“Climbing Cringe Mountain” (w/ Matt & Bowen) 01:24:42

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Look, man. Oh, I see. Wow. Bowen, look over there. Wow. Is that culture? Yes. Oh, my goodness. Wow. Las Culturistas. Ding dong. Las Culturistas calling. Las Coconutistas, as it were. I lost a coconut tree. These girls.

I mean, not that long ago, it was a bit on the show that this was going to be a Talkin' Biden podcast. I don't think it's going to be Talkin' Coconuts. I don't think it's going to be Talkin' Context. I don't think it's going to be Talkin' Unburdening. We're recording this on Monday, July 22nd. And gosh, just over 24 hours ago, we were rocked by the news. And...

I'm both engaged in a way that I have not been in a long time. And I'm also like completely overwhelmed. And I'm like, I need to maybe get off this train, but it's not the time for that. Yeah. I mean, I think that certainly Steve Kornacki has appeared on my television for the first time in many months. And I said, we are so back. You know what I thought about today? Oh, by the way, I'm hitting that blunt in just a second. You know what I thought about today? I literally had like a moment where I almost drove off the road thinking about like how triggered I'm going to be when I hear the word Maricopa.

You know, like once we start getting into it and just knowing that we're headed there, which is, of course, in the macro, like a very scary thought. And I think in the micro, I actually am feeling very celebratory and very hopeful and very excited about.

But there is so much left to go. And therefore, like, I do completely identify with your overwhelm because, I mean, even in the two days between when we record this and when this comes out, who knows what's even going to happen? It's just crazy. Someone made a joke like, oh, I bet in 10 days we're going to forget Trump was even, like, almost assassinated. And it bizarrely feels true. Everything is happening so fast. We just have to...

I hope that there is kind of a straight line all the way to middle of August. But who fucking knows? I mean, you can't write this shit. You can't write this. Well, you can't write it. I mean, truth is truly stranger than fucking fiction. For sure.

I'm smoking a new Flamer joint, a pre-roll from Flamer, this queer run. I'm looking at their website. Bunch of hotties founded this. Love that. And can I say, is this the same weed that you were smoking yesterday? Because my girl was happy, jovial, and more.

Can you talk about this? Because I think, and this is the first time I felt this way in a long time. By the way, I put Flamer next to Sunday School, sort of the West Coast equivalent, although they are kind of making inroads in the East. Come on. But I left our little meeting yesterday. We had a little work session yesterday, and I was coming in stoned because, oh, this is my, I don't think so, honey. My body is just...

And I don't know why I need, I need to get to the bottom of it. But I was like, I need a little bit of sativa to just get me up and activated. And I was like, Gabe Lieben has this joke where he's like, um, this thing happens to me when I drink where I'm amazing. Amazing. Yeah.

And that's how I felt leaving that session yesterday. I was like, that was... I was a very good version of myself stoned in that situation. I just love to see you so happy. And I mean, that's what I'm reacting to is like you were happy and like you seemed like...

Yeah, I was just so happy to see you in this mode. And also, wait, wasn't that like, that was about 15 minutes after he had announced. That was literally 15 minutes after he announced. And so I remember, by the way, just like finding out from an Instagram thread, like finding out on Instagram is so wild. I want to know if you found out from like Pop Crave.

And by email in, I mean get our attention in some way online. Because I know that Pop Crave, whatever the fuck, that all these sites were popping off. Yeah, that they were breaking news for people. And because that is the world that we live in. But just to speak broadly about it, this is what we wanted. And I will not lie. When I saw that he posted that, I felt a moment of deep sadness and concern about what was going to happen. Because...

There was not an explicit endorsement of her. I didn't know in that moment if that's what exactly I wanted or needed. I always knew she was super viable for it. But there was a moment of like, wow, this sort of direct action that we all participated in to ensure that he was not going to be the one on the ballot because I just haven't felt confident about it in a very long time and couldn't pretend. Yeah.

It happened. It was very sobering. You know what I mean? And so then a half an hour later when he did endorse her and the endorsement started to come and the energy started to pick up and you saw at least what feels like right now feels like more unity than we have had. Not to say that she doesn't have her issues, but it felt amazing to just feel like it was possible to

that we would retain our democracy and that it was possible that we would potentially maybe end this story in the way that it should have ended in 2016, in the way that, you know, maybe things were meant to be. I mean, I will say it does feel like Donald Trump, white collar thug, convicted felon, racist, rapist, predator,

versus Kamala Harris, prosecutor, Black woman, Indian woman, who's rising up as a new leader of this party, it does feel like the last chapter. It kind of does feel like we're about to... It's giving series finale? It's giving series finale. It's giving big boss. And I pray, and I am truly hoping, and I am hopeful we will have

an ending that is a positive one. And I mean that. And I am fully on board and will work very hard, as hard as I can, to make sure that Kamala Harris is elected president because the alternative is not acceptable. Thank you for putting it in those words. I think we are untangling a lot of

words and texts and thoughts and ideas right now in this moment i'm seeing a lot of stuff i think i have a a decent birth b-e-r-t-h of like a social media sort of like glimpse you certainly do but who am i to say but a lot of people what a lot of what i'm seeing now is um

people being like, great, but also bummer that this was like the thing. It's, it was never about like his policies. It was always about his electability. And it's like, yes, that's not, that makes sense in an election to be concerned about electability makes total sense. It is not something to like discredit any part of this process that like,

shouldn't have happened, except it should have. But you know what I mean? It's like, we're all bummed that it happened, but it had to happen this way. Right. There is like a decent outcome on the other side of this. There's an even great outcome on the other side of this. No matter how you feel about Kamala Harris, it's like,

She has demonstrated the capacity to move leftward on things, even though for every progressive policy she's been a part of, there seems to be like a conservative one that outweighs it. And that's like a totally fair thing to level against her. But let's just, I think we really do need to do some collective exercise in like putting that in a compartment for now. And I know we said this like four years ago about Joe, but it's like,

Feels even more dire than that. And there is no option of losing. There is no option of losing. And that's what we have to remember. And like AOC put it perfectly, there is no progressive enough candidate right now to win and beat Donald Trump. But like, you just have to think about between these two people, whose presidency do you want to organize under? Do you want to be active under? Do you want to like try to like

push things in a certain way under. I think there's a clear choice here. And that's the frame. There is one choice. I mean, and I would say if you hedge on that choice, then you're not thinking about people much more vulnerable than you. And I do think that is the way we have to vote. Fucking Brooklyn gay guys...

have to think about trans people in the middle of this country. You have to think about Black women. You have to think about low-income people. We have to. And I, by all means, vent your frustrations about what is happening, but fucking vote for her. Yes, yes. And I also think, I think we can engage on this for the next hundred days or so in a way that is like, what I find effective is just reframing things and anytime I feel like from either side I'm being like,

moralized, proselytized, like, getting a finger wagged in my face that I'm like, I'm totally disengaging. Like, I've... Right. Whatever anyone feels like they are being chastised in some way in this kind of conversation, in this kind of discourse, like, that does not seem to be effective. And so I feel like maybe as a lost culture exercise for everybody, for readers, katies, publicists, finalists, like, the way you try to engage around this, if someone does seem to be pushing back, is just to, like, reframe it in that exact way where you're like, well...

What would it be like to try to make positive things happen on a collective level in one outcome versus another? That's helpful to me. And I would also say, I don't think... We have really not weighed in. You know what I mean? We have really not weighed in. But I did come out and say, I did not vote for him in the primary. I have been trying to send small messages to the top...

the way that I can. You know, I was called the other day to fundraise for Biden, and I politely told the person on the other end of the phone, while I would be voting for the Democratic candidate, I don't feel I can send money until something is done. And something was done, and I would imagine they heard that a lot. And now what I would say is that

Everyone's opinion matters, but there are facts here. Just like the way Joe Biden's feelings don't matter. His feelings don't matter. I understand that he might be angry. He might feel very sad and depressed about this. He might have a lot to look at in terms of

where he's actually at, the way that politics works. I mean, he should know more than anyone. He might feel a certain way. His feelings don't matter. Just like our feelings don't matter. And that's kind of what I'm getting to is it's like, you can have feelings. They don't actually matter. The facts matter. It matters that we live in this world and we exist in this world and we do what we need to do, which is we get this man off the world stage. Right.

