Sock Puppet with the Hand Pulled Out with Jackie Beat 01:03:53

And we are ready. And we are ready. We are back. We are here in our brand new episode of The Bald and the Beautiful. That's right, Trixie. I couldn't agree with you more. And today we have somebody who is both bald and beautiful.

Yeah. She's a living legend and a Renaissance person. And the inventor of most things that you're probably familiar with at home. Computers. Internet. The wheel. Yeah. Most cutlery. Many languages. Honestly, one of the most respected drag queens on the planet who all of us aspire to be like. It's Jackie Beat. Jackie Beat.

Hi, you guys. It's me coming to you live through modern technology. I have to say. We don't even have to get near each other. I love it. You're not used to the remoteness of it. I see you on the Instagrams all the time. I did your show. I did your show, too. I had a blast. Yeah. I'm not very tech savvy, as they say. I thought you were going to say I'm not very sexy. Oh, I'm terribly sexy. Terribly sexy. Terribly. Yeah.

I'm horribly turned on. My look is fuckable clown. That's what I call it. Yeah. My look is unfuckable clown. No, she's playing hard to get. You were playing hard to get. Yeah. Yeah.

So where should we start your illustrious drag career? I want to start with the facelift. Oh, let's start with, let me just say, yeah, you guys start where you want to start. Do your fucking job. I can't do both sides of this. I do want to, I have to ask one question. Where are you physically right now? We're in my house. This is my living room. Okay. What is that artwork behind you? Jackie, don't get into it with me. She said the first thing she's going to do is make fun of this painting. I said, the first thing she's going to do is make fun of me.

Oh, I didn't realize it was you. Oh, do you remember when we went out to dinner and my background on my phone was myself and you were like, are you kidding me right now? And then I took out my retainer and put it on the table and you were like, where are you from?

Oh, wait a minute. Where was that? It was some weird place. We were in Australia. I remember it like it was yesterday because Sherry was telling us tales from the road, as it were, on Craigslist. Yeah, it was weird. And Bob the Drag Queen was there? Yes. Bob the Drag Queen was there. We were on like a- What was his gig? It was like a comedy queen's tour. In Australia? Yes. Wait a minute. I was in Australia with you, Katya, also at one point. You were not. I don't believe that to be true. Oh, that's what I meant. Yeah.

Yes, you were, weren't you? No, no. We've been to, we had many good times in many good places, but Australia is not one of them. Oh, Amsterdam. Yeah, Amsterdam. They both start with an A and you were fucked up. Anyway. I was not fucked up, but it was fun. I'm kidding. Oh my God. It's like you don't even know my sense of humor. It started with an AA. Oh, honey. And ended with a, no, I don't know. Okay. So that picture is?

Very nice. Do not... Listen, nobody should put up with a drag queen who doesn't have pictures of herself all over the place. I'm just not a big fan of pastels. So when I didn't see... All I saw was the bottom half and I didn't like it. And now that I see your face, I like it even less.

If you didn't like pastels, this house would be your nightmare. It's all pink pastel. It's aggressive. It's aggressive. It's aggressive. It's the mask for mask sex. I would like to tell you that I had a giant bedroom in a giant loft in New York.

like two blocks from ground zero, right at the South Street seaport, back in the 90s, and my bedroom was purple glitter. The walls were purple glitter. I was really into, like, Powerpuff Girls, and, like, it was just very 90s. And now, if you see my house, it's very...

cubist and brutalist and rustic reptilian it's kind of butch and it's sort of like acapulco 1968 meets planet of the apes and like sort of futuristic but retro futuristic i don't know how to explain it well is this this is your old place if people can google the pictures of your old place which was like breathtaking is this the place where you do the kitchen lives at now

Yes, yes. The old place I described as anti-Mamon acid and every room had a color scheme and it was really like sort of 60s and 70s. This house is more, it's a darker, it's sort of like the future, but it's disintegrating. I don't know how to explain it. Are we talking about the house still? Yeah.

