Kathy Griffin & Her Triumphant Journey From the D-List to the PTSD-List with Trixie
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Oh my gosh, we are here on the pod today. Elephant in the room, not you. What? We didn't even start yet. We swapped out our beloved Katya for an icon, a legend, a star, a multi, multi, multi award-winning Emmy winner, Grammy winner, world touring sensation, somebody who basically put How to Do a Comedy Special on the map. We have Kathy Griffin in the studio today. Yay! Love it!

I'm so excited. Oh my God, she's fantastic. You are fantastic. I'm still singing my own praise. I'm on the D-list now on Forever Trixie. That's true. Back on the D-list where I belong. I am vibrating with horniness about what to ask you because I, normally when we have a guest, I have to learn about them. I really know too much about you. So I have to go back to the D-list because I feel like the more time has gone on. I rewatched it last year and I was like,

It really is prolific what you did. Thank you. I'm so proud of that. Like, I'll never understand.

never understand these people that have, if you're lucky enough to be known for a show or a record or whatever, and they're like, don't talk to me about that. That's my old persona. I love it when people say I watched The D-List as a kid, or I watched it with my mom, or it's nostalgic. I love it. I'm all for it. So thank you. At the time, I feel like it was obviously almost while it was on like cult level, like people who watched it

lived by it. And then as you got awards and stuff, the secret kind of got out. Yeah. But even the earlier seasons, how did you pitch something that was so...

It was almost post-reality show, what you were doing. It was. You know what? I couldn't do that show today because there aren't any shows on that are that real. You know, now that we're in sort of the Kardashian, the Hills, like that's when it became what they call soft scripted. But the D-list was so real. And first of all, the schedule was insane because I think it was only six episodes, season one, and we shot for six months.

Which was nuts. Because they're actually taping like a doc. They're just taping you, hoping you say some funny shit. And so they came with me everywhere. I came up with the episode ideas based around my schedule because I'm truly such a D-lister that basically I said, we don't need to make up anything. You just need to follow my ass around and see the crazy people in my life and what I do. Like, because they would pitch stuff in the later seasons. Like, what if...

you're on a golf cart and you don't know how to drive it. I'm like, okay, that's never been done. You're like, by the way, I don't know how to drive it. No, why would I? And so, you know, are they, they always wanted to like, try to kill me. Like they were like, what if you jumped out of a plane? I'm like, what if I didn't, what if I didn't, what if I lived? All your haters behind the scenes are like, what if she was buried alive? Yes. Yeah. Ratings. It's pretty amazing because like,

Well, the way I recall it is reality TV was still kind of finding its footing and you created something that almost was spoofing having your own reality show. I wanted to be a sitcom disguised as a reality show because I really, what, what NBC did was they told me I was going to get my own Seinfeldian type of expensive four camera sitcom with a live audience and big money. And

And then they said, actually, we think we don't need to hire any writers and we can just follow you around and you're funny, which like an idiot I took as a compliment.

But you're like, so you want me to do all the work for the same money? Love it. Oh, a fraction. So, yeah. So there were no writers. There were no segment producers. It was just, you know, a good production company. But by the way, their only other show that they had ever done was Celebrity Poker Showdown, which was also in Bravo. So they went from that to like, OK, we're just getting on. We're getting on Southwest with Kathy Griffin and we're going to visit her on her gig in Poughkeepsie.

And, you know, that was my life. And I used to say to them,

You know, my life is that show, whether you film it or not. Right. So honestly, the D-list has never stopped for me. There are still episodes every week. It's just my life. No one's taking it. Well, it's sort of on social. You're very active on social media. So you can kind of get a taste of the D-list. Yeah. I mean, listen, the bigger your houses get, the harder it is to use that D-list word. It's harder. Right. And the more the Kardashians send me flowers because, you know, I had to make nice with them. Right. Because I'm scared of the mother. Well, you should be. I believe she's killed people.

Now, I'm not saying she meant it, and I'm not saying she personally killed them,

But I believe she has called what they call called out hits or put out hits. Do you think if she adopted you, it'd be good for your career? Absolutely. I have begged. I have begged. You'd be like, here's my sex tape. And people are like, yawn. I know they don't care. I actually have put out seven sex tapes. You've just never heard of any of them. That's how D-list I am. They get scrubbed from the internet. Yes. No one cares. But yes, I want, what about you? What if Kris Jenner said, I'm going to manage you? I would probably have to dye my hair dark.

Because don't the Jenner Kardashian family is all dark hair. Yeah, but remember they go through faces. Remember Kim had that like silvery blonde. Yes, yes, yes.

In the dark Pete Davidson months. Right. And they were dark months. The mere weeks. The mere weeks of that confusion. Didn't you love the, did you see the, where was my wedding? Italy. Who sang at my wedding? Right. Andrea Bocelli. Right. They're saying you stole my wedding country. You stole my wedding. You stole Dolce and Gabbana. From me. Both of them. And I owned them. Right. I had them locked away. Locked away because Chris signed some sort of deal in blood with them as well.

It was, you know what the great thing about D-List too is we got, in the first season you really did sell it as D-List. We see you sometimes doing your own makeup. Oh yeah. We see you sometimes, you know, and then we have these. I still do that like on the road. I don't like bring anybody on the road. I'm too cheap for that. Thank you. Like I could. Yeah. But no, I'm going to pocket that money.