And just to speak about her, she is...

left of Biden. She is. And many people do believe he is the most progressive president we've ever had. Lots of people on the news who may have a reason to say this feel that this was by far the most successful presidency of all time in these four years. I do think there's a lot of, you know, we're leaning on it. What is happening in Gaza, the humanitarian crisis there weighs heavy on my heart. Know that.

And we must work harder for the ceasefire. At the end of the day, Trump would burn the world. He would burn the world. And listen to me now. If you are listening to this podcast and hedging, my diva, I want to cradle your face in my hands. He would watch you die, sweetheart. He would watch you die. And I don't say that to scare you. But if it did, okay.

You can't. And I'm now militant about it, actually. And, you know, I didn't need more reasons to be angry at Teresa Giudice, but I did see her just like Amber Rose's Instagram. Get that woman off my television ASAP. We're done with Trump. We're done. Larsa Pippen. Larsa Pippen. You're burnt. You're toast. Toast. And if we see you, it's on site.

I just can't with these clowns. I can't deal with all these hoes. With all these hoes. All these hoes. All these hoes. I can't deal. What do you think about Kamala being brat-coded now? Here's my honest take. Go on. I think the coconut tree memes were on a parallel track to like all the Edgeball remixes. I mean, that was like...

And then I think what's happened in the Venn diagram, as it were, like, it all started to become one circle. And I think, like, all the arms and tentacles of this thing have, like, collapsed into one shape. And the shape right now is, oh, okay, I guess Kamala HQ is running with

brat visuals with brat girl summer with all these things. My honest, honest emotional response. And again, my feelings don't matter. And so maybe my thoughts don't matter, but I am flashing back in trauma to, is this our Pokemon go to the polls? Is this a moment like Pokemon go to the polls for me? That's all. I think they were hot off the heels of the Charlie tweet and maybe that's what's going on. And I'm sure they will change it in like

I hope a week or something to something totally different and like not quite as right. Let's not have brat coded visuals in October. No, no, no. But you know what I will say? Someone as fucking cool and relevant and progressive and, you know, international as her coming out right away is,

That's different than I think we've seen in a long time. And it actually makes me very hopeful that not we're going to get in line. You know what I mean? It's not that. It's just that we're taking this seriously in a way that's bigger than us. And if it convinces people who are still trying to be too cool for this, that maybe they should take it more seriously because...

at least mother is, you know what I mean? Like then I'm for it. I don't know if I need Kamala doing the apple dance. I don't want to see it. There is a line. I think her best move is to ignore all of the memes, give a moment or two of acknowledging coconuts are unburdened or whatever and,

And really stay above it and be presidential and just hold Trump accountable and stay very focused on the task at hand, which is still a very difficult thing, which is defeating Donald Trump. And I think let the Internet have fun because it seems to be working in a healthy way at this point. It can turn so quickly. As we know. If what we're fearing is...

she leans in a little bit too hard on this at an event or something. And you're like, oh, and at that point it's fully Pokemon go to the polls.

100%. I was having a lot of fun on TikTok yesterday. I'm suddenly very active on TikTok. I don't know. I see that. Don't, there was a lot of judgment in the voice. No, there wasn't. There was a lot of judgment in the voice and I'll just call it out right away because I'm in my truthful era. My tone is, you are not going to let, and I love you for this. You're not going to let my tone, which let's say I did have a tone. I vehemently deny that I had a tone and that I was judging you, but let's say I was, you wouldn't let that stop you.

No, certainly not. But I will say, I was having a lot of fun on TikTok and I did find myself sort of giving something like this. You might like Trump, but my kink is cocky.

And then I realized so much works with her name, so much works with her name, too much works with her name. And I was like, listen, if we can sort of, I don't know if this is a word, but celebritize her. And there is a lot with her that works for this. I mean, with Kamala Harris, what you do get is a sort of glam factor. You get a Saturday Night Live characterization that isn't

Sorry, but like depressing or pathetic. You know what I mean? Like, it's not like, oh, look at this clown who's asleep or this monster who's like, thank God they found someone to do like,

what's actually kind of a measured characterization of him. Like, you know, like Johnson's Trump. Yes. I think he does an amazing job. He does. I don't think that Alec Baldwin Trump worked at all because it was just so broad and scary and monstrous and weird that it so obviously came from a place of like, it just, it wasn't working with Maya and, and,

I think what you get is a really fun game, which is she is a glamazon who maybe is, you know, a capital P politician and that there's a little bit of ego there. But you don't get a sense that she's like,

You don't distrust the person doing it. You're actually quite excited to see the person coming on and doing it, which I think there's historical precedent for at that show. What I don't think is precedent is that if you take Hillary, it's like the characterization there, and maybe this just speaks to the way that it was accumulating through decades of political life. The characterization was like, she's shrill, she's...

She's, like, not likable in all these ways, right? Right. And, like, who knows what the dialogue is there? It's hard to parse out the dialogue there between, like, the reality and, like, the sketch character of it. But between Kamala and Maya, it's like, well, these are, like, two, like...

personable people. And like Maya's characterization was never like, and this is a credit to people who've helped work on that character, cough, cough, sooty green. Yes. But it's like, this is not a shrill, this is not like an unlikable, detestable fucking character.

succubus of a woman that like kind of at that, like between Hillary and Sarah Palin, which is like, I think like the last big, the other big like female political impersonation on that show in recent memory. It's like, those are like caricatures that get blown up to like literally ridiculous proportions. They are ridiculing these people. With Kamala and with Maya, it's like there is something very, like,

that feels nice on the palate is how I'm going to put it. It's fun to watch. You know what I mean? And I will say, I did always enjoy the Hillary on the show, but I will say, I do think that, and this is obviously, you have to make it funny first, and it was always funny. But sometimes I worry about like feeding into, you know, a characterization that like reinforces a negative opinion of that person. Now, mind you,

On a show like that, it is equal time, whatever that means. It's like, I don't know about inviting the candidate on because correct me if I'm wrong, you have to have both on if one of them comes on? That's not true. Oh, is it not true? Or...

Like at different times, obviously, right? Right, correct. I don't mean on the same episode. I thought I remembered something about like if one candidate comes on, you have to have the other one on. Oh, I'm not even sure about that. But yeah, I guess Hillary came and then Trump hosted the same election. God, remember that reality? Holy fuck. Literally went to that show.

Went to that taping. Anyway, and then I guess Obama and John McCain. Yeah, okay. So, well... Because I don't think Biden came through, right? Biden never went... No, Biden has never, at least in the last... Since 2008, has never been on SNL. Right. So, I feel like there's something to that. And maybe the fact that it is different now, it's like...

I feel like you might, we may have enough with just Maya's Kamala and, you know, the Trump that we've had on that show for a while. It might be enough. You may not need the real candidate to come through. And especially if it's a situation where, well, if she's going to come through, then I have to come through or at least have the option. I would imagine that, you know, he's going to take that option. Though I will say, I do think there is enough anger from Kamala

the Trump people and there's enough disdain for media that I can see them passing on that opportunity. Similarly to how I can kind of see him backing out of this debate. And you see him sort of planting the seeds now. Oh, he's not, he's not debating her. He's never debating her. You don't think so? There's a reason why people who get prosecuted at trial usually don't take the stand. Usually don't take the stand.

Because a prosecutor knows what questions to ask or how to elicit a response out of

anyone they're talking to, basically. Yeah. Then I don't know if this is true, but I hope it's true that if he doesn't want to participate in a scheduled debate that she still gets that time on national television to address the nation because I am sure she is obviously itching to do that and obviously would relish the opportunity to prosecute him live in front of America as the felon white-collar thug that he is. And...

actually hold him accountable and call him out on the litany of bullshit that our current president was unable to do, which is why we could not move forward with him.