No, my hips, even though they're relatively new. I have to say, if we can move away from my interior decor to your exterior decor. Yeah. They really snatched. You look great. They carved you up like a pig, didn't they? Thank you. I had my neck done. Okay. So what is the procedure? What is the actual, like, you know, rhinoplasty is a nose job. What was this called? It's called giving her a neck. No, really. This was the technical term for it is fix an old bitch's neck. No, um,

It's an above the shoulder vaginal rejuvenation. Now, here's what it is. I looked like a sock puppet with the hand pulled out of it. I am not only 57, but I have gained and lost 100 pounds like six times in my life. So you fill it up, you empty it out, you fill it up, you empty it out. You know what I'm talking about? Yeah. So it was a mess. And it was the one thing that always drove me crazy. And I always put my finger in.

Listen, that explains why in all the pictures you were always one finger. Yeah. You're like, oh, don't look. Don't here. Let me put my hand exactly where I don't want you to look. But it's so snatched. But the thing is, that's freaking me out a little bit is, first of all, like you get rid of all the extra. But now there's like, you know, like a few little lines. OK, but it looks great in because you're pulling it. And then I do look great in your neck.

In drag and lit with tons of makeup, beep bop boop doodly doo, I'm so thrilled. But chunks of my face are still fucking numb, you guys. What? No, no, no. Yeah, like. That's not. It's a great time to get into choking, Jackie. Oh, wait a minute. I love. Why? If you can't feel it, why do it? That's why I'm not going to say any mean things about Sherry Vine. She's not even here to like burst into tears. No. Here's the thing. I love the way. Don't do it.

Kati was just about to say like, that's not normal, but I guess it really is. It takes a while for it to all come back. And then I sort of resigned myself that, honey, if it doesn't come back, like I don't need my feeling right here and right here. Who gives a shit? I look good. You don't see it. I don't feel it. Yeah. All those people poking in the jowls is like whatever. My scariest thing was the first time I entertained a gentleman caller.

I was a little nervous. When you first have it done, it's much more brutal than people think. What? Because you think, well, you think it's just skin being pulled. Oh, no. It's the muscle. Like, there's a wall of numb muscle under here. Like, behind my ears looks like Frankenstein. So, like I said, my biggest fear was the first time, I'll just say it, I sucked a fucking huge dick. So...

You've sung about it. You might as well speak on it. I know, but I used to sing about it and not ever really do it. The lived reality is a little bit. I'll never forget the baby got front video. The number of looks in that video. You ever seen that video? I don't know. I don't think so. Yeah. It's so funny because it was one of the first things I ever did with Austin Young and we were in my apartment, uh,

where Nadia Ginsburg lives now, my heliotrope apartment. And I just thought, let's literally do like, what was it like 13 or 14 different looks like grandma, you know, like sort of Bollywood. There's a rich lady. There's like a Manson girl. How long did I said, let's, let's literally just do a look. I'll sing the song once.

change and just do it. And then you can have fun just editing. And it was just look after look after look, but the same makeup. It's very effective. I mean, that's the thing about drag though. If you're the thing, it's not like you have to build a set. Yeah. You want to make more money? I invented that. You invented doing nothing. I love that song with you in Alaska. That's like a, it's a, what did, so what did you invent? You have everything in drag. Why is that? Why is that your thing? Because you started doing drag when, like in,

I started doing drag relatively late, if you really think about it. Like as far as, you know, some people start like when they're, you know, 19. I started in 1989. In your 40s.

Yes, exactly. Why can't you be this funny when the cameras are rolling? I saw your little documentary. The way I look in drag, it puts me in such an awful mood. Nothing's funny. Oh my God. Can I just say, Sherry was talking about that the other day on like some Instagram live she was doing. She's like, I still love drag and I love drag and it's fun. I'm like, honey, if it's fun, you're not doing it right. Yeah.

I aspire. That's literally how I feel. I aspire to show up like you to gigs. When we were on tour, we would pull up to like a beautiful hotel and she would look at it and go like, is that it? The side has a texture to it. I am a naturally grateful, gracious person. It's such a refined level of gratitude though. Can't really pick up on it. Nobody can pick up on it.