Yeah. The only nice thing about a glam team is if you look bad, you get to blame someone. Oh, nice. Your fault. Whereas if like, if I'm on something, I look bad. I'm like, you fucker. Like open your eyes. Owning it. I hate that. Yeah. But on my D list, we got to see you. Once you started actually genuinely snatching trophies, it was like, it was like, well, we're watching someone's career reach a peak in a way that felt

Because it felt real, it felt so gratifying to watch you get those wins. No one was more surprised than I. Never in my life. I remember this is an industry that has told me for decades, your nose is too big, you're too fat, you're too this, you're too... And over and over and over. And that's just for me. Just from you and your family. Yeah. And your family. My mother. To bring your mother into this, all people. But that was shocking to me.

And then, of course, by the way, then I thought, oh, wow.

I'm going to get like that quick episode pickup and then they're going to pay me five. No, they still like didn't pick up the show until after the contract expired. And then every season I would foot the first like three weeks of filming because Bravo still hadn't officially picked up the show. But there'd be something happening in my life that I knew would be gold for the show. And I'd be like, let's just film. So I had no like leverage. That is so interesting. I was too happy to do it.

it. They always say in TV, like, don't spend your money. They're always like, don't spend your money. But in reality, when they haven't renewed something, like we just filmed season two of Trixie Motel. Yeah. And by the way, your show was such an inspiration for that. Oh, thanks. Thanks. Well, I love your show. It's awesome. Thank you. And also just having the hotel as the backdrop is brilliant and you as your character and all this stuff you improvise is awesome.

Thank you. Well, we got the Salt Lake City girls there a few weeks ago. I saw every minute of it. Screaming and drinking, Kathy. I have watched every frame of those non-Mormons. It's fierce. I don't know if there's one more.

Mormon on the show. It's incredible how it's like, I don't know if your son should go on a mission trip. By the way, I sell tequila. Do you want to meet? It's very high low. Yes. She's very godly. Although I actually like all of them. Of course. Me too. I am confused by some of them. I am confused by Whitney and her husband. Cause I don't know. This is a problem I have.

Because you know my dirty secret is I'm really good with money. Like Susie Orman is one of my best friends. I love the Susie Orman Women and Money podcast. She is fantastic. She's everything to me. She's never steered me wrong. That is not a good investment, girlfriend. Denied. Denied. God forbid somebody calls in and they're like, my husband spent our money on a boat. If it's

It's a man's thing. She hates when you buy him. She loses her mind. Right. Also, since she has a boat. She's like, you should be eating pussy, girlfriend. Right. That's right. Denied. Denied. Right. Approved. But she's so smart. And KT, her partner, is on it with her. Yes. And KT's also like a brilliant businesswoman. So, you know, the lesbians, they always figure it out. Are you kidding me? If you're in trouble, you call the lesbians. Are you kidding me? Girl, I was in Palm Springs Pride last weekend, which I know you're like the mayor of Palm Springs in a way. Sure.

I was there and I met the fire department and it was all gay guys. And I was like, yeah, the fire department's gay guys. And then I went, wait a minute. We want the lesbians. Right. Who's going to really put out the fire? And who's going to get that ladder out of the truck in under four seconds? No kidding. Do I want a gay guy running into a room and going, it's smoky in here. No. Worry about his figure? No. I want a lesbian who gets the job done. Thank you. Like the zip line through the window, save the baby, breastfeed even. We're all making out. Right, right, right. It was just...

D-List was amazing and you just deserved everything. You really helped create a whole genre of television. You know, I was really inspired by, believe it or not, I really loved Osbournes and Nick and Jessica. Osbournes and Spears. And I knew Nick and Jessica was real and I did have a conversation with them about

I said, how do you guys do this when you're like actually married? And I remember Nick Lachey saying, don't ever let them film in the bedroom. And I was like, okay, that's my rule. It went out the window episode one. Girl. Because you go where the funny stuff happens. Totally. If I'm being funny and I walk into the bedroom, get that camera in there. Yeah. I might not be funny for 17 or 18 more minutes. You have a three minute window a day where I'm entertaining and the rest is me spooning pudding. Thank you. I remember my first, like when we sold Trixie Motel, I was like, well, I just don't want my relationship in it.

It's a Reno show. They're like, your partner's in it. Yeah. Whether you like it or not, bitch. And I'm like, well, what if we get in a fight? They're like, we'll be there. I'm like, great. Right. But that's really like, Reno and all that is soft scratch, but with your show, you could really tell that sink or swim, those cameras were just there. They were there. I mean- In your house is a different level of invasive too. Yeah. And also, you know, I didn't even know that like other people that have reality shows don't film at their actual house. That is so crazy to me. That is my real house. That is so crazy to me.

And we didn't have like, they just took the garage and made it video village. Like where they're watching to see like what the cameras are doing. Oh yeah, no air conditioning. Many times we had one camera. Love. One. And a big day was two. And you were thankful for it. Oh yeah. Two camera day was like, woohoo, Super Bowl. Yeah. Yeah.

And also I was lucky that I really had an instinct that my mom and dad would pop. And thank God the network's notes every year were more John and Maggie. And they became like the beloved. In fact, I wish they would have done a spinoff because my mom and dad were so naturally funny. And you know how that is. Sometimes when people are on camera on a reality show, they turn into a different person. Like without naming names, have you ever had anybody on your show where you're filming and then all of a sudden you go,

oh, this person's not acting like themselves at all. They're kind of freaking out. Well, sometimes people do what they think you're supposed to do on TV. Which would be outrageous or what? Like when people audition for Drag Race, I know that they kind of put on a persona a lot of times. But like on our show, on Trixie Motel, the reason David is compelling is because he doesn't want to be on television. Right.