So now you have the whole Trump organization running scared because, I mean, this old campaign video from 2020 came out and she was not a good candidate then in the totality of things. But there is a moment and there is a time for that moment to be met. And that kind of feels like now when you look at this old video of her being like, you know, and this is where you kind of appreciate that she is a cop and a prosecutor because she is.

puts people like him away in her sleep. She eats people like him for breakfast. She did have that one very good debate, which birthed the, that little girl was me moment. And then she quickly sort of plummeted in the polls. Yeah.

I think because Tulsi Gabbard pulled some bullshit on her. Tulsi. One of the biggest flops in modern history, Tulsi Gabbard. I mean, give me a fucking break. But we won't talk about this whole episode. In the grand scheme of things, it's just nice to feel...

Like there's a path forward and it's nice to feel like on the other side of all this cringe, there's going to be nirvana. And they say that about cringe. And it's my favorite thing I've learned recently, which is, you know, you're, you have to sometimes climb up a huge hill of cringe and,

And once you can scale that hill, which is, you know, it might be your judgment on yourself. It might be your judgment on what you're doing. It might be everyone saying what you're doing is cringe. On the other end, there is you slide down into happiness and nirvana. Bitch. And I'm not saying things would be fucking perfect afterwards, but we'd have a country.

I know about working through cringe, climbing a cringe mountain. I work at Saturday fucking night live. The cringiest thing in show business on every level. Climbing cringe mountain title of episode.

Climbing Cringe Mountain. Cringe Mountain is SNL. Eternally grateful that I work there will be the defining thing of my life and career. And yet it is a cringe mountain because to live through working at SNL and to have people constantly tell you how much it sucks, how bad it is, how it's not as good as it used to be for me.

Your career. That has to do something to you psychologically where you emerge and go, I don't give a fuck. I feel like, you know what it is? It's like, y'all put on wigs.

And you go up there and you work so fucking hard. But it's not even cringe because of what you do, because I don't think it's cringe. But I will say in what I'm saying, which is that everyone has a fucking opinion. It's the most popular show in the world. It's now been on for 50 years. It is capital C commercial culture. And therefore it's cringe because everyone is like,

I'm having something to say. And it's comedy and it's subjective and it's corporate. And you know what I mean? It's all those things. And that's also what we're kind of going through. But on the other side of it, guess what, Bowen? You get to actually the visceral thing of people laugh, people feel good. And that is why we're doing this now.

And that is why America is worth saving so that we can protect people and live up to what this actually all is fucking about. And now it's getting very broad, but I'm just saying like to you, to me, to everyone fucking get over yourselves and like work at what you do and be proud of what you do and be proud of who you are and be proud that you know what's right and wrong. Bless. King. To put it mildly, bless. Bless.

I just want to say one more thing. I want you to say so many things. I just want to say one more thing about the cringe theory as it relates to my job and not the fate of this country. So I'm sorry to like, you know. Yeah, the way I sort of like melded those two things, but I do think I tried. No, you really brought it home. That was such a slay.

This is what you, me, and Sudi have been saying for such a long time. Like, all of these fucking guys who, like, go up on stage and do stand-up or do improv or sketch, like, we know this person. Let's say he's straight. These guys are like, uh, I don't know, like...

What I do is cool and edgy. No, bitch. You go on stage and you talk in a microphone in front of people. That is theater, which is gay. It's gay. So just embrace it. Don't like, like that's the analog for cringe in this context. It's like, I'm over these people who are just like, I don't know. It's like, just do it so that you can,

Like every now and then you do something because it's not cool and because it actually benefits something outside of you, even though it is locked into all these other like terrible oppressive systems. The motion is up at whatever axis. Okay. Like just, just like, just do it. Oh, can I tell you something? Can I tell you something? I'm a singing Christmas comedian. I'm cringe. I'm Matt Rogers. I'm cringe. I'm cringe.

And people buy tickets to my shit. And I see them afterwards. And they're living. And you know who else is living? Me. It's my fucking dream. And had I not climbed Cringe Mountain...

I wouldn't be looking at my fucking vinyl over there. And I'm not saying this because I feel like I did something. Which you did. I'm saying this because I'm happier for having gotten out of my own way and not giving a fuck about the bullshit. So what I'm saying is get out of your own way. Stop giving a fuck about the bullshit. Climb the cringe mountain that is this election. And that is Kamala often. Because now guess what? She's fucking brat coded.

And if you think that's cringe, your feelings don't matter. We're going to save the world. Period. And now I've hit my blunt. If it has not been obvious. Hey, everyone. We here at Lost Cultureistas love film.

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What else has happened? Has anything else happened? I have an I don't think so. I need to sort of relate to this just because there's one figure in politics that if I ever hear his name again, and it's not even it's not even one of the like top five you're thinking about. Maybe it is. But like, we'll get to it. Okay. What else? Oh, Remy Wolfe.

Period. Soup! Girl, where have you been? This is not quite as egregious because I think what Matt Rodders will dine out on for the rest of his life is to say that he introduced hordes of people to Chapel Rowan. This is not quite the same thing. But I've been up in this podcast shouting out Remy Wolfe for a bit. You definitely have. In fact, last week, I called out a different Remy. Yes. And her summer song. And you were like, Remy Wolfe? And I was like, oh, no, but also, yes, Remy.

And I have been aware of Remy Wolf for quite a while. But someone I dated liked her. I think it might have been George. It's George loves Remy. Yeah. And so I've been a Remy Wolf fan in a soft sense. But now like this new record...

It's really great and she deserves to take her place. And I am excited about seeing her live because I heard she puts on the show. She puts on the show. You need to go back and listen to her old albums all the way through. Oh, I certainly will. Start to finish.

songwriting. Yeah. And by the way, with the chapel rowing of it all, I am just happy that people got on board in the way they have. It doesn't even matter for me to take credit because I passed... Of course. And you know you don't. You know. Every single time I say, listen...

It was a straight man that told me about her. And I say his name with my full chest, Matthew Vaughn. And I say he is due the respect because he actually tried several times. And I was like, girl, please. Like, I don't know who that is. And I just can't have you introduce a pop girl to me. He was right. He was right. Sometimes you have to listen to these straight men. Like sometimes they might, they might really know something. And this one knows, he knows something about multiple things.

Careful, the things you say. Careful, the children will listen. Children will listen. What else has happened? I've had such a crazy fucking week of my body. Here's what's going on since Italy for me. What do you think it is? Yeah. I don't know. I mean, it's not a bad thing on its face, like me being like a morning person, but I am like only getting like six hours of sleep, which I know is like...

A clean REM cycle thing, but it's like, I do want to feel refreshed and I have not felt refreshed in a while. But that's a lot for you. Six is a lot for you. Girl. Not you. It was probably last year or six months ago, eight months ago, where you said just plainly that you're used to four. We need to figure that out. Is that an anxiety you think? Are you eating right before bed? What do you think it is about the sleep?

I think it might be anxiety. It might be my mattress. I think I might have to swap out the mattress for something softer because we were shooting a month ago and I was, I was, I was laying down in a bed for a scene and it was a soft mattress. And I kind of went, wait a minute. You were like, maybe this is what I've needed all along.

It's that thing. It was right under your nose the whole time. Not to do. Soft mattresses. No, literally. I'm telling you that might be it because, okay, I'm going to reveal. I actually avoid my apartment in New York now. And I think it's actually coloring my New York experience. Because that mattress hurts me. And this is another thing I'll say about Barry's bootcamp.

I am obsessed with Barry's Bootcamp. I really feel like I look the best I have. And I'm so galvanized and I love going. It is just hard on your body if you're not really taking a long time to stretch. And about a month ago, I was being really lax about the stretching and sleeping on a bed in New York that was, let's say...

very firm because the person that owns that place has not a great back and needs a very firm mattress. I don't have that until I'm not stretching and I sleep on a bad mattress. I am now sort of obsessed with LA again solely because of the mattress here, which is what? Let me tell you, a Helix Midnight. Clap, clap, clap. I'm not trying to do an ad, but I am giving testimonial

in many different ways, and saying, this actually is the shit. And my sister got one too, and she's happier than ever. Billie Eilish. Hmm. It sounded like Billie Eilish was your sister there for a second. I don't think that we are, but I'll do the 23andMe. Mm-hmm. Eilish, Irish. Yes. I am...