No, what was I going to say? Oh my God. Oh my God. My brain. Oh, we asked you when you started doing drag. Yeah. What age were you? You said late start. I believe I had the same late start. Well, I started in 1989. Which makes you, where you were how old? I was born in 1963. Interesting. So 24, something like that? Is that right? 26. I started when I was 25. So that's interesting. Yeah.

Did you ever have to ask like I'm 31 and I can't believe sometimes I still do drag. When was your point of like when you first started were you like surprised how long you've been able to do it. I mean come on.

Well, it's a totally different world than it was. There was literally, first of all, I didn't even know these people. Like I was going to say there was, you know, eight people. No, I'm saying there was Bunny, Sherry Vine, Joey Arias, Varla Jean Merman, Coco Peru. And when I started, it was before I even really knew that world.

So I just, I didn't start it like with any idea of a career. Nobody thought you could make money at it. Are you fucking crazy? Really? You couldn't do it. One of those ladies. I say this all the time. There were gay bars that wouldn't let drag Queens in. There were people, you know, like running gay pride that were like no drag Queens this year. We're just, you know, that's all the news ever shows. It's embarrassing. We are fighting for our rights. We need to take this seriously. Yeah.

You know, so when I started, a bunch of us just did drag for Halloween one year, and I just noticed that I did it, you know, with a level attention to detail that they didn't have. And I took it very fucking seriously. And I did sort of a...

almost like a joanne worley meets um phyllis i don't know if you've ever seen uh phyllis from the um from the mary tyler moore show it's um i bet she has i'm too young yeah so it's this really wild sort of 60s look that i did the first year and then i think like a couple years after that i did um

I did Shelly Winters in the Poseidon Adventure, which is really fun because you just find a dress and you like kind of burn it up one side and rip it and then like get it wet. And you have like a happy new year hat off to one side and your makeup is dripping and you have one shoe because it's the Poseidon Adventure. You guys are making faces like you don't know the fucking Poseidon Adventure. I don't. I do. I do. It's unacceptable. Is that like is that was that the too long food before too long? No, no.

No, it's not drag, but I just did a podcast called Movies That Made Us Gay, and mine was The Poseidon Adventure. There's a scene where Pamela Sue Martin, it's about a ship, a giant luxury liner. You don't have to yell. I think I do. What? That turns upside down at the stroke of midnight. So people are like flying all over the place, and then they have to climb

through the ship up to the bottom of the ship to get out and the fucking seventies hairstyles and fashions. And there's one scene that I'm convinced is like, okay, Pamela Sue Martin is wearing a red velvet maxi dress with sort of a,

you know, like men's tuxedo adjacent top. Like everyone looks amazing. And after the ship turns over, he's like, you can't climb in that skirt. And she rips the skirt off and she has matching red velvet hot pants underneath. A reveal. A life or death reveal. Right. Right. And then later in the movie, Stella Stevens does the ultimate shablam. Like you've got to see this movie. Oh my God. I think I saw what I saw.

So I have learned that my favorite movies are where everyone gets all dressed up in their best 70s fashions and hairstyles to have the time of their life. And then their big beaming smiles turn to looks of horror in slow motion when they realize that all hell is breaking loose. So The Poseidon Adventure and Carrie. Carrie. I had the pleasure of reading Carrie last year. It was a nice short little – obviously you've read it.

It's not a great book. Thank you. He admits it. I liked it. I thought like it's definitely different from the movie. I did like that it's told like entirely in like an interview with a neighbor, a news clipping. Wasn't it his first book? Yeah. It is funny that in the book, Carrie's like horribly disgusting. And then in the film you have a supermodel. She's overweight. I don't know if the audience knows about your legendary relationship with the movie Carrie. You want to speak on that?

Sure. Well, you were originally cast as Carrie, right? You said, I don't really want to do this. So you didn't do it, right? Is that how it went? No.