And like your parents, people who don't care what the camera thinks. Right. That's interesting. Yeah. My parents were like 90. They were going to use this as a stepping stone to their career. They're at a TV table insulting you. They did it until they died. I basically killed them with reality television. I killed them with that show. What a way to go. Oh my God. My mother lived for her fame. She would go to the gay Starbucks in Santa Monica. And pretend to be inconvenienced by being noticed. Pretend to not have any money. And you know, a gay picked up her tab and I am not even kidding.

First of all, she would bitch to the barista about how expensive it was because in her day it was a quarter. Then some gay, a bear, an otter, whatever, would be behind her. Next thing you know, she didn't pay for a Starbucks for seven years. And she was like, are you sure? Yeah. Are you sure? Is it okay? Oh, I can't find my damn pocketbook. You know, she knew where the money was. She fucking knew where it was. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

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I will say too, I mentioned this. I think you're here because you saw a clip of me talking about your amazing career. Oh my God. That was so like, I was practically crying. That was so sweet. Never expected you to do that. We have a mutual friend, Sia. Yes. That's how I got connected to you. But I never thought you would see that. I just was in bed one night and I was like thinking of your whole career and everything. And I was just like, somebody, you just have achieved so much without rich white straight men throwing money at you.

Uh, they don't care for me. I know. And by the way, on this tour, by the way, the name of the tour is Kathy Griffin, the might, my life on the PTSD list tour. And cause you know, I've been through some shit, but I, the other thing is I am sorry. I am not looking to broaden my base this time at all. My whole career. It's like, get the younger people, get the streak. No, no. I just want my ladies and gays. I just want my ladies and gays to come out because I,

Who am I kidding? It's always been ladies and gays and I've been fine. So, yeah. So I have like since I was, you know, canceled with the whole Trump thing and everything. This is my first tour in six years. So people have been afraid to hire me in America. Yes. And overseas. I'm a freaking hero. People have been afraid to hire me for six years.

I'm probably at this condo taken away for you being here. Say it was Reba. Say it was Reba. I'm going to blow out just your face and tell people you're going to have to pick up a southern accent. Or Kathy Lee Gifford. Or Kathy Lee Gifford. I also, I was reviewing because I've seen all your specials and some of the early ones you can tell it's just like you have all this raw talent and especially your first special is called like Hot Cup of Talk, I think. Yeah.

And you even mentioned like how low budged the special was. Oh yeah. You look gorgeous. You're hilarious. You're in like a cheese. I was just getting my feet wet. Like you're so young and. And I, yeah, I mean, I, I haven't seen them since they came out, but I remember, first of all, I remember thinking I bombed at that first taping and I think I even cried between shows because they do let you tape twice. Right.

And it was at the Fillmore in San Francisco. And I think the other comic that night was David Cross, who is brilliant, but not a good combo with me. So of course I was like, I think they love David. And I think they looked at me like, what is she? Why is that Lindsay Lohan story taking so long? I'm like, cause I have a lot to say about her. 20 at the time. Okay. I'm 63 now. Well, first of all, I started really late. So I wasn't even on television until I was 36. Right. So I did my first commercial at 18 in Chicago.

And then I didn't have like a TV job. I was in the groundlings for a million years. Like I just couldn't get a break. And then finally I started doing standup and everything changed. And then I got like five guest spots in one year.

And then I got on the show Suddenly Susan. And then after that, that led to HBO specials. Then that led to Bravo saying, we want to do specials and have you do an unscripted sitcom. And then the deal has started and then lots of specials. And I have done 21 standup specials and I loved every second of it. And for a while you were putting them out like at least one a year. Yeah. One or two a year.

And you came out with them so fast. I mean, I remember Hot Cup of Talk, which is so early and you must have been like your mid thirties in there. You're so young. And then I think maybe the second one was allegedly maybe. And I mean, even those early ones, you just were doing something no one had done. And if I know correctly, you have bought back a lot of your specials. I bought back my entire library and I bought back my life on the D list because. How does that work? First of all, nobody wants it, which is the joke. Oh.

So they're like, can I buy this? They're like, please. No, thanks. No. I mean, I thought the streamers were going to be lining up for the big check, not even peacock. And I actually think it's cause Andy Cohen like hates me so much. You thought maybe after the cancellation deal, this would have been like hot commodity by it now. Because first, well, first of all, so much time has passed since the Trump thing. I thought, well, people aren't mad at me anymore. So maybe they've sort of forgiven me and now they can go, we actually liked her during the D list. She's harmless.

But I think, you know, now it's, like I said, I think that I probably have burned every bridge I have at NBC Universal. I hate to say that because I, when I think back on like my issues with Andy Cohen, I swear to God, I never meant for it to go south. I,

I would hit him up when he was my executive and be like, please, can this segment with Lily Tomlin be longer? She stayed overnight in Canada film with us for free. She's amazing. Like I didn't, I was, I was so naive. I didn't get that. Whether it was Andy or someone else, a male executive, uh,

saw that as difficult or bitchy or whatever. But that's probably what started it. And I have to say, I came to have that kind of a relationship with Les Moonves, who used to be the head of CBS, Jeff Zucker, who used to be the head of CNN. But honestly, I always thought when I was corresponding with these guys, number one, I didn't know they are appalled when the talent personally reaches out.