Just recalibrating things right now. I really am trying to get gut health in check.

Yeah. I ordered a pooping kit. Yeah. I got to poop. I got to scoop. I got to send it back to the lab. Oh, so you're doing it. You're pooping in a bag. I'm pooping in a bag and I am waiting for my microbiome readout so I know what I need to focus on in the gut. I mean, if it's going to help and yield results, I say try every fucking thing. Poop in that bag, sister. For my second brain, which is another name for the stomach. Okay.

Holy fuck.

Where did you get that or did you come up with it? No, no, no. A lot of gut health people say that. That the stomach is the second brain? You know what? Yeah, because it thinks for itself. It talks to your brain and it thinks for itself. Wow. I love that. Your stomach is your second brain, honey. Sometimes my stomach has bad ideas. Let me tell you something. Sometimes my stomach is my, you know, first brain and sometimes my brain is my second stomach. No, we talked about this because... Do we did? Yeah.

We did. Remember we texted about this? I told you. Oh, maybe I said this to Jared, but I told you. Okay, I'm just going to be really honest because I'm in my honesty era. I'm TikToking a lot and I'm here sort of saying, go Kamala. So I'm just going to come out here and say this. Within this year, I have, let's put it like this, lost my shit.

And it happened very close to my actual bathroom. And it took me by surprise. You did tell me about this. I shit my pants, actually, because I had eaten badly the night before. And I had a cold brew. And I was actually, I knew it was going to be an emergency. And so I was in the elevator and I was like, oh my God, this cannot move fast enough. And it quite in fact could not because in my elevator in New York, let's just say I ruined my Brooks Marks pants.

And I'm sorry, Brooks. It wasn't. It has nothing to do with you. It had nothing to do with you. In fact, I would say I felt so comfortable in your stuff.

You know what I mean? And I also know I'm putting this out there and I'm sort of getting very fecal. And I'm sort of joining my sister in fecal confessions. In fecal confessions. One more thing about the Brooks Marks thing. His initials are BM and they're all over the pants. And that's what you had. I hadn't even considered that until now. You had a BM and a BM. I had a BM and a BM. And that's actually real culture number 19. Yeah.

I had a BM and a BM. Yeah, so, but luckily he had sent three pairs. So I still have my other two, but the other ones had to go. So what I'm saying is my stomach was acting as a second brain where it actually, I'm telling you, I was thinking so hard with my brain and trying so hard with pretty much every part of my body, including it. My stomach was making executive decisions. Decisions. Executive function was in the stomach.

100%. And the butthole was an accomplice. Yeah. I mean, that is like, you know, I think like parasympathetic. Like your butt kind of like, I always thought the butthole had a mind of its own, but I think the stomach is the one pulling all the strings. Stomach is like the twist villain at the end of a movie.

Like it was her all along. Yeah. Can I say something? I know this was not everyone's favorite episode. The Tyler Henry Hollywood medium episode. I know that it was not everyone's favorite episode. Not everyone liked that health came up during that reading. It's iconic. He said to me, you need to watch your stomach and your gut stuff. And I was like, okay. And I do think now it's sort of an iconic moment because let me tell you, the spirits got me on that one.

Let me tell you, that doodler knows what he's talking about. But wait, can I say, this is another reason. He has the gift. This is another reason why you can't be eating bad at night. And I ask you, do you ever eat like really late or eat garbage at night? Sure. You do. Okay. But this is all part of my own pooping in a bag journey. Like I'm really, I really want to get into not, I'm not like...

Oura raincoat and I'm not about to get my fucking like all my biometrics so I can optimize and shit. I just want to know. I just want to poop in a bag and know what my microbiome is. That's all. I really just want to know names. I want to know like, ooh, I'm going to eat more spirulina, like whatever. Yeah. Yeah. Well, first of all, like, yeah, it's going to improve your life exponentially. I'm so excited. One thing you can definitely do though, like right on the outset, one thing you can definitely do is just not

eat before you go to bed because I do think that that look just confronting our mid 30s head on there's something with that it's like my stomach when that when I was doing that and I've had to fight especially as someone who loves reefer in the nighttime it's hard you can not eat before you go to bed because your stomach is so pissed off in the morning and you wake up so much earlier than you would have yes because your stomach's making decisions

Of course. Second brain. If you are going to eat something, little baby tomato, little carrot stick, little grape, that'll do you. Yes. You know what? What? You're right. And literally, you know what I've become really obsessed with? Cucumber. Bitch. You've never eaten a vegetable more refreshing.

Literally, it's hydrating. It's aesthetically pleasing. It's easy to prepare. And get this, you can even dress up your cucumber. This is what you do. I feel like Anthony Porowski. Yes. Literally.

I've actually never felt more like Anthony than recently. We love negative. I don't care. I'm climbing cringe mountain and I'm sliding down the other end. I love him. Guess who climbed cringe mountain? Anthony. And guess who's got many books out and looks like Anthony. Come on. Sometimes I see pictures of him and I'm like, well, there he is the world's hottest man. And it's okay. It's okay. Anyway, irrespective of that, people think that about me all the time.

It's literally like that's something the three of us all share. It's okay. What I'm saying is this is what you do. You chop up your cucumber. I'm with you. You get a little hot sauce. I think I'm with you. Like mild. And I'm not talking about like go crazy. I'm talking about like some Cholula even. You put a little bit of Cholula on the thing, a little bit of salt and pepper, a little bit of salt and pepper.

But then what you do is you just rub the cucumbers all up around in the hot sauce and stuff. So it's almost like dressing. It's like almost like, like buffalo cucumber. And then you eat the cucumber. It is the best snack. It's actually a nominee for best snack. Best snack? Yes, bro. How would you see it on the card? Best snack. Cucumbers with hot sauce. A little.

A little salt and pepper. Felt like that. A little salt and pepper, like eating buffalo cucumber? Yeah. I don't know if I would go as far as to call it buffalo cucumber because I think what you immediately think of is fried cauliflower. And I can't... This is still on the card? This is still the nominee name? No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I think it should be. I personally... All of a sudden, a nominee has like a subheader.

Like below the line. This nominee deserves. The Fellowship of the Ring. This is cucumber, buffalo sauce, but the thing is a little bit of salt and pepper and then you... It's like a Fiona Apple album. It's a Fiona Apple album. Well, anyway, I swear by this snack. I learned it from my father. I got it from my daddy.

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Are you curious about the world of queer sexuality cruising and expanding your horizons? Well, just hit play on the fiercely sex-positive and deeply entertaining podcast, Sniffy's Cruising Confessions. Join hosts Gabe Gonzalez and Chris Patterson-Rosso as they explore gay culture through candid conversations with special guests

intimate revelations from their own lives, and plenty of practical advice to navigate your journey. Their goal is that Sniffy's Cruise and Confessions will help to broaden minds, expand understanding, and entertain your pants off. You owe it to yourself to tune in. Every week, you'll learn about underground sex scenes, hear titillating true stories that will make your jaws drop, and get sexpert guidance that will give you the confidence and empowerment to go after your true goals. It's unlike any other show out there. You've really got to hear it to believe it.

So be sure to tune in to Sniffy's Cruising Confessions, sponsored by Gilead, now on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. New episodes every Thursday. Let me tell you something. If you climb Cranes Mountain, you'll slide down the slide.

That's what I think is on the other end of Cridge Mountain, like a slide, like a really fun slide. I'm very into slide culture recently because I went on a vacation where they had a water slide. And you saw me at the Bahamar the first time we went. Oh, you were so happy. You know I'll do any water slide. You love a slide. Love it. Slide cane. I don't care what it does to my back.

in regards to scratches. I really don't. Like, I love going down a slide. I love... What was it? There was something I recently did where I was like, oh, it was when we were in Sicily. I never did jump off that big rock.

