Leonard was there. He's fallen off a little bit. Kevin Durant was there. He's fallen off a little bit. Both those guys will be on my All-NBA teams. Tatum was the one name really left in Pencil.

There's a reason I don't do this column until the end. It might be Jalen Brunson. Like Jalen Brunson has made about as strong a case. I mean, his last year, 39 tonight, 45 the other day against Chicago, 43 against the Bucks who eat torches, 35 against the Bulls, 35 against the Kings, 61 a few weeks, a couple weeks ago against the Kings, against the Spurs rather. That was the Wembley 40-20 game.

And if you play drop defense on him, like the Celtics do, he's just, he's just going to torture you. Like there's no way around it. He has had, it's one of the best stories of the last few years is what's happened with Jalen Brunson. He's just incredible.

I mean, he had 39 tonight at three quarters. Like that's, you know, and that's, this is a good defensive team with, you know, across the board. It's white holiday Brown and, and Tatum all can give him problems in that sense. And that's just impressive. I mean, there's no reason why not to have him in the top five. Like when you started talking about your ballot said, yeah, like he should be in the top five. I think he should be number five, but he's had consistency all year. I think he's just been,

unbelievable this entire season for the Knicks and the way he's kind of held on. And you talked about it. You just said it when you're in drop coverage against him, it's a problem. I just don't think you can play drop against him. I think you got to try to find a way to really pressure him and, you know, really get at him, but he's got a nice craftiness to his game. He's got some great little, uh,

It's not like explosive dribbles, but the ball handling in the way, like against Chicago, he had a really nasty in and out dribble that got him to the cup for a layup and things like that, where it's just sort of like, wow, like that's kind of the thing where you're just looking at it going like he's got all the moves with it. Like for me, I look at it and I just say like,

If he's on anybody's MVP ballot, that's perfectly fair. It's not going to be one of those things where I'm going to be like, oh, that's a bit of a breach. That's legitimately a fair assessment for him to be anywhere in the top five. I love this Knicks team. I absolutely love watching them play. They're tough and mean and physical as hell.

but they're not ugly to watch. They play fast. When the Stan Van Gundy nailed it tonight, when you miss, they play fast. When you make, they're going to just do the next thing and just out physical you. And they shoot threes. They're tenacious defensively. They're starting to work in Bogdanovich more yet. He had a little bit of a mini heater tonight at some point in the game, Mitchell Robinson looks a little gas pretty quickly, but he's, he's still a monster on the boards and rounds out their rotation. So,

And Ananobi looks great for a guy. I mean, I know on the broadcast they said Tibbs has been talking about how he's not in the right rhythm yet. He looks great to me. And I've said since the Randall injury, I still think they can make the conference finals if the matchup breaks right. And from there, they might be drawing dead against Boston because they just don't quite have enough oomph scoring-wise without Randall to get over the hump against a team that good. They're playing like a team with a lot of oomph. And, man, I've been talking just randomly with a few guys

team executives about X, Y, and Z lately just shooting the breeze. And a couple of them have brought this up unprompted and said, hey, do you think the Knicks have gotten enough credit for how they've built this team and how they're set up going forward? And I actually thought one of them was...

kind of leading, like the question was leading and implying that he thought the Knicks had gotten too much credit and it was all blown up. And it was the opposite. It was like, they haven't gotten enough credit. They are so well set up going forward. This front office has done a brilliant job. This team is really...

Joy is not a word I would associate with Tom Thibodeau. This team is like a joy to watch. They're awesome to watch, and they are going to come to kick the shit out of you every game, and you better bring it every game or they are going to kick the you-know-what out of you. I mean, they... It's...

The second quarter of this game tonight is kind of like the illustration where they just really broke the game open. And it was McDonavich going on the heater, but they were playing so incredibly fast. They were even running on makes this time. And it was really kind of just go, go, go. And everybody was on point with everything that they have. This is a really fun Knicks team. Like this is one of those Knicks teams where you're like, yeah, I enjoy watching them. The OG move was so big for them.

You know, just, just the sense of we're, we're really stepping up and leveling up what he brings defensively. He had a nice little play in the first quarter where he played the passing lane and got a steal off of a Derek white trying to hit Jalen Brown. And it was an easy dunk. He was,

aggressive in that end the way he's kind of fit in offensively with this squad like I think there's just a lot to love with it I think you have guys like Josh Hart who's been doing a great job really distributing the ball lately in the past like 15 games I'd say and I'm just saying like everything you're seeing with this squad it's like okay their offense which normally I used to

crush tips for, for the team offense has looked solid. Like he's got some real good stuff that they're running and mixing in. And it also helps having again, Jalen Brunson sort of doing everything, but even Genzo playing off of it, uh, but Donovan slowly finding his way. Like, I think there's a lot to love with this next team. And I think this is just the start. Cause I do love the way they're built. I think, you know, they're, they're going to be in a position to really kind of continue to build out this roster and, and,

Hopefully eventually become a contender because it's fun when the Knicks are contenders. When they had everybody in January and just never lost, they were the rare team that rarely do you see a team lose

that could make the finals and i think that's how good they were i think it would have been a long shot for them like proverbial punchers chance against boston but you never know boston suffers an injury in the middle of the playoffs something they get upset in the second round before you see who knows i i thought their ceiling was that high on both ends of the floor and rarely do you see a team finals ready and also by their own admission both verbally and of their

draft assets and cap sheet not fully formed like not the team that they wish to be in two three and four years and boy they teams better bring it against them like you can't slip up against these guys I don't care if you're the Celtics you can't slip up against these guys I think at full health and I've said this for since the Anadolu trade I think they were the biggest threat to Boston fully healthy and

When Randall got hurt, I just didn't. I think Milwaukee passed them in that category, but Milwaukee has not been able to get out of its own way, has not been able to catch a break health-wise, and now has this Giannis thing where,

You know, and we're just I mean, I talked about it with just that we're just we're just going to have to see. I mean, obviously, if he's out for for a full playoff series, they're in dire jeopardy of losing it. If he's out for multiple playoff series, they are not going to get out of multiple playoff series. If he's ready for game one and like knowing Giannis is cyborg level healing, maybe he might be.