Like, I didn't know those guys would be like, how dare you contact me personally? And then the people under them feel like you went over their head or whatever. Yeah. But I thought that's what a business person did. And the guys that I know, my peers, that's what they all did. So I was like, well, I'm just doing what the guys talked about and it worked for them. But, you know, it's definitely been fun.

ridiculously tough in that area. And now what scares me is there's only like a handful of older white dudes that control everything. Like David Zaslav now owns CNN, Discovery Networks. Like they own so much. I don't even,

don't even know the executives anymore. Like I've been canceled so long. I don't know who's running CBS or ABC. Like I guess Bob Iger is ABC. I mean, and you never know behind the scenes, the tree of who's in charge of you. Technically you never know who is on your team or not. Cause some people, I was on a show where they,

They didn't, they renewed after someone was moved and they were like, oh, that was the person who didn't like your show. And then when someone else was hired, you never know what the complicated puzzle is of why that yes or no got to you. Right.

And for you, especially, I mean, this is also, you got to think a lot of years ago, it's not even great for women in comedy now. No. Think decades ago. I wish I could say it was better. And when I meet younger girl comics, I wish I could say, oh, well, Joan Rivers went through that. So you don't have to or whatever. But Joan and I would talk about that all the time. And she would say, because Joan's Joan was Phyllis Diller. And Joan would say, Phyllis and I talk about this.

how it's just as bad now as it was in Phyllis's time. And bad in new ways. Right. And I would say to Joan, Joan, I don't think it's better for me. It's somewhat better. I shouldn't say that because Joan had it harder than I, for sure. Of course. But...

I am shocked at how it hasn't gotten better. And I'm still disappointed that there aren't more women, people of color, gay people at the really upper echelon levels. I call them the check signers because there are a lot of powerful people that are ladies and gays, people of color, both, whatever. But I'm talking the really big check signers and the ones who

who can look at someone like me now that I've been through a controversy and just go, just too much trouble. And I didn't know that. So,

you know, making friends with the executives. I don't know if it really does anything because they kind of like, Joan Rivers, she's called the movable heads. Ironic that I would make a head joke. But she was saying, she was like, you can take one, the head off one and put them on the other. And she said, but she would say, just do the best work. And so I thought, well, the D-List is a good show. It does well. It's winning awards.

And I kind of got canned anyway. But that's always been the toughest part for me to navigate because I'm still like that. I don't know, not like a little kid, but I'm still that comic that I'm just so consumed with what's making you laugh that I still struggle with like the politics of it. Totally. And I don't know, like my mom would say, your problem, Kathleen, is you always kiss the wrong ass.

You want to know the right ass to kiss. You're kissing the wrong ass. She's like, I'm fine with you kissing asses. But pick the right ass for once. Right. Legates would say you're rimming the wrong ass. I've been rimming the wrong asses. Yeah. Learn from me, young people. Learn from me. Rim the right ass. Rim the right ass, people. Yeah, think. Think about your rimming. I have to think, too. I mean, that went from that...

And I, whenever I watched D-List, I'm always like, I know in the beginning, and I don't want to count your money. I'm like, I know they weren't given this whore a million dollars in production money. No, I made money on touring. Exactly. I was like, God, they probably begrudgingly renewed it every year. Like fine. Like I said, when the contract had already expired,

Then there were like a lot of discussions and then it was kind of like, okay. And then I think it went to eight episodes a year and I don't think it ever went more than eight. So then it became, and this is probably another reason the network people hate me because I would be saying, I know I have 12 episodes in me. Like, come on, it's a low budget show. It's doing well. And they were just hell bent on eight. And I, you know, I probably should have just shut up, but I just kept thinking, I'm

going to win him over this time. And I mean, I still have a little bit of that in me. Well, you actually do win them over because you're still here and you've gotten to pretty much achieve. I mean, everything you've ever in your wildest dreams, wildest dreams, wildest dreams. You've done things that I would even know Joan Rivers is beyond crazy. The fact that we would be friends and I would get to, I would have had the, you know, the, the glory of having conversations with her about the art of standup comedy. Yeah.

is like beyond the people I've been lucky enough to be in the same room with. Like I had a little teeny part in a movie with Robin Williams and I got to like observe him all day on set. And I just was like jaw-dropping.

And so I am still such a nerd in that area. I love seeing my idols. I love seeing just raw talent. Yeah. Like whether they're famous or not. And that's why you're here. To see the raw talent. That's right. Raw talent.

Whether or not anyone knows who they are. Whether or not you put makeup on or not. Right. I also think it's interesting that- But you should start to put your makeup on. Do you think? I mean- Don't you think I have one of those natural faces? I know you got out of the shower, but good God. Oh my gosh. I know I look pretty rough. You look pretty pretty. You look gorgeous. Everybody in a picture next to me looks like they just stepped out of the shower. Yeah.

No matter how much makeup you have on, everyone's just like a normal child. And then this giant woman. No, I wear some glitter and some lashes for you. You look gorgeous. You've always been gorgeous. Oh, stop it. Whoever does all your specials, you've always looked great. They get you together. Yeah, they do. They make up everything. They do. It's an hours long situation, as you know, but it's important. Well, good thing you have a lot of gays in your corner. Oh, yeah. You just did a cruise. I'm not going to let some heterosexual people near me.

They're dangerous. They're dangerous. Mary, when I do a photo shoot and it's a straight person behind the camera, I go, so what are we doing here? Right.

I was on a shoot once. And how about when they want to shoot you from the floor? Honey, baby, darling. No, get up. Stand up. Get up. Stand up, sir. Get up, sir. Why are you on the ground? There are three flights of stairs down. And why aren't you in a harness from the ceiling? Why aren't you in a Diana Ross? When you want to take a picture of me. And where's the fucking wind machine? A ladder should drop from the ceiling. A helicopter should carry you away. And you take it for about 100 yards in the sky.