I think it's fine. I don't think you needed to do that. It's a big rock. But you know, I was diving off the smaller rock. Yeah, and you were having a great time. And I think sometimes you got to cap it and be like, that's enough for me. Yeah, like there was no real reason for me to dive off a rock that was, how high would you say that was? That was like 70 feet high. 70 feet high. Seven stories, Matt, come on. You don't need to do that. Yeah. You really don't.

There's a little part of me. This is who the little kid in me is. And this is maybe different from the way you were, but not so. The little kid in me was like an aspiring daredevil. Like wanted was obsessed with doing like bungee jumping and like really couldn't wait to jump out of a plane to the point where I jumped out of a plane at 18. And it's I've never been the same. It was horrible. Horrible.

You're not... Human beings aren't supposed to do that. What's the most extreme thing you've ever done? I really don't think I've done extreme things. I guess, you know what, if I could use conjecture on you? Yeah. Have you ever done like black diamond skiing? Um, sure. Then maybe that. Maybe that. If you can think of the sensation of that, are you comfortable? No. See? I hate it. So it certainly shouldn't get...

darker and worse you mean like double black diamond like what i'm saying is like darker in terms of like why we're doing this like yeah like throwing yourself out of a plane is dark it's so dark oh that's what you're saying yeah it's like it's like bungee jumping it's a little dark it's like why are we doing anything where you're not gonna die but like more likely you could die

much more likely now that you could die for however long you're doing this activity. I think anytime you yourself become a flying projectile at high speed, you've placed yourself in a more dangerous... At a high risk for death. Correct. We're now at the level of high risk. And the high risk is relative, of course, but like,

You just have to think about relative to what? Because relative to you being on the ground, so much higher capacity and possibility for death if you're up in the sky and about to jump out of a plane. I think about what it felt like to careen through the sky. What do you remember? Walk us through. Honey, I remember the whole... You know there's video of it. I have to find the DVD and put it online. It is... First of all, it's me at 18...

fresh from graduating, so closeted. Like, he's in the voice doing the giving shows. Giving shows. Like, they strapped me, because you have to do tandem. I'm sure I've told this before.

But like they strap a man on you. So you go tandem. This guy had this highest spikiest like hair. I joke that I don't remember his name, but the only name I can give him in retrospect is Trask. He seemed like a Trask to me. First of all, you have a thing with the name Trask. You love Trask. Has it come through before? I'm flashing back to all these moments before we're like,

in like a sketch or like in an improv show or something, you'll be like, I'm Trask. And I'm like, okay, this guy loves the OC or he loves East of Eden, something. He loves Oliver Trask. You know, whenever I'm Trask and know that if Bowen and I ever write or create anything, wink, wink, and there's someone named Trask,

That character, there's something about that character. If we ever name a character Trask, and you ever in media, if Trask ever appears, know that that's for a reason. Because this guy was such a Trask. We... The way that you skydive, and I went with all my male friends and my one girlfriend, Lorianne, and...

You have to sit 30,000, no 13, what is it? 13,000 feet in the air when you skydive, 30,000 when you like fly for real. Shaking my head. You have to sit on, like they open the door and you sit with your legs dangling, nothing beneath you. And then you go, you literally go, you rock one, rock two, and then you are supposed to front flip the,

out of a plane. And then after the one flip, you sort of like toss your arms and legs back and sort of get into like, almost like you're a soup bowl belly down. That's like the position you're supposed to be in with someone on your back. That sensation, you sort of adjust to six or seven seconds in because it starts to feel like when you put your hand out of a car window on the highway.

Just that air. You start to just feel, once you adjust to the zero gravity, you start to just feel that all over your body. Then it gets a little fun. Then, by the way, this is all on tape. Then they pull the parachute. And what they don't tell you is when they pull the parachute, Bowen. It fucking pulls you. Yes. But that's not even the worst part. Yes, there is a jostling and you get pulled and you like land.

There's a 10 to 12 second feeling of euphoria that you did it. Then you realize the worst is yet to come, hon, because you're still 3,000 feet off the fucking ground. And there is nothing beneath you. But there is a man on your back. And he's Trask, babe. And Trask doesn't play by the rules. Something to know about Trask.

Trask has the ability to sort of like make you go left and right. And even in some cases do like flips as you go down. They'll ask you if you want that. It's just whether or not you're an 18 year old closeted person whose number one goal in life is to make straight men feel like you're okay. You know what I mean? If you're not that person, you might say something like, no, no, no. Oh my gosh, I've had enough. Let's just float down. I'm not really feeling great.

Or you could be that person and you say, for sure. And you end up- What person were you? You were that? You were for sure? I was me. I was me then. You were you then. This was me. Because I floated down.

for nine minutes, dry heaving, vomiting in my shirt with this man on my back, spitting into my t-shirt, coughing, spurting, spitting, gagging for nine minutes until we landed. And then when I land, I have to find this video. When I land, the camera picks me up again and I'm cross-eyed. I pull myself up off the ground and then go, you're going to do it again? And I just give a thumbs up like this. Get the screenshot.

I just give a thumbs up like, yep, I'll be back. And then they freeze frame on my face. By the way, the song that's playing is like, we're going to the place where we belong. Hell. Like, that's like the song that's like being sung. I, I, that I just made that up, but that was the genre. And like,

I've never felt worse or more terrified in my life than in that moment. It's all on tape. And that is when I developed fear. That moment is when I developed physical, atmospheric fear. I always had emotional fear. Again, closeted, 18. But this was different. I no longer identified as someone who wanted to push any limits. That is, to me, and please tell me if I'm out of line, so fortunate that you have this on tape. Yeah.

Because guess what that moment is? Tell me what it is. And tell everyone, too. Well, there's climbing Cringe Mountain, and then there's jumping out of Cringe Airlines. Yep. And you jumped out of Cringe Airlines at the literal peak of your cringe, which was, I need to make sure these straight boys still like me and think I'm funny and want to hang out with me. Yes. And I hope Trask, like...

doesn't mind that I like the way his crotch feels on my butt. I have to tell you, I couldn't have been less horny. I was gagging, spurting, vomiting, and spitting in the air. I wasn't even thinking about dicks in my butt. And later I would all the time. Of course. Not soon after that moment, I'm sure. No. You literally were throwing up on yourself.

Your own fucking discharge covering you. Oh, yeah. Being humiliated by these men who ask you after this life-threatening, violatory experience you've had, go, want to do that again? And you have no choice but to throw your thumbs up because your psyche has been so, for an entire life, bludgeoned by patriarchy. That is all on tape.

I have to find it. You can document, but you literally have something outside of your own memory of it that exists where you can point to that and be like, this is the day that I climbed Cringe Mountain, that I jumped out of Cringe Airlines. Yeah. You are a better person for it. Oh, I 100% am because I'm alive. Who knows at that rate? Had I enjoyed that? Get this. This is the part where the story gets really fucking crazy. So one of my friends, Kevin...

loved the experience. And the guys were telling us about their job, the people that would jump tandem. We were like, how many times do you guys do this a day? Trask goes, 19 times a day is usually how many times I do that. I go, holy fucking shit. And I guess it computed to us as,

These guys do this every day. Let's say they work four or five times a week, 19 times a day. They jump out of a plane, I don't know, let's say 100 times a week. And they've all done this for a while.

It just doesn't happen that there's accidents, right? You know what I mean? Like clearly this is just like any other recreational activity. It's like going to a theme park and strapping into a roller coaster. You're actually safer there than you are on the open road. Got it. It's monitored thing. Nevermind the paperwork they make you sign before you can even do it. That's like, if you die, you can't sue. Nevermind that. It doesn't happen. Kevin went again. I babe, when they landed, which they did, thank God the guy goes to him.

dude, we had to go to the backup shoot. He goes, what? He goes, we had to go to the backup shoot. I pulled the first shoot. The thing didn't come out. It has never happened to me before. I'm not going to lie. There was about a 10 second period where I was really scared on your back, really scared. And then I just got my wits about me and pulled the backup shoot. And thank God I remembered where it was, et cetera. But the point being,

They had to go to the backup. What? What? And he never went again. This is the perfect...

thing to unpack. Yeah. For you, for the state of the world. You don't have to jump out the mountain. Like just because you think it's going to be exciting. It's okay. Let someone else jump out the plane, jump out the plane. You mean jump out the plane, climb the mountain. You don't know what we're saying. I mean, if you don't have to climb cringe mountain, if you don't have a cringe mountain in your horizon, bless you.