Before we get to the Bucs, what did you think of the other big Celtics news this week? It was Drew Holiday, four-year, $130 million extension, declining his player option and lowering his salary by $7 million for next year, which is huge for Boston tax-wise. But then going forward, tacking on three more years, last one, according to Bobby Marks, is a player option. Reactions to Drew Holiday, who has often felt like,

like the fifth wheel but like every like a beloved fifth wheel like like two couples are going out to dinner and a friend is there and like this friend is bringing a lot to the table like he's not he's not like attached to anybody but like he's maybe he's paying for the bill he's ordering the right app that brussels sprouts that everybody wanted um what'd you think of the deal

I loved it. You know, I think it was great for the Celtics just in a sense of, I mean, it's great for the owners. Nobody really cares beyond that, but like for, for cutting down the tax bill. But when you look at the fact that Celtics are going to have some big bills to pay, got to find a way to, uh, got to sign Derek White.

And then you have Tatum with the Supermax coming. Brown's Supermax kicks in next year. So this kind of helps in sort of, hey, let's keep this whole band together right now. If you're going to take a little less, you go back to Porzingis' extension when he came, when he got traded and got there, two years, $60 million, I think. That's a nice deal for them as well. I think it kind of sets them up nicely. And it's also not...

So overwhelmingly big that like, should you be in a situation where you no longer can maintain this roster or man, this team's really not contender level status or whatnot. It's not, it's not a crazy contract to move.

And it's not wild in that sense. And I know that's not what Boston's thinking was when they signed him. Securing him for the next few years, I think, puts them in a good position, what they have going forward. And it just gets rid of any uncertainty in Drew's mind. Hey, they like me. They want me here for the next few years. I'm secure going into the playoffs. Yeah, I took a little bit of a haircut, but it's not a wild one in that sense. And I think it's just, you know, giving that up for a little more security is

a pretty solid deal there for him I think it's just a good one all around for everybody I think it's a fair it's about where I had pegged it coming in it's a fair deal for both sides and it does put an enormous amount of pressure on the Celtics to win a championship in the next two seasons because 25-26 not next season the year after is when Tatum's super duper duper max kicks in

When Derek White will be presumably back on the Celtics on some sort of contract, he is eligible for an extension on July 1 this offseason. The max the Celtics can pay him under the CBA is four years, $122 million. Boy, if you ask 50 GMs and assistant GMs, is he going to take that? You'd get a lot of different answers.

In those conversations I've had with people, and I don't know Derek White. I don't know what he's doing. I don't know what he's thinking. But I thought back to the Devin Vassell extension from earlier in the year. Not that they're comparable players, but the reaction to the Vassell extension in some corners was, holy cow, that's a lot of money. And then in other corners it was, man, he might have left a little money on the table by extending early if he has a big year this year. And my response to that and others' response to that was,

This guy has never seen this kind of money put in front of him ever. A hundred something million dollars. And that's where Derek White's going to be. And I, you know, you can haggle here and there, but like Derek White has earned basically that full extension. He's been that good this season, uh,

I don't know what he'll do, but that's when you have, you are over the tax already in 25, 26 with five dudes on the roster. The Jays, Derek White, Drew Holiday, who I guess is a third J the three Jays, Derek White and Kristaps Porzingis. And after that you can finagle it around, but who cares? Like if this team's as good as they think it is, this team plays in the playoffs like it did in a regular season. You keep it together.

pay the luxury if you're not willing to pay the luxury tax as an owner when you have a championship contending team i said this about the cronkies and the nuggets and they stepped up and paid by their standards just get out of the league like this is the whole point of being an nba owner is to try to win championships and so the celtics will pay it and figure it out later um figure out if the team is good enough uh to pay it later on the bucks uh

Not much to say about Giannis. It sucks and you just keep your fingers crossed. I did find it interesting, and I wonder what your reaction to it was, that in game 79, they changed the starting lineup. Patrick Beverly in, Malik Beasley out. Reactions?

Yeah, I found it interesting, but I also kind of, I don't look at it as game 79. It was probably, I forget, like game 20 since the trade deadline, like since they had Beverly and that's the option of it. And, and, you know, now it's, it's let's go. I maybe would have wanted to do it a little bit sooner than, than my last, you know, last few games of the season. But I think that's along those lines that you got to remember to like dock and

Pat Bev go way back to the Clippers. Like, you know, there's a lot of trust there for Doc. And I think the thing people don't understand a lot with coaches and they get frustrated with the rotations. And this is every team. It's not just a Doc thing. But a lot of coaches, they go to the guys they know.

you know, and, and, and they have confidence with and trust with. And if you've ever been in a press conference for a team that doc press conference and Pat Beverly's on the team, if you ask him, the first thing doc always says is he's a Chicago kid. Cause so's doc. And I think that's the, there's a lot of like ties there with doc and having that trust. So I'm not too surprised in that, but I think it was just, Hey, like we got to do something. And, and,

That three-game losing streak against lottery teams, I think, really shook them. And I think they really had to start pondering things. And I think that was the answer Doc came up with. We'll find out if that's what's going to be the solution. But that's what he's trying to come up with right now. I thought it was really interesting that the TNT broadcast talked about it. And I called a few people today and heard the same.