You'll get it in one shot. You'll get it in one shot. And if you don't, I'm leaving. Not my fault. Thank you. Yeah. I was on a shoot once and this guy, it was all this natural side light. Ugh. What is it, Law and Order? Give me a break. The guy goes, the guy goes,

I go, don't you worry about like the sideline? He goes, oh, don't worry. I'm a master manipulator of light. And I go, okay, are you Thomas Kinkade? Right. Are you Steven Spielberg? Like, what are we doing here? I'm not buying it. I need the beauty dish. I know you like it too. I like a ring of fire. That's see, that's why like I learned from stuff like fucking Barbara Walters who scared the shit out of me till the day she died. But I loved her. Of course. And she would go,

you've got to have an underfill. Well, was your underfill. And then I was like, I, and I didn't quite know what it was, but I started going, yeah, where's the underfill.

under phil who's phil yeah and where why isn't he under me right he's good lighting he's a master of manipulation yeah a master of manipulation i learned from watching rue because you know you've judged drag race we met on season seven because you judged yes i know just the naked runway yeah which was great they're like you're gonna walk naked and then kathy griffin's gonna watch and we're all like first time on tv like okay yeah i know and we walk out there and you're sitting there and you know rue like when they say her name yeah they're like rue and she's like

She turns her head that much. And I was just like, why isn't she looking? I'm like, lighting. Yeah. The magic. Well, Oprah does the same thing. Yeah. Where it's like, what did you say? Right. You get this much rotation. It's just eye movement. She just knows. Yeah. You just did a cruise with the gays, which is about your, how many have you done? It was, and I'd like some kind of fucking prize. I know. It was my 18th.

Gay cruise. Now my husband, that's more than gay guys do. I know my husband, who's my tour manager. It was his 12th gay cruise.

Yeah, he's been around for a while. We've been together 13 years. So yeah, he's seen it all. And so this time... Disgusting people on those cruises. Are you talking about the guns and hoses party? I'm talking about KG, alcohol, uppers, downers, candy corns, butt plugs, tongue up the ass in the daylight. Yeah. And you know what they do? First of all, they have dry erase boards on each cabin door. And so the messages are mostly scheduling. So it's like...

8 a.m. spin class, 10 low carb breakfast, 11. I'm a sloppy bottom. Call me Jonathan cabin 1411. Yes. And then I took pictures of some. One of them was a guy who just wrote, do you like piss? Question mark. Consent matters. That's right. And then there was another one just like who wants to get pummeled instead of fucked?

Well, that's sweet. Well, I guess pummeling is harder. Harder and faster, like Jack Hammer style is what I took it to mean. And then I don't mean to toot my own horn, but I'm basically like a giant A-lister on a gay cruise. Mary, of course you are. I'm like Britney Spears. I don't mean to, and we'll get to her in a minute. But...

But I kind of have to hide in my cabin. Because once the boys see me, then they decorate my cabin door. And they did this time, but they didn't do it to the last day. But over the years, I'm alleging this. I'm alleging that over the years, I've had gays banging on my cabin door at three in the morning after they've left Deck 8 where they have lasers by Kyle. And just banging on the door being like, come here, come.

We love you, Gash. It's a little assaulting. We know you're in there, you ugly cunt. You smelly hole. We love you, bitch. Get out here, you wet pussy. That's right. That's right. Which really means, for gay people, good evening. It means I love you. Yeah. Good evening. How are you? Best wishes. And I am owned and operated, honey. I don't fool myself. Right. I was purchased by gays in about 1994. Wow.

And they kept the receipt. Right. So they showed, bitch, we own and operate you. So I show up and I dance like a goddamn monkey grinder. And I tell my little jokes. And, you know, the late show, I'm just going to say, I've likened it to doing a kid's party. Because in the late show... Because they're blackout, Mary. But the first, like, 40 minutes, they're, like, loud and proud. But it devolves. And then...

I can't trust them to stay in their seats because then they start going to the restroom and hooking up there. Thank you. Well, at least they're not doing it in the seats like Lauren Borbert. Oh, my God. Do you love that? Yes. Vaping and jerking it. Vaping and jerking it with that dude. Kathy and I had a field day with that shit. Right. And wait, what was the play? Beetlejuice the Musical. Right. Nothing sexy. It's not Ghost the Musical. No, it's adorable. It's Beetlejuice. It must have been the most adorable Handy she's ever seen. Up there doing Tim Burton shit and you're like, are you horny? Right. Who isn't? Who isn't? Right.

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I just think it's incredible that you're about to go back on tour in the States. 40 cities. And by the way, I just want to say, I'm doing the real America. The Richmans. Honey, you know what my opening night is? The Joliet Illinois. Literally, hello Des Moines.

Hello, Des Moines. Wait, get the list. Get the list. I want you to read some of the cities. Oh, yeah. Let's do the highlights, shall we? Okay, go. Now, of course, we have the- And I want the city without judgment. Don't do that face. Don't you dare make that face. Listen, I'm going to start with some great ones. Palm Desert, California. There you go. The McCallum. Elderly retired gays. That's right. God's waiting room. I love it. Totally God's waiting room. Calgary. I'm not above it. Obviously. Yeah. At the Jackson or Constantinople. I mean, Providence, Rhode Island. Come on.

I've been, I mean, I've been to all these places. It's, uh, Sacramento, San Jose, California. I'm going where you live people. Maybe, you know, it's like New York, Milan, Long Beach, Long Beach, California. There's nothing wrong with Long Beach. I've heard of Long Beach. There are a couple that I'm not. Where's Red Bank, New Jersey. Oh, I've played that. Is it the count Basie theater? It's the Red Bank, New Jersey, the count Basie center. What's the vibe?