Carrie is from 1976. So I saw it when I was 13 years old in the theater and it fucking changed my life. I will never forget. First of all, the opening is a bunch of girls, you know, full frontal, like seventies Bush Bush, right? Yeah. In the shower room. And you know, she gets her period. It's just unbelievable. The movie it's,

hideous and gorgeous and campy and sad. So that kind of like, you know, infused me with all of that for my drag. But I remember watching the prom scene and, you know, they teach it in film class. It's amazing. Just the saturated colors. And it's sort of like the shower scene in Psycho. It's just very perfectly timed and thought out and...

Just obsessed, just obsessed with that movie. And I think one of the reasons is because the theme or the moral of the story is don't mess with the freak. Yeah. Yeah. Like it's like the underdogs revenge fantasy. Totally. What other films are there like that are kind of comparable to that revenge? Um,

Well, I don't even know if it's revenge because she is so out of control. You know, a lot of people are like, how come she killed the gym teacher? She was nice to her. And I'm like, honey, the scene where she sees everyone laughing at her, there's a reason he used like a prism. It's almost like a kaleidoscope because that's in her head. Her mother planted it in her head that everyone was going to laugh at her.

So she thinks everyone is laughing when just a few people are laughing and she's completely out of control. Her telekinetic powers, you know, coincide with her period. So you become a woman and then, you know, so anyway, so she's just killing people left and right. Willy nilly. I like how focused they are in the book and the film about like the guys can smell your blood.

about like your period who can smell i think in the book they drove it home more but it's very like you have your blood the boys can smell it it is true i mean you know you can't you can't really well i mean they're pheromones i mean you know like it's like a you know it's anything like you know your duck and crotch and your pits and your it's like i mean i hate the silence of the land but smell your cut

Yeah. But anyway, I just love it. I love the movie so much. I think, I mean, did you take the time to see the remake? Did you live or did you not live? I'm only asking because I want to hear how much you did. I barely fucking lived. I barely survived it. What is the point of doing that?

You know what it is to make five more dollars. I don't know. It's horrible. First of all, she's literally reaching out and doing this pantomime thing. Like when, when like moving, like her hand is picking it up like a phantom. It's horrible. I hate it so much. I can't even put it into words. You know, I did like one part of it. I did like Julianne Moore stabbing herself in the leg with that sewing thing. I mean, there were little moments like that, but.

I mean, listen, I get it. I know that the translation, if there were subtitles right now, it would just say, I'm old, I'm old, I'm old, I'm old. But it's like, I love this movie. So I don't want, you know, to me, the original is fairly perfect. There are a few things that I don't love about it. Did you say like what? All I thought was this. Ready?

drag her um well he does like he speeds up the film when they're shopping for tuxedos and it's just weird and it doesn't really work but he said brian de palma is who we're talking about brian de palma said that uh he used the split screen way too much but i disagree i love it so much it's really it's very effective did you see in fabric jackie

No. Oh my God. You've got to see it. You hated it, right? I did hate it, but it's, it's, it really could have been made by. You've got to see it. You've got to see it. It's about a killer dress. It's dressed. That is like curse that when people wear it, like they get killed.

And it's shot a lot like Carrie. It's, I mean, it's so bizarre. They have this department store that's all like run by witches. And they have these giant, huge like bouffant wigs and they're dressing these like funeral clothes from the 1700s. Wait a minute. It's a department store run by witches? Yeah. Yes. So Neiman Marcus? No, it is. It's very Neiman Marcus because they give you that kind of personalized. Yeah.

It's that personal service. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And they have this... They use this language like, you know...

Everything sounds like an ornate kind of poem. It's like, the recesses of your purchase will ring out into the retail sphere for eons. It's like so bizarre. It's just like, okay, thank you. You have to see it. You gotta watch it. I wanna see it now. You would love it. I feel like you would love, love, love it. If you didn't like it, I'd be shocked. Well, you never know. And as we know, Jackie, your taste is very, you're easy to please. Yeah, you like anything. You know what? Can I just say the older I get,

the more I can appreciate. First of all, when I watch something, I can't help but think how many people worked so hard on this. So they get credit just for that. Sometimes that's the thing that bothers me. Like how many people worked so hard on this and they still fucked it up or it's the worst story. And I can't believe anybody made this movie, but yeah, I mean, I've been watching like just the other day I watched, um,

The Black Godfather, which is a great documentary about this guy that I'd never even heard of. And he's worked with everyone like he produced like it was all about Soul Train, which was so amazing. Anyway, so that's a great movie. I just watched Soul, which is the Disney. Did you love it?