They framed it as a move that was about offense as much as defense. And you would not think that at all, given that Malik Beasley was in the three-point shootout, lobbied like hell to get into three-point shootout and then crap the bed, but is a very good three-point shooter. And Patrick Beverly is a defense first player, but they talked about it in offensive terms. Now that was really telling and actually really smart because I think the bet they were making, if you listen to Doc,

And this is according to the TNT guys who talked to him before the game. Maybe it was ESPN. Did we have that game? It's probably ESPN. They talked about how Doc had mentioned, like, we kind of got to run plays from Malik. Like, we got to tilt some of our offense toward him.

And Pat, we don't. He's just like a fast twitch ball mover. He kicks it ahead. He'll get us moving in transition. He's not just going to hand the ball to Dame and let Dame walk it up every time sometimes. And like he'll dribble a handoff, get out of the way, just keep it moving. Doesn't care if he shoots. And maybe that's better for an ecosystem with Giannis and Dame and Middleton. And for a hot second, they were all on the floor together for the first time in a long time. And I actually think that's a really smart assessment of where the team was at. I thought their offense just had lost...

Their offense is fine statistically. I just thought it had lost the plot a little bit on in what doses to sprinkle in all the different weapons that they had. And they just kind of lost the right blend of the recipe and maybe inserting a guy who doesn't really care about his offense but can keep the ball moving, keep the flow going. I thought that was smart. And I still think fully healthy through all the trials and tribulations, through the coaching drama, through everything else.

If you're asking me, who's the biggest threat to Boston in the East? I understand why some people will say Philly. I got to see him get out of the play in first. The Anthony Melton's back. That's huge. Maybe it is Philly in the end. I still think it's the bucks with those. If they, if they can ever keep their core healthy together, but I'm not optimistic. I mean, again, I've picked Boston to win the East all season. So is everybody else. Um, well, not everybody did actually, if they get preseason predictions, a lot of people pick Milwaukee. Um,

But I still really like this team. And I'd still, I'm going to die on the hill of, I think the Dame trade was the right move. And I don't know. And that's going to be revisited heavily if they lose early in the playoffs and the Celtics go on to win the championship.

I don't know what control the Bucs could potentially have tried to exert over where Drew Holiday ended up. They could try to make it how hard they tried to make it a three-team trade where they knew all the parameters and how hard Portland pushed back and whether it was just a deal breaker. I think they were right to make that trade and say, hey, our offense isn't good enough. It really wasn't even good enough when we won the championship. We got to shake it up, but it hasn't worked this year. And now with the Giannis injury, like they're just –

They're running out of time, and I hope we get to see their full team. Yeah, and I think the revisionist history that we're going to get with the Dame trade is kind of bulls**t in that sense. I just look at it where what you're...

When we looked at this team after they got eliminated last year, we were all screaming like your end of game offense is bad. Your offense in general is bad. You have no real pop, you know, as much as you like true, there's really not much there. And then, so they went and addressed it and yes, it cost them true. And now of course,

Unfortunate for them, Drew also ended up in the same conference with them after they traded him to the West. And I think that's just kind of tough luck. That's how this goes in trades, and that's how it works in the NBA. And, you know, this is a big boy game in that sense. But they had to do something. Like, honestly, like, I don't know if I would have been that confident with this team if they had Drew Holiday and they brought everybody back. I would have just said, we've kind of seen this before. Like, I'm very worried about their offense.

And now I'm looking at it now like, yeah, now I'm very worried about their defense. There's no real answer about it. But I think it's also tough to frame it as this is a one-year deal, right? Like they got to find a way this summer in the offseason. And I'm speaking as if they've been eliminated now, right? They might go on a run and blow us all away. But like say they do, they have an offseason to really start trying to figure out how to retool, you know, Doc having a full offseason with them and really can probably put together the entire staff that he wants.

I think helps in that sense and kind of develop a little more relationships. Like, I just feel like it's going to be too early for me to revisit the trade and look at the bucks going like, I can't believe you did that.

Tim Bontemps disagrees with me, and the point that he will make, and it's a fair point, is it's not necessarily either or. There's a third path where you just don't trade for Dame and Duality doesn't end up on the Celtics, and you get to the middle of the season and you make a different trade with different pieces. And that's a fair point, and that's a fair rebuttal. I'll tell you this. They lose early. This is an old team. It's an old team, and the noise is going to start again. I don't need to tell you. The noise is going to start again. I don't even need to elaborate on that.