I hope, I pray that you never have to climb cringe mountain. No, I think everyone should climb cringe mountain. Everyone should climb cringe mountain. Well, yes, this is like my theory on like queerness. Like not everyone has to be queer and not everyone will be queer, but they should be. I think that would be nice. You know, like that's how I feel. Yeah. But it's not like, it's obviously not prescriptive and there's no agenda there. It's just, then what would set us apart? Everyone's queer. No one is.

Well, anyway. I hope you don't have to climb Cringe Mountain is what I'm saying. But everyone should because more likely than not, you will come across it in your travels and the travails of your life. Cringe Mountain will be right before you. You will be at the base of it and you have no choice but to climb. Or stand. Or stand. And I guess, oh, this is the last thing I want to say about it.

You know who absolutely was there? The only parents to come watch it was Richard and Katrina Rogers. Richie and Trina showed up and they were like, no, we're going to watch it. I think my mom had it in her head that like, and I used to have this when I was a kid too. Sometimes like,

I, as a little kid, would... Every time my mom left to go to the store, I would be like, I'm coming. And she was like, you don't have to come. And I was like, no, I'm coming. And I think in my head, I was like, if I'm in the car, there can't be an accident. Oh.

Oh, yeah. Of course. Invincible kid syndrome. And you think, like, I'm going to protect my mother by going in the car with her. Like, I know if I'm there, we'll be okay. Because nothing bad can happen to me. Right. I think that my mom thought, like, well, I'm going to go watch it so I can actually see it and it won't be such a big deal. Can you imagine if your parents are there when you throw yourself out of a plane and hit the ground?

I mean, I was going to say that they're very good parents for coming and showing up and watching. No, they are. But that's even more sad. No, no. That's just... Love is not sad. They love you. They love you. You ever seen the movie Simon Birch? No. It's about a boy who's different. And he plays baseball. And he gets on the team. He finally gets on the team. It's like they accept him. And his best friend's mother is played by Ashley Judd. And at the end of the movie...

Like Simon Birch finally gets to like hit the ball. He gets to go bat. Simon Birch connects with the ball, hits the ball. It's a beautiful moment. Whoa, the ball goes into this guy in the parking lot. Ashley Judd is getting out of her car. The ball kills her. It's Ashley Judd in the temple of her head. It, it, but when they run over to Ashley Judd, everyone runs over to Ashley Judd. The coach like takes her pulse. She's dead.

Simon Birch looks at his best friend, whose mother is dead, and played by Ashley Judd, and he says, I'm sorry! And runs away forever. That's what you get for being a good parent showing up to the games. You get a foul ball in the temple. You die for no reason. Simon Birch was released on September 11th, 1990.

Wait a minute. That is such a tragic day. Can I say it's really close to number 50? September 11th. That is such a tragic day. I did not know that Ashley Judd's character dies. Can you read this? Just vindicate me here. Read the synopsis. Go to the end. Okay. By the way, sorry everyone. Spoiler for Simon Birch, a film released on September 11th, 1998. Really the height of Ashley Judd.

During baseball, Simon hits the perfect pitch. It becomes a foul ball that hits Rebecca in the head, killing her. Killing her. Simon gives Joe his prized baseball cards as an apology, to which Joe gives Simon the stuffed armadillo as forgiveness. I mean, he's not going to be forgiven for it. He hit a foul ball at a woman. He murdered. No, he didn't murder. This, you can't even go to, this is an accident. He murdered her, Matt.

It was cold.

blooded murder! Keep reading, because it gets worse. Joe can't... Joe couldn't forgive Simon. Keep going. Joe's grandmother informs Joe that her own death is imminent due to her age, and there must be a plan for him once her time comes, as Rebecca never told anyone who Joe's father was, even in confidence. Simon believes that Joe's father may have taken the baseball that killed Rebecca.

Teaming their gym teacher, a fitting candidate, they break into his office to see if he has it, but it isn't there. Overwhelmed with despair, Joe vandalizes the office. The police chief agrees to release them if they go to the children's retreat over winter break. There's a lot of plot happening in this. I thought that was the end of the movie. I guess not. No, there's two more paragraphs, babe. Wow. This is... Well, just see. Look at how it ends, ends. Please. Please.

While Simon and Joe are riding the bus home, it crashes into a lake. With the driver abandoning the bus and Russell unconscious, Simon takes command and gets everyone out with Joe's help. Wow, but nearly drowns while saving the last child. Joe visits a dying Simon in the hospital, remarking how his small size worked to his advantage in evacuating the kids. They bid each other farewell before Simon dies.

Joe's grandmother passes away that summer and he's adopted by Ben just before his 13th birthday. Back in the present day with adult Joe at Simon's grave, Joe's son, named after Simon, reminds him that he has a soccer game and they drive away as the film ends.

Don't go to the game. An errant ball might kill you if you're a mother. And then don't go to the children's retreat because the bus home might crash into a lake. Have you ever heard something crazier in your life than the plot of that film? Yeah. The 2024 election. Period, bitch. You ate. What's 99 minus 91? Hold on. Eight. Thank you.

♪

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Are you curious about the world of queer sexuality cruising and expanding your horizons? Well, just hit play on the fiercely sex-positive and deeply entertaining podcast, Sniffy's Cruising Confessions. Join hosts Gabe Gonzalez and Chris Patterson-Rosso as they explore gay culture through candid conversations with special guests,

intimate revelations from their own lives, and plenty of practical advice to navigate your journey. Their goal is that Sniffy's Cruise and Confessions will help to broaden minds, expand understanding, and entertain your pants off. You owe it to yourself to tune in. Every week, you'll learn about underground sex scenes, hear titillating true stories that will make your jaws drop, and get sexpert guidance that will give you the confidence and empowerment to go after your true goals. It's unlike any other show out there. You've really got to hear it to believe it.

So be sure to tune in to Sniffy's Cruising Confessions, sponsored by Gilead, now on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. New episodes every Thursday. It's time for I Don't Think So, Honey. This has been, you know, this has been one of those episodes that did it all, I'd say. I absolutely agree with you. And right before we go into I Don't Think So, Honey, I do have to, and I know we quote this like once every couple of years, but, um,

Someone did just randomly post, for no reason really, just posted the scene of Valerie Cherish walking into the HBO offices in season two of The Comeback. And it is, I think, the funniest scene, one of the funniest TV scenes in history. Started it all. Sopranos.

Started it all. Sex in the city. Started it all. I guess I'm one of the girls now. And then she laughs and then she goes over to the Sopranos. Sopranos. Started it all. Started it all. In a different way. Way. Oh, and I, and then she turns to, no, no, she, no, no, then she turns to like, like True Blood or something. She goes, no,

I don't know that one. And she's like, four of them. And she's like, no, don't know that one. I don't know that one. Don't know. Girls. Of course. Lila Durham. The first she goes, oh, this, oh, here we go. And she sees the poster, turns to the camera and goes, new girls. Yes.

New Girls! Maybe the funniest part of the whole scene, which I totally forgot about. I love her. New Girls. Leela Durham. I think it's Leena Dunham. Leena Dunham? That's what I said. Leena. No, see, and then she looks at the poster. It's the perfect scene in terms of character shit, too. It's like...

You know everything about Valerie Cherish in this one scene, and she only says like 12 words total. I mean, first of all, Valerie Cherish is one of the greatest characters in television history. It needn't even be said. Period. There is really no world...