I loved it so much, you guys. I cried seven minutes in when he's at the piano and everything goes blue and he's in his own little world playing the piano. I started bawling. It looked so gorgeous. Is that how you feel about cross-dressing?

Yes, exactly. No, but I do have these moments where I'm so overblown by it gives me faith in humanity. Like, I remember this is such a specific memory. And it's not even like I remember in. Oh, my God. What is the the corpse bride?

In Corpse Bride, which like, I don't think I've ever seen it since I saw it, you know, when it came out in the theater. But there's a scene where all those skeletons are like dancing and they're like lit from one side with these like red and then blue and then green. I just was like, I loved that so much and it made me emotional. Anyway, I love things like that that just hit me like a ton of bricks. I cried at the Very Brady Christmas last week. The TV made for TV movie about them all trying to get home for Christmas.

Yeah. I mean, if it gets me, it gets me. I do love the Brady Bunch, Jackie, right? I love the Brady Bunch. Is that the one that has the line, don't be sorry, just be Wally? No. Okay. This is the one where they're all trying to get on for Christmas. And I don't know if you remember in the first season of the Brady Bunch, Carol Brady sings at church. And, you know, that actress, her voice, Florence's voice is like, perfect.

perfect like god that episode is called a christmas carol because her name was carol exactly god i see what and she gets uh laryngitis or as uh cindy brady calls it larry gitis that's right right yes and she she tells the the drug the uh sorry department store santa claus

All I want is for my mommy to get her voice back. And magic happens. Does it really happen? Of course. She sings O Come All Ye Faithful. And then in the made-for-TV movie, all these years later, Mike Brady's in a collapsed building because he's an architect on this set. And these people are like, no, we want to do it cheap. And he's like, it's not safe. And they're like, you're fired. We're doing this cheap. So then it collapses while he's in it.

And then he can't figure out how to get out of the rubble. And she starts singing, Come All Ye Faithful. And the whole audience joins in. And he gets out of the rubble because he could hear her voice singing. Girl, I was crying so hard. I know. And then you add the layer that they were best friends in real life. And he was a closeted gay man. And he couldn't climb out of that rubble.

It really breaks my heart when you see all these gay people on TV that America invited into their homes, you know,

Like, you know, like Uncle Arthur on Bewitched. And just as long as you didn't say that word, you were allowed to, like, love them and laugh at them and laugh with them. And, yeah, it's just kind of depressing. But I'm glad the world has changed. No, I'm glad that now they can, like, you know, actually say the word. It's like when the Buttigieg of the world happened.

He might not be your favorite candidate, but everyone's like, it's a gay candidate. Great. But he would have had to be a Christian, dickless, loveless, nudeless, basically pet bunny to be considered seriously at all. Because if you're gay on TV, you just have to wear a bow on your head. But we don't want to hear about the fact that you actually kiss men. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. You're either a desexualized communist. I can't remember when it was, but a while back, somebody...

I can't remember if it was a reaction to something, but I tweeted, never forget that underneath this drag clown that you love so much is a gay man who loves cock. Oh, girl. Like, I just, I mean, I have the need to say it. If I say something like really overtly, you know, I want to fuck him, whatever. Sometimes the comments will be like, oh, God, that's a lot. I'm like, well, what do you think I got into this for?

Although, to be fair, your thirst tweets are usually like, please run over my body with a Mack truck. I'm like, fucking choke me out and dick me down until my eyes pop out of my skull. And people are like, oh my God, are you gay? Nothing wrong with that. Maybe I need to lead with more like, you know. Oh.

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I know that you guys are running the interview, but could I ask a question? Yeah. What's each of your favorite things about me? I mean, where do I begin? I mean, I feel weird because I don't know if you take compliments well, but you are one of my favorite drag queens. I just love you.