Um, much beyond that, I don't know how much validity the noise will have, but it'll start again and the vultures of circle. And that's just what's going to happen. So maybe they won't, maybe they shouldn't lose early in the playoffs. Um, one thing I forgot to say about Boston, New York tonight, and I think indicative of maybe Boston's lack of seriousness. If those two teams did play in the playoffs, I think you'd see Boston go at Jalen Brunson's defense much more seriously.

and much harder than they did tonight. The one thing Boston did to start this game that I thought was interesting that didn't pan out, but I think having Drew on Hartenstein was a way that they can just, hey, every Brunson-Hartenstein pick and roll, switching automatically. And it was, you know, I think that was kind of the...

the plan there. I like that one. I like that thinking there a little bit, and they've done that a bunch throughout the course of the season, but I think that'd be the matchup. We'd see a lot of, if, if they do match up into the playoffs. Yeah. If you have a shaky shooter and Josh Hart is not a non-shooter, but he's sometimes doesn't want to shoot. Porzingis is going to guard quote unquote, guard him, but not really guard him. That's what's going to happen. And, you know, you mentioned you can't play drop against Brunson that in that John, my memory,

The next big test case for Joe Mazzulla, who I think has done a good job, particularly this year, is when you run into a situation like, oh, the thing we do all the time isn't working. Is he going to dig the hole deeper and say, no, we go down our way. Like, this is how we play. Or is he going to be quick to say, okay, let's try something else. And I think that's the next, that's the next test.

The other big game that happened this week was last night, so we don't have to talk too much about it. In what was a nip and tuck game that didn't quite decide the number one seed in the West, but got us a lot of the way there. The Denver Nuggets did what the Denver Nuggets do, which is turn a close game into a laugher by just out-executing you down the stretch.

and the game just turned into a Peyton Watson, Christian Brown dunk party with Christian Brown, one of the dunks of the year on Rudy Gobert's face, just snapped. It was like snappy. He didn't even cock it back. He just was like, ba-bam. It was like, whoa, did I just miss that? With the left. With the left. And stop trying to take shots when Peyton Watson's around because it's not going to work out for you. He's going to block that thing to smithereens. Especially if you're Nas Reed. It was like three or four of them were on Nas Reed.

I do think that is – Denver wasn't joking around or it wasn't hyperbole. Bruce Brown was the first one to say it publicly last year after they won the title that Minnesota was the team that actually scared them the most. That wasn't – that's what they were saying, a lot of them, behind the scenes. I think Minnesota's size –

And the way they can put, you know, it's well documented. They put Nas Reed in when Towns comes back and be Towns on Gobert and have Rudy roam around on Aaron Gordon. And just the sheer size of like, they're just huge everywhere. And they're one of the only teams like Jada McDaniels is just smothering Jamal Murray. And Jamal Murray is not going to be smothered for long. Like that dude can get out of anything. But they're one of the only teams that you can see Jokic actually,

twice about what to do on some of his reads. Like, oh, look at that pass might not be there. Like there's arms there. And I don't know how this will shake out, but I think that would be a really fun series. But obviously we have a long way to go before we get there. Any reaction to anything that struck you from that game? Obviously, Jokic just had an absolutely monstrous offensive performance to stamp his MVP case.

Yeah, I think the two things really kind of stood out to me. I mentioned this to you because when I saw you in L.A. for the Clipper-Denver game, we've said it then, Aaron Gordon's defense is unbelievable. We don't talk enough about him defensively.

And what he does just not just for the Nuggets, but just in general, like he goes from guarding Rudy Gobert to some possessions on Edwards, you know, and, and, and, you know, on times on Connelly, like the way he just can kind of his versatility goes such a long way for them. And I think, you know, that's, that's one of those guys I think is, is a bit underrated when we talk about defensively, maybe it's because we, he was miscast in Orlando for so long. So we've given up on him. And now I think just his defense right there is so huge and pivotal for this team.

But the other thing for me with the Nuggets, and this is what has the edge for them to me versus everybody else. I was just thinking about it this morning. Man, I can't think of, besides games where they just don't show up, there's not a lot of games where they have three or four bad consecutive possessions offensively.

Like, it's very, like, they go through, okay, we took a bad shot last possession. Oh, we took a bad shot second possession. Okay, let's just run our horns action and Jokic will get us something. And they find their way into good stuff all

more consistently than anybody else in the NBA. And I think that's the tier. That's that small thing that sets them apart from everybody else. When it gets to the crunch time situations, it's just like, you know, they're going to get a good shot. Now they might not make it, but they're going to get a good look. Something is going to get created and it's going to be a good look for either Rokic for Murray, Gordon on a lob, MPJ on a kickout, KCP on a kickout or cutting on along the baseline. Like it's just,

everything you get from them and i think that's the thing when i look at them just thinking like man nobody's been able to really kind of stop them for multiple possessions and the ultimate trump card that they have is however you want to scheme for yokich you want to put you know your power forward on him and put your center on gordon you want to do the thing where you quote unquote let him score let him get his and don't and don't double him

and try your best to like halfway get in the passing lane so that he doesn't, you know, you make him think a little bit. No matter how you scheme for Jamal Murray, put a bigger guy like Jaden McDaniels on him, whatever it is, you can scheme for them individually individually.

And you really can't for Jokic, but you can fake it for a half a game. You can't scheme for them together. Or if you can, no one has figured it out yet. Because when it gets real tough in Minnesota, even in kind of having the game get away from them, made it real tough. It was physical. It was nasty. There was not a lot of space to work with. Things were contested all over the floor. They can just say, oh, we'll pair these two guys in a two-man game.