And oh my God. I just thought to myself, there's no way she doesn't have an Emmy for that. Congratulations, my sister, on your Emmy nomination. The third one in this category, fourth overall. Thank you, sister. Very honored. Only six nominees and like fucking Bo and Yang. I really didn't think it was, I really didn't think it was going to happen because I like, I checked. You deserved it. Here's what happened. I checked one prognosticator.

And, like, whatever. I have, like, I have my Google Alert for myself just, you know, just so I'm on top of it. And, like, in the little clipping of the article, it'll always say, like, your, like, whatever your name, whatever the Google term is, and then, like, this, the word surrounding it. And, like, I was, like, oh, like, based off of one little, like...

gleaning of it. I was just like, I don't think it's happening this year. No problem. It's a weird year. I did see you were on the bubble. I, of course, look, I just... I was on the bubble. I loved the Emmy race and you were on the bubble, but I was like, oh, I really just hope that, like, people actually remembered how good your work was because you deserved it. And I'm so happy. Thanks, Queen. I...

feel like I had my best season. I think you did. I was really proud of this last season. So I'm really honored. And it's this thing where let's get real. Let's get honesty zone. Like I brought this up in therapy because like I had this whole thing leading up to like the nominee. I knew a day they weren't going to announce and I was like, cool, got it. But I'm not going to like

emotionally build up anything towards that because I'm just like, I know what this is like and like, it doesn't happen. You know what it's like to get it and not get it. Exactly. And getting it is the whole thing too of like, wow, like am I putting too much meaning in that? So basically I went into therapy the next day being like,

I like have this thing I want to talk about here where I'm like, I had this flash of a thought in my head that it was like, should I feel bad for feeling good? And then my therapist was like, like raised his eyebrow. He was like, well, there you go. Like, I think you just answered your own question. I was like, oh yeah. Like, why would I get in the way of that? I just mean like, um, in terms of like reading up about award shows right now, which is a fun thing I'm doing. Um,

for reasons that don't really have to do with culture where it's just, I was given reading material, Michael Schulman's Oscar Wars. Fabulous. So good. So readable, very thick and encyclopedic, but like the way he writes is so narrative and fun. I am going to pick that up right away. I'm in the market for a new read. It's wonderful. Matt, you're going to fucking love it. Like, you know, the reason the Academy was starting in the first place was to like prey on like an industry of fragile egos and reward them with something annually so that they can like be

be motivated to like produce work at a level that like was not very reasonable at the time. And it was like both an anti-censorship body, great, but also an anti-union body, bad. So it's like, it's so complicated. But like the reason Louis B. Mayer and all these people started, the studio had started the Oscars was because it was like a way to like literally create this validation system that like is meant to make people feel good or bad. And so-

Totally. And that's what's happened. And that's what has happened in other industries outside of film. And wow, crazy, like so fascinating. And then that ties into all this like therapy stuff that I'm talking about where I'm like, I was really like meditating on it and like really like working outside of any model of like feeling validated by it. Cause I was like, I think like,

I'm really proud of my work. That's all that matters. No one else can define that for me. I am so, not even like above it, because I'm certainly not, but I was just like, I was so removed from it that I was like, I can put it over there. And if the nice thing happens, great. If it doesn't, no problem. Like, I'm totally... Your perspective on it was developed and good. Exactly. Especially after, for the third year in a row, producing and hosting an award show, a fake award show that has this thin, gauzy layer between

taking itself just seriously enough and not seriously at all. And also exists to satirize that concept in and of itself. Well, yeah. And then, and then like thinking about like the Emmys or the real thing, it's like, or any real awards system. It's like that, that, that thin layer is just moved to a different place. It's just a different balance of seriously and not seriously. So I say all this and my therapist just goes, well, Bowen, it's entertainment.

Like you, like you doing your award show is entertainment. It's kind of the same idea, like everywhere. Like it is, it is to entertain people. It's a show. It's a show. And I'm like, totally. And that, and that like was kind of liberating where I was like, oh, I'm just part of a show.

You're part of a show. And also just to actually, you know, for a second, I'm part of the way that it deserves. Sure. You're a part of the show. Emmys and not SNL. Right. Yeah. We're talking about the same thing. You're part of the show because the industry that you're in and your peers respect you so much and think if we're going to represent who we are, he should be there.

And I it's interesting to hear you talk about it because I feel similarly. In fact, I did just say the other day, what's crazy about the business is especially for a comedian's coming in. You know, I would I would be really interested to talk to some of our comedian friends who ended up.

being in that arena. It's so wild because when you're coming up, the thing that makes you successful, I think, and the thing that's the North Star and the thing that you all share is you don't take yourself that seriously. And then you're able to really show who your authentic self is and you're able to really tap into what makes you special because you know what? You actually climbed Cringe Mountain in that moment and got rid of your checkpoints in order to let yourself

be who you are and then yes, maybe be viable in the business that you work in. And then when you are, you look around and

And people take themselves so seriously. So seriously. So seriously to the point where you're like, wait, there wasn't just one way into this and a lot of people have been validated in a different way. And so they're going to approach this in a different way. So when I hear real stories about people campaigning for awards who drive themselves nuts and make themselves so unhappy...

I just think what a shame that they don't have perspective on this thing, but also at the same token, you want it. I mean, Amy Poehler has an amazing take on this and her book. Oh, I love it. It's like she talks about like, you know, she really, Amy Poehler really doesn't win a lot of awards. She's nominated a lot, but I feel like the Emmys have not come as freely to her as they have come to like a lot of her peers. Um,

For example, I saw this stat the other day that Maya like wins Emmys like left and right. And now she's nominated again a bunch. And we all know Tina has a ton of Emmys. Amy won like a Golden Globe. And then outside of that, there hasn't been much. And she was talking about it like it's like you're almost resentful of it. Like it's exciting because it's basically like telling a kid like there might there's going to be cookies.

and some of you are going to get to eat the cookies, but only if you're good. And it's like, wow, beforehand, I didn't even know about the cookies. I didn't want the cookie. I didn't care about the cookie. I didn't care. I was just playing in the yard with my friends. Now there's cookies inside, and only a couple of us are going to get it, and it's merit-based, kind of. You know what I mean? It's weird. It's a weird thing. And then to opt into taking that seriously is like...

It's, like, unfortunate, but also you want the fucking cookie because the cookie's going to taste good. And this cookie, if you eat it, you, like, get hotter. It's like there's some incentive because of the way the industry's going to feel about you once you've eaten that particular cookie. It's loaded. It's weird. Yeah. It's loaded. It's weird. And, like, there's even a lot of healthy conversation now about, like...

I'll just say for the way that SNL fits in a category like the comedies where it's one thing that SNL is not evaluated, should not be evaluated, frankly, on the same level as these narrative script, narrative comedies. Yeah. And again, that's not to say that you're not grateful for it and that you don't deserve it. It's just the way they characterize it and categorize it rather is bizarre. Characterize and categorize. Yes, yes, yes, yes.

And it's also this other thing of, like, there's this whole existential thing that's happening with, like, the comedy categories as well. It's like, there's two different things. And so, like, it's a really, like, it's really refracted for me. And I'm kind of like, okay, I'm just, like, happy to be along for the ride, even because none of this makes any sense. Yeah. Like, everyone in my cast should also be nominated, frankly. Yes.

I do have this weirdness around like knowing for a fact that like I represent one very specific way that SNL is represented and it only works if it has this multitude of all those ways. And like everyone who works there, and I mean this, and I've always thought this, I mean this from the bottom of my heart. I feel like everyone who works at SNL,

is really, really just trying to like put on a good show at the end of the day. And that's that.

Yeah. Sorry, I'm getting so stoned and I'm like, I'm like, no, I think it's very like real. And I hadn't thought about it like that. You know what I mean? It's like, there are so many pieces that come together to deliver that, especially at that show. And there really should be, I think if you're going to have a variety sketch category and a variety writing category, it only makes sense to have a variety performance category. Like,

Because to compare your performance and like Eben Moss-Bakarac's performance is odd. You wouldn't do that unless it was a show that you were making up to give out trophies. You know what I mean? And so if we're going to do that, then like at least put

like a category there that could actually honor more talent because so many, so many people on that show deserve that honor. But the characterization of what constitutes a supporting performance in that comedy is just like not necessarily one-to-one inclusive of whatever one does. And also variety performance does not, I don't think it necessitates any sort of like

supporting thing at all. It can just be its own categories. If you...