It's a theater crowds, which is good. So although that was one of the theaters that did get death threats after the Trump thing. And so I was supposed to play there six years ago, six and a half, and they had to cancel me because they were getting death threats from the MAGA people. So hopefully I'm sure they've calmed down by now.

And if they won't, they'll just show up. Listen, as long as they buy a ticket. Well, when my shows get protested, and they do, the gays just take care of it. I love getting protested. They just take care of it. When we get protested, you know, any drag stuff. They take care of it with like, it's not even confrontation. It's like subtle shade. Because the gays know, like, don't give the MAGA people really the time of day and stuff. But the gays will just protest.

go up to them and maybe it's like an insult about their outfit and then leave. Totally. It's like a curve. Or the gays are always like, if it's somebody with a sign that says like, Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve, the gays will come up to it with a phone and be like, yeah, they're like taking pictures. Like,

Yes, of course. I think that she used to hire a woman to dress like a church lady and protest her shows. That's genius. Because it is the best marketing. That is genius. I had a church lady one time who had a little teeny card table and she was protesting me and she had cookies and you know those gays ate those cookies. They ate every cookie.

She ran out of cookies. They were like, you're wrong. Give me a cookie. Can I have one of those? I know, homemade? I would have too. And then they came into the theater sitting there with cookies, the nerve. Right, the nerve, the crust. Gay people will turn on you for a cookie. Oh, honey. Well, especially if it's homemade. Of course they will. I mean, you got to think, all your amazing accolades, your career, the time you had in the last few years, do you really feel literally bulletproof now? Oh my God. Nothing will ever take you down, Kathy. I actually take pride in the fact that like,

I stood up to the Department of Justice in one. Mary. Prevailed. I don't hate the government. I didn't become like an I don't trust the government person. I actually think the FBI saved my life a couple of times. And let me say, we got to know each other quite well. The FBI was coming to the house regularly.

quite often to like, let me know when threats were credible versus not credible, et cetera. Did you just wait for bugs and everything? Oh yeah. We did do all kinds of stuff. We had to do dogs at the venues and magnometers and all that stuff. And I'll do that again this time. Um, because the world isn't exactly less crazy, but the good thing is I think people will not be like afraid to come see me at least for that reason. They should be afraid for other reasons, but not because of maggot people protesting, but I expect them. That'll probably happen. And, um,

you know, it's happened before. I mean, when I won my first Emmy, I said, you know, um,

Thank you. This award is my God now. Of course. Because I thought it was funny that people win Emmys. Suck it, Jesus. Yes. And they say, suck it, Jesus. I said, suck it, Jesus. But they're so earnest. Because that's what God's focused on. Right. Your Emmy. Yeah. That's what she is doing with her time. But this is Los Angeles where people find like a good parking spot and they're like, thank God. Thank God. God willed this for me. God got me a princess spot. So I thought everybody would think that was the funniest joke in the world. Not so much.

So there was like a big huzzah about that. So I'm sort of used, I was used to like- Which is a tiny controversy now. Tiny. In retrospect, it's like nothing. It wasn't, I was on the no fly list for that joke. Thank you. I was on the no fly list for two months. Did we have you back on planes? I think. Let's celebrate that, folks. I know. I think. Watch the first one goes down. As if I found a commercial, but I've heard. Oh yeah. Wait, do you do a bus on these tours? No, I fly private. I'm going to lose a fortune. I was just going to say, doesn't that eat the money? Some of it.

But the dogs too. The dogs. You fly with the dogs? Yes. Yeah. That's what Vanderpump does too. She's like, you gotta bring the dogs. Stevie Nicks does that. So I do whatever Stevie says. And I think that's what Jan Crouch did. Didn't she get in trouble for like, didn't she get in trouble because she used to use the church money? I don't know. Well, I'm with you. If I'm getting in trouble, you're here. I'm taking the hit. Kathy told me, no. I think she used to fly her dogs private, even with no one on it. Oh, that's funny. She would fly them to her. That is funny. That's like a doggy private delivery. Yeah. And that's when the church was like,

Is that okay to use our money for that? She was like, well, do you love the Lord? And I am using all church money. And you are sort of a Jew. Again, I'm using my church money again. Totally. So, you know, I'll have to run it by them. You should become a church to go tax exempt. You know what I regret? I regret not being a freaking Christian comic. Those people, they do those mega churches. Oh, sure. And they make a fortune. Instead, I'm trying to be funny like an idiot. Yeah.

I should have been. You still do colleges ever? I do colleges sometimes, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Those are always weirdly... In fact, I know you're from Milwaukee. I'm actually playing Madison instead of Milwaukee. Yeah.

I'll probably go back to Milwaukee, but I have to laugh at like when my agents who I just got a month ago, because no one would touch me for six and a half years. And so now I have an agent, a manager, and they're not afraid of me, which is glorious. They will be. Give it a minute. Give it time. Get those 3am emails from me. Yikes. The best is when, oh my God, have you ever had a publicist call you and go, Hey, how are you doing? And you go, right. Good. And they go,

Have you been on the internet today? Yeah. Have you seen anything? Yeah. That's so bad. No. Did I win an award? And they're like, no. And then you get that pre-diarrhea feeling. Yeah. Have you been online today? It's never. We have. Yeah. And here's how you should respond. We just, or you pick up the phone and they go, Hey, we have so-and-so. It's like, it's like nine people on the call and you go, did something really good happen? And they're like, no. What did I win? Yeah. Yeah.