And no one has found an answer for it yet. And I even think, you know, if they run into Minnesota or a team that mimics their strategy with Jokic, which it's hard to do if you don't have someone as great as Gobert behind it. I think there are cards that they're not playing that they're saving for the playoffs. One of them is if Rudy Gobert is going to be on Aaron Gordon,

I think Denver is well-versed in this enough to know that we can't just have Aaron Gordon hanging out on the baseline or in the corners the whole game. What we can do is have him set screens for Nikoli Okic in the pick and roll. Run pick and roll with Nikoli Okic. Screen for Jamal Murray in the pick and roll. I think those are all cards they have. And they just went to that two-man game.

And it was curtains. And then it became a dunk party. But it's a really fun matchup. And you can tell that Minnesota has Denver's attention and respect. Yeah, and that just goes along the ways with Anthony Edwards' defense on the perimeter. McDaniel's defense on the perimeter. Connelly solid defensively. And then you just have the big eraser in Gobert. Like, you know, this is the best perimeter defense he's ever had.

And I think it allows them to be more aggressive knowing that he's going to be behind them ready to swat things away or protect the rim. I think it's just like they got a lot of weapons defensively that can just make everybody's night harder. And it just sucks because Denver's so good. It's just like that's the one team. It's just I don't know. You ran through it. I don't know if anybody can solve them.

Well, we're going to go from there and take a soft left turn into another unsolvable player in the MVP discourse and a team that may well get a shot at solving Denver and also may well lose to the Clippers in the first round of the playoffs in Clippers-Mavs 3.0. Revenge of the—revenge of—I don't know. Who would it be the revenge of? We'll just go Star Wars, Revenge of the Sith. Revenge of Reggie Bullock. Reggie Bullock. Yeah.

The MVP is not over and it's close. Luka Doncic has just been on the tear of tears for what seems like three months now. And the Mavs are 15-2 in their last 17 games. They've been a top five defense since the trade deadline. Gafford is on another one of these streaks where he makes every basket like 20-something in a row.

Exum is contributing. Lively's hurt and it hasn't mattered because Maxi Kleba looks like Maxi Kleba on defense again, on offense. And Kyrie and Luka are making magic, like magic. It's unbelievable to watch. But Luka is the guy.

And I think this MVP race is much closer than the straw poll that should be much closer than the straw poll that Tim Bontemps put out indicating that Jokic is going to win in a landslide. Should be much closer than what the Vegas odds indicate is a Jokic landslide. And like I said, I haven't written that part of my column yet. I'm leaning Jokic. I think Jokic is the best player in the league. Denver's number one in the West, plus 5.3%.

Points per game. Dallas is plus 3.1. Denver is about plus 12 with Jokic on the floor. Dallas is like plus 7 or 8 with Luka on the floor. But I sent you this text already. I said, we've reached a point that the MVP should be close enough that you have to put in your head. Okay, I have to explain to a Dallas Mavericks fan why the MVP is Jokic.

When the stats are, I mean, look, the advanced stats are Jokic all the time. Not all of them. Dunks in threes, estimated plus minus is not Jokic. Most of them are Jokic.

But you have to explain to me why it's obviously Jokic when Luka leads the league in scoring, their assists are even, their teams for the better part of the last 30 games have been of about the same quality, even though Denver got off to a head start. You have to give me an explanation that's not one of these things. It's not, well, look at the standings.

that's why and it's not well like everyone just knows Jokic is the best player like that's the explanation is he don't you listen to the players talk they all know Jokic is the best player you're owed Luka is owed and they are owed a better explanation than that and I'm trying to form it in my own head but I'm curious and I've I've spitballed this question all across the league to to see some people think Luka is the MVP so they'd reject the question out of hand um

But I'm interested to see, like, were you forced to do that thought exercise? What would you say? Yeah, I think that's a...

One, they're very similar in the sense of they create for everybody. They have the ability to lift their teammates up across those boards, and we're seeing it with Gafford, with Exum, and everybody kind of benefits playing off of Luka to a large degree. I think when it comes down to it,

And I think about it in a playoff setting, and it's just more my mind strategically. I don't know what I can do against Jokic. And I don't have a clear answer against Doncic, but we know at the end of games, it's pick and roll with the Mavericks.

I'm doubling the crap out of him getting the ball out of his hands or even when he crosses half court before the pick and roll sending a double we've seen the Clippers do it you know in the two series with him and and I think it's getting the ball out of his hands and then from there it's kind of okay the threats somewhat neutralized.

And I think that's the difference. Whereas, you know, you haven't found a way to kind of neutralize Jokic down the stretch or in the playoffs. You know, when you do the playoff scouting and it's, and it's teams and video guys and shout out to all the video guys who are probably sleeping in the offices for the next few days. Wake up video guys, wake up.

You're really kind of trying to figure out what are you going to do to stop him. And I just, nobody's come up with an answer for Jokic.

And I'm not saying they've come up with an answer for Luka, but you found a way to slow him down. And you can do a lot. You can wear him down throughout the course of the series, pick him up full court. And maybe it's going to be different this season now that he looks in better shape and they're playing faster as a team and all that stuff. But I think you found a way to get the ball out of his hands. And I think it's become a little bit harder.

you know, in a sense to do that against Jokic. And it's, I think that's the answer for me. And that's the difference is I haven't seen Luca really be able to find a way to overcome that, that little strategy and that scheme. And maybe it's unfair of me and I apologize to Mavs fans, but it's really that close to me, just the MVP debate between these two guys. It's very close. And you could argue that part of the valuable part of the value part of being valuable is, um,

Which of those teams has a better roster? Now, I don't think you can overweigh that because I don't think it's fair to punish any player for having a good roster around him or over-reward a player for having a bad roster around him or whatever. Not that the Mets have a bad roster. They clearly do not. The more I thought about it, the more I think what we're really spending a lot of words saying, and other people gave me similar answers to what you just said.