If we don't move out of this gender binary categorization, then like it should just be two categories. You know what I mean? It's like, then just do the male and female, like whatever that is. So it's just two more. I don't know. Anyway, this is like, these are like late thoughts that Matt and I have. There should be an individual performance category for not only just for SNL, for like late night hosts, for Cynthia Erivo performing on the Kennedy Center Honors. For Cynthia Erivo singing Alfie,

she should be nominated for an Emmy. Like, it's silly that... It's television. Yeah, and they used to have this category and they used to give these out. And so why wouldn't you? Why wouldn't you? But anyway, and I do think that you would have an Emmy by now if there was that category. But regardless, and I think you obviously would have won this year because you're the only one nominated.

So just saying, like there's a way to better quantify these things that then you could have more talent represented across the board and then the show gets more fun. I think. Exactly. Exactly.

Anyway, gosh, now we're doing I Don't Think So, Honey. Now it's I Don't Think So, Honey. And I've decided I don't want to do the one I was going to do. I was going to say I Don't Think So, Honey, Joe Manchin. Do not fucking run, you clown. That's all I want to say. And I'm just going to do a more fun I Don't Think So, Honey, because why not? Okay, great. This is Matt Rogers' I Don't Think So, Honey. His time starts now.

I don't think so, honey, myself on last week's episode, because I did not talk enough about how much fun we had on our vacation. We had so much fun on our vacation. And I feel like I talked mostly about the bags because they were missing at that moment. It was fresh. And it was moments before we were on the mic. You got that call. All that. And it was moments before. I would like to retract my energy. I'd like to contribute this energy.

We stayed at the most beautiful resort in Sicily and we both worked hard to be able to be there. And I'm happy that we were able to get out of our own way and really enjoy that. Look at the fuck where we were. The last night I looked out at the water at the sea and I was just like, my God, this is stunning. And I inspired myself. I was like, I want to go more places. I want to put myself out there more in terms of travel. It was a trip that really moved me forward in that regard. 15 seconds. I loved it.

I loved swimming in that sea. I just loved it. I loved all the food. I loved the people. And I just had the best time. Five seconds. And like, yes, Amsterdam was incredible. I'd been there before. Taylor was amazing. But I just wanted to like shine a light on the trip and how much fun I had with my friends. And I love everyone that I was with. And I just don't think so, honey, to any thought that's not that.

That's one minute. Well, I am so happy to hear that. And for me, like you and travel, yeah, it didn't occur to me before. Like, I always feel like you are such a

you have such a worldly mind and yet you, I feel like you are entering this era now where you're like, you want to see the world. You want to like participate in that activity of like traveling. You know, you guys, there was a minute where it looked like maybe we were going to get to go to Paris for the Olympics. And then that didn't work out, but I was excited about it. I just, I want to go to,

lots of places. I think, you know what happened? Like last year I went to Sydney and I loved it so much. And I was like, I had been to London a few times that year. I was like, I need to travel internationally more because I've just seen what happens when it feels like that moment passes people by. Like I'm from a very blue collar, white,

Long Island family where we only ever really vacationed in Florida. I mean, us going to California was huge when I was 22. Like, we only ever went to Florida. And I just feel like, you know, that's not a given with people. I think that's a thing. It's like, you know, I used to feel like I was climbing Cringe Mountain, you know, saying like, making the joke like, haha, I've only ever been to Epcot. I could only go to Epcot. Like, my parents could only afford Epcot. You know what I mean? So now it's like...

I don't know. Like, I'm connecting with the intrepid bitch in me and wanting to do more things. And it was just... When I heard myself back on the episode, when I listened to it for edits, I felt... I was, like, sick to my stomach the whole time. I was like, God, I hate myself on this episode because that was not my experience. I loved it. But that was...

You being so fresh from bad news, from sitting in this horrible feeling, which was not having your possessions. It's not that you're a materialistic person. It's just that our belongings have this emotional...

hold on us yeah and there were other personal things going on that hadn't been sorted and everything's amazing now but like you know it's just that was not a good day and I didn't want that to be the final word on that trip because I had an unbelievable time yes Bo and Yang do you have an I don't think so honey I do I do

I love this energy before you start one. I do. It makes me very, like, intrigues me. It makes my nipples hard. This is Bowen Yang's I Don't Think So, Honey. His legendary time starts now. I Don't Think So, Honey. What's this gay guy thing where, like, you know for a fact you've talked to this person on the internet in some capacity, whether it's a dating app or it's an Instagram DM or something. It's like, and you see them out in the wild, and

And all they can do is just like furtively glance at you. And like, what, like, this is an endemic thing with all gay men. It's like, can we just like, can we just like not make it weird? If you know someone, you know someone and go up to them and like, say hello. Like we're, there's just this, like, I don't know, maybe we're just shy and we're, we're, we're like prone to hedging when it comes to these social situations. But it's like,

I think we can just not do the thing of pretending like, you know, you've never engaged on the internet before. This thing happens. I mean, this maybe is particular to New York City, but this just happened to me last night at Public Records. Carrie Nation was playing. They were wonderful. But I was just like, there was just that moment happening with a bunch of times where I'm like, I know we know each other and you can just say hello. Yeah, that's what I'm in it. But wait, like, how bizarre, how bizarre. Like, you...

And I have interacted and like, we both know that we've interacted. And so where's this coming from? I don't know. Yeah. And also a little bit of the messaging there is I was talking to you online and now I saw you in person and you're not all that. So I don't want to talk to you.

right that's a little bit of the messaging and i think a little that's how i feel you know what i mean is that is that maybe what it is yeah maybe oh yeah it's totally a thing on like my own self-worth where i'm like well i guess i'm not interesting enough to be talking you know like it's it's yeah like like that it's that it's just like it's the way it makes you feel about yourself and that's extra self-conscious and it was already hard to fucking come here you know i know anyway i had a blast but

Yeah, no, because ultimately you do climb Cringe Mountain and start to slow roll down the hill, but that's literally a climbing Cringe Mountain moment where you're like, oh God. But now we're slow rolling down the hill because we've crested it. I just saw Inside Out 2 and I thought it was so good. And Maya Hawke's characterization of anxiety was amazing. I loved that fucking movie. And I was dragging my feet to see it. And then I saw it and it was pure delight. Love that movie.

Well, that's on reparenting. And this has been an episode of Las Culturistas that has been all about this. Reparenting society. Reparenting...

ourselves. It's all about that. And the way you do that is through community. And speaking of community, on Wednesday, you, me, and Sudi are going to have dinner. And I know we're going to have dinner, but do you want to see Twisters? Yes. We should do that. Yeah. We should see Twisters. Guys, next week, Twisters is going to be covered. And maybe it'll even be a Summer of Con. Although I will say it's going to be hard with the schedules. Yeah. Well, maybe we can figure it out.

Maybe. Maybe. But it might be an autumn of cunt. Yeah.

Just trust and believe that it's coming because it has never been more cunt than this summer. Yeah, it's actually a very... In terms of Matt Bowen's Sooty, it's been a very cunty couple weeks especially, and it's feeling good. The thing about Sooty Green is she's currently writing for the show Loot and is going to be on set working on Loot. And also, Maya may be busy with a character that Sooty had...

helped her with in the past. So it might be a very sooty 2024. It's going to be a sooty Q3, Q4. It's a sooty monomicon. A what? A sooty monomicon. We love you so much. We end every episode with a song. Hit it like grub, pop, pop, pop. Hit it like Kamala. You better vote for Kamala. It's a Kamala nominon. It's a Kamala nominon.

Anyways. Anyways. Your feelings don't matter. Bye. Bye.

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