Oops. Anything like that. Yeah. So you fly private and you get to the gig. Sometimes I'm kind of full of shit. Sometimes I do. Sometimes I don't. You're doing Madison, Wisconsin. Yeah. That is amazing. College town. But that's what cracks me up. Like I said, I'm 63. I don't think college kids don't know who I am. The youths. I don't think the youth know me.

You're going to have to go in there and tell the stories. You can find me on Tik TOK. See, I've started putting my life on the G list on my Tik TOK. You sure have. Because if it's no place else, why not? And maybe the youth can discover me on Tik TOK and I can let them think like I'm their discovery. You know what I mean?

You know what I mean? Like, Oh my God, this is my first tour. Whatever, whatever. You know what I mean? I'm obsessed with the office. And during COVID, I know Gen Z all watched the office and they were all like this new hot show. Yeah. And then the podcast all took off about it. Yeah. So it happens. I know. Um, you're playing a lot of weird. I mean, Madison is a weird city. I'm from Wisconsin and Madison is a lot of college kids. You're going to have to go in there and talk about celebrities that they know at that

The Dua Peeps and like, you know what I mean? Dua Lipa. Yes. She's a young one. She's a youthful one. Yeah. What about Lorde? She's kind of a, she's kind of. She's from New Zealand.

Yeah, Lori, she's kind of a bummer, Lord. She always seems kind of- It's not quite uplifting music. Yeah, no. No. She's often in a, like, she's dour, as we would say. She's kind of dour. Quite. You're from Lexington, Kentucky? Yes, can you believe it? Work, bitch. I know. And I've been sued in Kentucky by Covington Catholic High School families. Remember the MAGA hat kid? Oh, yes. The guy that went up to the Native American guy at the- Yes. So 12 of those families from that school sued me in Kentucky federal court and Kentucky state court.

because when I tweeted about that, they said that I would defame them and I should pay all of their college tuitions and also undisclosed sums of money. So I had to fight each case for three years till they were finally dismissed.

And I have a case currently in Tennessee in front of the Sixth Circuit Court of Appeals where there's a guy, a CEO named Samuel Johnson, who's harassing two trans kids at their prom photo shoot. And the boy's in a red dress. So I tweeted about it and he got fired. And he's saying he got fired because of my tweets, not his own behavior. So I'm in Tennessee federal court.

If you want to come to the trial, I think that we would go over very well there. I do have, and I'm sure you have this too. I do have like a short list phone tree for when I get in trouble or sued or something. I have people I call for support and it's always someone who gets sued or in trouble more. Right. Cause you need someone to go, Oh, you'll be fine. Right. Oh, it's going to be fine. Cause I don't know if this happens to you. Whenever something legal happens like that, I get so like twisted up about it. Of course. Even if I think I'm right or something, I get my mind goes straight to the worst. Yeah. And now

I know having had so many of these cases, I've actually had five cases brought by MAGA people since the Trump photo. I know they each take like three years to go through the system. You can't lose sleep every night. Right. So every time I get a new one, I'm like, uh, three more years, but they all get dismissed. Oh, my lawyers love me. We're very close. And I do have the same lawyer as Miley Cyrus and she's been sued more than me.

I love that. I love her. She's really, really fierce. See, she's someone who's come around about me and it means the world to me. Because when she was young, she thought I was the mean lady who told mean jokes. But now she's like, oh, you were just kidding. Well, don't you have a few? I think I've heard you talk about a few. Has the Gwyneth come around? No. No. But she does have a healthy amount of fear when she sees me, which I take as a badge of honor. Because that pill, you know what I mean? I really feel like...

if the drag Queens and the comedians are talking about you, it means it's good. Right. If the drag queens and comedians are talking about, you've done a good thing. Yeah. Now I don't know if Brittany will ever come around, but I do. I am fearful of the free Brittany movement because,

Oh, those people? Okay. The FBI? Don't be scared. The Trump people? Don't be scared. The Britney people? The free Britney people. MAGA has nothing on the free Britney people. Oh, if your house got bugged, they'd be like, it wasn't Trump. It was actually the Britney people. Right. That's right. It was the free Britney. It was Jason from Anaheim who's heading the movement. Who has a rubber mask of your head with ketchup on it. Exactly. He's coming for you, bitch. I know. But I will say she's fucking free. Of course. Icon. I mean, incredible. I know. I'm just saying she's very free.

He was free. Maybe a little too free. Well, I wonder if you'll ever get to have her at one of your fabulous salons. I love having these salons. Now, these really got me through being out of work because of being canceled. Then I had lung cancer. That's why my voice is a little bit diminished. I had lung cancer even though I never smoked. It's improved so much.

I've had like five surgeries since. Thank you. And now when I'm on the road, I use a, like a Madonna headset microphone. Ted talk. You're selling timeshares. I pitched myself for Ted like five times and they finally said, we don't think you have anything like really profound to say. Like I, not only have I been turned down by Ted and I don't know who Ted is, but not only has Ted turned me down, but they've been like, Ms. Griffin, save yourself a call.

Just, just stop. They're like, stop you before you can't stop yourself.

You're like, why? They're like, cause we know you're just going to talk about Brittany or something. And you're like, that's right. All right. You got me. I'm like, well, guilty as charged, you know, Ted. So you started having the salons and I'm, oh my God, I just saw this. I'm very strict with the rules. Now, first of all, I got this idea from my dear departed friend, Gloria Vanderbilt, who I also was lucky enough to know and love and adore. And she would have these dinner parties and she was so old that people didn't bring phones to the table anyway. And

But she gave me the idea to have a guest of honor because what I found is when you have a guest of honor at a dinner party, other people behave better and no phones are allowed at the table. And I don't care about your fucking kids. They'll be fine. Yeah. Okay. Jimmy could fall off his bike. And if they're, if they're not, aren't you happy at a good dinner? Thank you. Catered. And I do place cards. So, you know, people can't control really what anything they do and they have to ask permission to go to the bathroom.