I think it's all a fancy way of saying one guy's way bigger than the other and just as skilled. And because he's way bigger than the other, he just gets closer to the rim much more easily. And when he's closer to the rim, has access to just more stuff, more passes, more easy shots. And he's the king of easy shots. He has this ridiculous touch with both hands. And being bigger also makes him

It's not only this, but I think he's on another tier defensively from Doncic. Neither of them are going to make an all-defensive team, but I just think Jokic, by being huge and getting a lot of deflections and more than anything else, getting a ton of defensive rebounds and a ton of contested defensive rebounds, a ton of contested defensive rebounds where he beats your center for the rebound, spins up the court, and is in an instant...

Death on five on four, death for your defense, fast break. I don't know exactly what all those advanced staffs are capturing in Jokic that just has him lapping the field in those categories every year. I suspect a lot of it is that defense to offense blend where his rebounding alone makes him an average to good defensive player and it immediately springboards into their offense. And I just think a lot of it is he's just as skilled

as Luka, which is they are of the 0.00001% ever to play basketball. And he's just bigger and stronger and bulkier and get where he wants to go. I think if you're looking for, I don't know that that explains why he's the MVP in this particular season. But if you're looking for an explanation of like, well, why he's, he's a little better, maybe, maybe it just comes down to that. I don't know.

Yeah, it's funny. Like, I wonder what you think about this, just kind of thinking about it for the Mavs.

I almost wish sometimes, and we've seen him do it, but I wish they put Jokic, or excuse me, Doncic in the post. He's a monster. He's a monster. There. And I wish we could see more of that, you know, and even in end of games. And I think now that you have a good ball handler, an amazing ball handler in Kyrie, you can kind of do that and have a little more of that stuff. And maybe that completely takes away the argument that I just made, you know, in terms of like, hey, now this is a different thing that they can go to. I just feel like it's,

It's that's the thing I'd want to see a little bit more from Donchik and the Mavs kind of call on that number and putting him in the post. And let's see how that kind of create creation comes from and how that helps them. And I think that's something that would also sway me in terms of the MVP, because now it's just one. I value being able to attack in different ways. And to me, it just feels like the most the best way to get stuff out of Luca is is him having the ball at the top and then attacking.

Look, bottom line. Yeah. Bottom line is if you closed, if you wrote your column and close the book on MVP, I think you need to delete it and reopen it a little bit. Um, maybe not delete it, but maybe reopen it. Um,

And I think Luka has jumped SGA for number two in MVP at worst. Just an unbelievable season for the Mavs. They look awesome, and they would scare the living hell out of me if I were the Clippers or anybody else. Let's end with a couple other Western Conference things. The most interesting remaining part of the Western Conference starts at New Orleans at 6 p.m.

They are playing right now. What's the score of that game? I have them up 9-0 on sack right now. 9-0 sack is winning or losing? They're up. New Orleans is winning. It's over. I'm calling it now. Pencil it in. New Orleans at 6. Phoenix at 7. One game back in the loss column. Has the tiebreaker over New Orleans. Sacramento at 8. Losing 9-0.

What a horrible start. Not quite as bad as 35-4 Clippers-Suns the other night. And the Lakers at 45-35 coming off a loss to the Warriors where Anthony Davis didn't play. And the Warriors are right there at 44-35 as well. But the two big questions in terms of mega teams with mega people and mega possibilities at stake are,

are can Phoenix get out of the play-in and get to six and pass New Orleans? And can the Lakers jump over Sacramento and at least get into the upper half of the play-in bracket and give themselves a shot, a shot,

at seven at the seventh seed which if things stand as they stand is denver avoidance now it doesn't denver won't clinch the number one seed until the last day of the season because minnesota has that tiebreaker and then your brain starts to break but those are the two biggest ones so let's start with phoenix

Phoenix has at Sacramento tomorrow, the Kings will be on a back-to-back, and at Minnesota, who unfortunately for Phoenix is very unlikely to be locked into number two and may have to play that game on the outside shot. Denver loses and they get the number one seat if they care. New Orleans has at Sacramento currently, at Golden State. That's a tough game. Home against the Lakers. That's a tough game. All those teams need to win. Phoenix has the tiebreaker. Boy, would they love to get out of the play-in. Yes.

I cannot figure out for the life of me what the hell is going on with the Phoenix Suns. They were actually on a nice run. They held the Wolves to 87 points. They beat Denver. No Jamal Murray, but they looked snappy against Denver. They had a couple other good wins that really like, okay, they're starting to feel it. They're starting to groove a little bit on offense, snap decisions, making reads. Then they played the Clippers. First, they lost to the Pelicans, 113-105. Fine. Pelicans are good. Zion had a great game. Then they played the Clippers twice.

And in the first game, a massively important game at home for the fully intact other than Yusuf Nurkic, Phoenix Suns. And Yusuf Nurkic is a big deal. They were behind 35 to four. And they looked, they looked, they fought back in the third quarter. They made a semi game out of it. But they looked so dispirited in that first half.

So out of rhythm. So like, hey, what are we supposed to be doing on offense? What did we do those last two games when it was working? Did you screen for me? Did I screen for you? Did we run any of those double pick and roll? Oh, the shot clock's expiring? They looked so...

just blah and almost defeated that it was that was a red flag loss like is something not right here then they had to rally to beat the Clippers B team the next night in LA they and rally they did they started Royce O'Neal over Grayson Allen in that game which is a very interesting move that feels much more panicky to me than the Bucks starting lineup adjustment but

I guess this team is still theoretically dangerous. I've said before, it just feels like one of those years where they don't have it. I can't figure them out, but that Clippers loss was like an oh-my-God loss. Right. Yeah, that's the 35-4 start is one of those things, and I went back and rewatched it this afternoon and was just appalled. Some of it was, hey, the Clippers hit some shots that were pretty tough and whatnot, but it was just offensively,

They just looked incredibly lost or incredibly sloppy with their passes and the turnovers and the way they were kind of moving or not moving at all. And just kind of watching, they missed a lot of bunnies at the rim. And when they did that, they weren't getting back on defense that opened up the opportunity for the Clippers across the board. I just think it's too late for them.

When I just see them and I look at the way the season has gone for them, I just feel like they haven't had enough time together. They have quite a few holes on the roster and having not enough time to kind of figure out, okay, how are we going to figure these things out is really a problem for them. And then the in and outness of the lineup with some of these guys and

Just too many problems in one season that you just can't find a way to overcome. And it's, I look at them and I just say like, man, this is...

This is just a wasted year to a degree. You know, the best, the only thing that was great out of it for them was Grayson Allen shot the ball amazingly. Like that was a whole nother level that I don't think anybody was expecting us to be able, expecting him to reach. And I think that's one of those things where you're going like, wow, that's, that's pretty impressive. But the rest of the team hasn't done well. Eric Gordon hasn't really produced the way everybody thought he would when he was signed. And we all thought it was a sneaky, good signing. We haven't seen, uh,

Nurkic who's been good but like there's also that weirdness where there are times where Vogel just doesn't play him you know and and they play KD at the five a ton and and things like that and I think that's something that wears down Durant I just feel like this team just doesn't have it and they just haven't had the time to really gel and make it all work I don't believe in the Durant at center lineups for more than a two three minute change of pace I just think they're too small

I guess the idea of starting Royce O'Neal 80 games into the season, and I guess it's like your Pat Beverly comment where it's really 20 games into Royce O'Neal's season with the Suns for Grayson Allen is aimed at defense and a little bit more size. I mean, Royce O'Neal has played the four before. He's incredibly undersized to play the four. He's a good defensive player. He's fine. He's better than Grayson Allen.

I don't think Grayson Allen has been the problem this year. It, in fact, when their offense is humming, like it should be, he's often involved as a screener, as a secondary playmaker. Royce O'Neal likes to run. He's good. I liked this acquisition of him because he runs around and sets random screens and like jolt you to life a little bit on offense. I don't,

Some fans have been clamoring for this specific move. Maybe it'll work wonders. I don't really see it as much more than kind of a cosmetic move to you. Maybe I'm missing something. No, I think your assessment of this being more of a panic move than Milwaukee's is kind of right on. Yeah, it's the same thing, only 20 games or whatnot. But this just felt like replacing Grayson Allen when you looked at the fact like,

I mean, like how much more of an upgrade is Royce O'Neal over Grayson Allen? When you look at what Allen does offensively and how he kind of helps spread the floor and keeps things going. It's not like I don't look at him defensively as like, yo, that's a guy we're going to target over and over and over and over again in that regard. Like, you know, he might go at him a little bit, but it's not going to be a...

as massive that one kind of was more a knee-jerk reaction to just starting as badly as you started in one game and you felt like you had to make a change like there's it's i don't feel like this was a move they felt like was coming for a while where i kind of still feel like the one in milwaukee was something doc had been pondering for a bit they just still seem too small to me um

And that was, we knew that. And the whole idea of this team was be average on defense and supernova good on offense. And our offense is in a lot of ways going to be our best defense because we're going to be able to set our defense all the time because we're going to score all the time. They're just like the Bucs in that they have not had a two-week period where like, okay, they're fine. They got it. I think the Bucs are probably better positioned than them just by virtue of being in the East and having maybe Giannis back, but...

By the way, we should pause for a second. We must salute Torrey Craig and his Best Supporting Actor nominee, Andre Drummond, for one of the best moments literally in NBA history. I mean, I didn't see it live. I saw it on Twitter, and I just...

I don't know what, like 45 minutes went by and I was like, I need to see this from every angle. I need to make sure this isn't like a deep fake video from some disgruntled Bulls fan who wants everybody fired. That was... I mean, JaVale McGee from 10 years ago is like, I'm kind of impressed you tried that and messed it up like that. That was...

That was incredible. I mean, just, I don't, I have nothing else to say. It was one of my favorite plays of all time. I would sign Torrey Craig to a veteran minimum next year, just to try to recreate that play in garbage time. I would, I look at that play and I think it's, I think Shaq just has to announce he has to retire Shaq in a full. I think that's the, that's the pinnacle. Like, I don't know if you can get a, a, a, a dumber play.

than that and it was and i mean dumb in the most lovingly way i can say it because it has brought me so much joy like i'm gonna look at that in the way i looked at so many highlights this nba season whose fault whose fault is it who's who's like the main culprit is it tory craig for like actually being like yeah i'm tory craig i'm trying i'm a role player i'm trying this or is it andre drummond for being like oh he's lobbing it to me wait he's not gonna oh he's trying to do oh no

I actually think I'm going to put the blame on Craig and I feel bad, but because just the concept of just throwing it up is more often like, okay, I'm going to reward the big man. I'm going to throw it up off the glass and we're going to get a highlight. It'll be awesome. If you're going up for yourself, you got to yell it. You got to yell it. You know, you got to say, Hey man, that's,

this one's me, you know, or something like you. I got to put it on Craig on that one there. But it was I am thankful for the both of them for providing us such a highlight at the end of the season.