It's like a best seminar. I like that. I just saw, well, somebody taped it. One of your last ones. Cause I saw a clip of Sia singing to Mo Collins. Yes. I make Sia sing when she comes over and sing for her supper. Really? I make her sing for her supper. And she's so, I'm like, I'm so dazzled by her period as a person. She's probably the most generous person I've ever met.

She watches survivor and picks up the phone and calls and sends money to her favorite people. Right. It's very relatable. It's just normal things. I would never, I'm too cheap.

But, um, they'd be like, you won the Trixie Mattel prize on survivor. It's a 50 cent point. Yeah. Yeah. And so I, I love Sia Furler and she has been so good to me throughout the cancellation. And I just went over there yesterday and we got in bed. Like she's Liza Minnelli. I call her Liza and she calls me Lorna. And so we just watched, um, 90 day fiance and I,

I just think the world of her. She's really amazing. And I'm dazzled by how talented she is because in an era of lip syncers and people that just aren't legit, I kind of like to have her sing spontaneously because you can't believe how good she is just like that with like no prompting. She just goes and she does it. She really busts it out. Yeah.

Yeah. She's a great friend. I think I met her because she watched Trixie Motel. And then I had a hard time for a while and I called her. I said, I don't know how to say this, but I think you've had some hard times. And do you mind if I just come over? And she was like, yeah, it's gone bad with her. Yeah. She's gone bad with her and cried. And the TV on the ceiling, the TV on the ceiling. She's like, I can't be bothered to do this. No, she can't. I need to watch TV. Why should she? Why should she? What's going on? Oh, did the wig fall off? No, but you're moving it like a piece of furniture.

It's on. Can you believe? It's on. What if I wore it more like...

Oh. Five head representation. I see more brow. I see more brow. This is, this is, is this hair that you have from your head? No, this is, this is hair from my head. And then there's some magic hair on top. I'm actually wearing a toupee. I call it a toupee because I don't know the real name for it, but it's basically a toupee. Well, there's the Rachel, but you really for touring could do the Kathy. Yeah. You could have a wig that you shake out and just. Oh, I love wigs on the road. And also sometimes you,

You know what it is? Sometimes you really do get to a gig late or there's trial. Like, cause I fly private, fly commercial and drive. I try to mix it up on tour. You're very high low. I'm going to fly private, but I'm going to wear my, my $40 shake and go wig. Right. And when rent a Kia. Yeah. I mean, if, and those big venues too, and your hair is color treated and if you're heat styling, it's not exactly great for it. Yeah. No. And then right after I just whip it off and shake it out and then I look like just a shaggy dog on the way home. But who cares? Well, you once said that Cher, uh,

has long chair hair in real life, which is very chilling. It's crazy. She doesn't need wigs. She just likes them. But she has very long, thick hair. And it's like this. I don't know. I shouldn't say I haven't seen her in actually a few years, but it's like down to here. Last time I saw her and it was chair hair, meaning it looked like it kind of wigs. I have this idea that she takes it off and her real hair is longer and blacker and glossier under there. And she's just trying to be modest because she doesn't wear her real hair. So she doesn't like do stuff to it.

Do you know one time I was over at her house and do you know who cut her hair? Came over to cut her hair? Jose E. Bear. Cut her hair? Jose E. Bear. Now he's from my era. Oh, wait, which people get their hair cut at home. Oh, yeah. I forget about that. Oh, I can't go to a salon. They come to your house and you love it. Or else. Yeah, so Jose E. Bear was like the most famous hairdresser in the world in like the 70s and 80s.

And I didn't know he was still alive. And there he is. He said, oh, hello. We didn't know you were still with us. No. And he did it. He cut the hair and they talked like two old friends, which is what they were. And it was a time capsule moment. Please tell me it was like a quarter inch trim too. Yeah. It was nothing. It was a joke. Love that. And afterwards I was like, when's he going to start?

It looks exactly the same. Yes. Yes. I just want to shout out some more cities here. You're going to Hartford, Connecticut, Omaha. You're going to Indianapolis, Ottawa. You really are doing America proper. I'm doing the real America. You're skipping the LAs, the New Yorks. Yes. Are we going to Chicago? No.

Which is my hometown, by the way. But I think what I'm going to do is do this tour from February 2nd till June. Then I think summer off. And then I think I'll play the larger markets in the fall if I'm able, meaning if this tour does well enough, then I can do like New York, L.A., Chicago, Houston, you know, whatever.

You're going to do incredible. I hope so. I can't wait to hit the stage. I can't wait. I remember, I don't know how, we did have cable growing up, but I'd never seen a comedy special. I'd never seen real comedy. Yeah. And I remember seeing one of your specials when I was like a kid and I didn't, you know, before you know how to call it, stand up, you're like, what is that? What's going on there? And you just were just, you're like my earliest memory was watching your specials and then stealing them on LimeWire. So I probably owe you some money. You owe me like 17 cents. Yeah. Yeah.

Anything else you want to say before you peace out and go see people? Just watch me on my socials and go to KathyGriffin.com for tickets and come see me because I am coming to your town. She really is. Whether you like it or not, I'll be there. Yeah. Maybe instead of doing bigger cities, you just keep devolving to doing even smaller cities. Until I'm just doing living rooms.

Totally. All right. Wave bye to Kathy, everyone. Bye. I love you, Trixie. Thank you. Of course.