And it's end of the season where we were getting so many games that I mean, that that was a delirious night of basketball the other night. And when there were 14 games and Friday is going to be tomorrow's going to be delirious. Sunday is going to be super delirious. And then we'll know. We'll know who's where. And like I said, the greatest mistake at Miami looks like is almost assuredly going to be in the play in.

Philly has a route to get out of the play-in. They need to win out. That would finish at 47-35. They need Orlando to then lose out. Or they need Indiana. They cannot be in a three-way tie with Indiana and Orlando because they lose that. I think they got a shot. And that's the big one. That one and the Lakers who, let's review. Lakers are...

45-35. Sacramento may also be 45-35. Are they still losing? It is. Yeah, it's 31-11. 31-11?

The Kings are running on fumes, man. They're running on fumes. And I'll be, it was just 16, 11, a second ago that I looked at it and then they've, they've gone on basically. Like teams come back from 20 down all the time. Um, but that's not an encouraging start for the Kings. Um, if they do go on to lose this game and Sabonis is double, double streak ended and herders hurt, monks hurt. They're running on fumes. Like they're the team. Everyone's going to want to play. Sorry, Kings fans. It's just the thing. Uh, they will be tied with the Lakers. Um,

The Lakers, do the Kings have the tiebreaker? Because I guess Sabonis just beats Anthony Davis's teams every single time they play. The Kings' last two games are Phoenix, that's a big one, that's tomorrow, and Portland at home, which should be an automatic win, which means the very worst record the Kings should have is 46-36.

The Lakers would have to win out in that scenario to pass the Kings and jump to eighth because they have because again, the Kings have the tiebreaker. So the Lakers have at Memphis and then what may end up being the biggest game on the last day of the season. Lakers at Pelicans. But if the Kings lose this one tonight, the Lakers in play to get up into the 7-8 game.

And in play in that case to have a shot at not only getting into the playoffs, but avoiding Denver, which really could only get you Minnesota with Carl Townsback or Oklahoma City fully loaded and younger than you. Now they've played Oklahoma City pretty tough. So that's the other subplot. There's no point really belaboring it. That's just...

Those are the stakes. Those are the most interesting pivot points. Phoenix, Lakers, Sixers as we enter the last 72 hours. The interesting wrinkle, too, though, is if the Lakers beat New Orleans in that game on Sunday night and then they jump Sacramento,

That loss there, New Orleans taking that loss, that probably puts New Orleans at the seventh seed. So it's basically finish the season with New Orleans playing game seven, eight seed against New Orleans. Like that becomes a very interesting sort of just schedule wrinkle that only I would probably find interesting. But I just think it's hard to beat a team two times in a row. And I think that makes it a tough one. And I think it would be a win for the Warriors too if the Warriors are stuck in 10th. And they may not be. This is all in flux because –

They're comfortable playing against the Kings, even if they have to go on the road to beat the Kings. Lots still in flux. Anything we didn't get to, Mo, here as we approach 10.30 Eastern time? No, I think we covered it pretty good. Just playoffs. Playoffs are coming. Playing tournament and then playoffs in a week.

Like, I'm excited. Trae Young's back. Trae Young's back and looked and did not miss a shot against the Charlotte Hornets. Charlotte won, but only because Atlanta's got nothing to play for and sat everybody down the stretch. It'll be interesting to see how Atlanta plays with Trae Young. You know, how that looks now after so long without him. And all the rumors around which one are they going to trade and all that stuff. That's going to be an interesting sort of side plot for them come the playing game.

Well, hopefully that got everybody set for a delirious night of basketball tonight, Friday. By the time some people are listening to this, it'll be Friday. And Moe DeKeele, I saw you had, I read a piece today on The Athletic about how video teams, which you were a part of on two franchises, prepare for the playoffs. It was very insightful. Everybody should read that. That's on The Athletic. Anything else we got to promote? Twitch, what's going on on Twitch? Twitch.

I don't know. What's the, do you have a username? What's happening? It's easy. It's, it's, it's Moe Dekeel NBA. Just find me on Twitch there. And basically I will be going through playoff games. I'll be bringing my own edits as a video coordinator and whatnot, and going through the playoffs, you know, pretty much the morning after, you know, the first weekend I will go pretty much after games.

The rest of the week, I will go the morning after. I haven't figured out exactly what time, but going to break down games. It'll probably be 10 a.m. Pacific or 11 a.m. Pacific time. I'm on the West Coast. And we're just going to break down games and playoff games and run through the strategy, all the fun stuff that we get through it. It's a fun time. The chat group's always awesome. I try to respond to the chat and kind of answer questions. And honestly, we're just breaking down basketball.

Well, look for that. If you want to know what went on in the game, like why one team won and why one team lost and what counters may be coming in games two, three, four, et cetera, that will be a good place to go. I will not go there because I'm old and I don't know what Twitch is really. MoeTekiel, read him, listen to him, watch him. Thank you for your insight. Go get some rest because the big games are coming, my friend. Yes, sir. Thank you for having me on.