I take compliments. Great. You crack my shit up. I've seen you so many times. Every time I've been in LA and you have a show, I've always come. And I just, I love your, your hair and your makeup. And I just love everything. Oh, thank you. You are so fucking mean to the people in the audience. So mean. In a way that I am so like, I just love it. And the people you have, you have a way of like, it's like a verbal contract that like, I'm going to be so mean to you.

Even though you paid to be in the front and watch me. And you're going to love it. But don't you agree that, like, first of all, I make fun of myself first. Of course. And you have the best. I see queens trying to do what I do and they don't understand that you need to make fun of yourself first. You have to do it with

I mean, the way you're describing it is like, I'm just mean, but there is some affection and intelligence to it. There's a lot of finesse to it. It's like a compliment to be, everybody wants to be talked to you at the show. Everyone wants to be made fun of. I don't. I don't. Well, I've done some shows recently where after the show, people are like, what's wrong? You weren't, you were too nice. You weren't mean. Like when that woman said that thing, I thought you were going to fucking come for her. And it's just like,

You know, I try to make the most of moments like that, but I don't want to actually, you know. I also, I know that you probably love being a performer, but I love that you enter the shows with the energy of like, let's do it. Hit the music, I guess. Listen, I have to say with Drag Race and there are queens who are.

turning it out on a level that I will literally never understand. I mean, first of all, back in the day, I'm more cabaret than theater, right?

So I've got my music stand. I'm like, why am I going to learn these songs? I'm going to do them for three nights this year for my holiday show and then probably never again. And I'm also old. So it's like memorizing shit is like really hard. And I just think there's something about just walking out with an attitude like I'm going to rise above this tiny little shithole space. And it's all about.

the connection and what I'm doing, but I'm not going to jump through fucking hoops of fire. And my wig is not a lace front. And do you know what I mean? And like, yes, I'm wearing a glorified tablecloth with a fucking, you know, rope around it. I don't know. It just, it seems to work, but there are times where I look at what Queens are doing. I mean, you know, you look at the jinx and, uh, and bend a little creme holiday special. And I'm like, ah,

Oh, that made me want to be like, drag is done. The production was insane. Who can compete with that? But then I think, listen, it's great, but because my show didn't cost anything,

literally ten dollars it's still you could still watch it and it's entertaining it's a different you just have to stop you know like uh comparing yourself to other people also never been bored at a jackie beach show not one minute she's never even gone yeah and with the jinx of the ben thing you have to remember many people find them grating i'm just kidding

Myself included. Myself included. It was like an, I was watching it and I was cheering for them until it got so good that I kept leaving the room and being like, are you serious? Are you serious? It was just so amazing. And I mean, to, to tell you, like, you want to talk about talent, um,

When it's just Varla Jean Merman's voice and she's playing like a fucking pina colada or whatever. And she's so fucking funny. We just did Sherry Vine's... Sherry Vine did a new variety show, I think, for OutTV. I hope I'm right. Oh, yeah. And Varla flew out on her own dime just to be in it and...

I'm not kidding you. We could barely get through. I wrote a sketch for all of us and it is so fucking funny where she assumes she's playing the sexy young daughter.

It's so funny. And then she's like, wait a minute. Am I playing the mom? And we're like, don't be ridiculous. You're playing the grandma. And then Mario's reading. And then Mario reads the description. And the grandmother is like, a hideous woman with no teeth rolls in in her wheelchair. But we could not get through it because she is so...

funny. Yeah, she is. Whenever in P-Town, like whenever I get the opportunity, it's like if I have a night off and she has some tickets available, I'm like, I'm just going to go. Yeah. Cause it's really like a joke every second. Yeah. We, I saw actually, yeah. Varla came to Boston years like before drag race where I was on drag race and she was so great. So did Sherry and Joey Arias. They did a show together, which was so weird by the way, just the two of them. And,

And then I finally saw Dina Martina. Did it change your life? Yeah. She's incredible. Dina is just everything I wish I could be, which is...

I mean, you know, like... Unforgettable. Unforgettable. You can kind of tell people who've done acid. And I'm not even saying Dina's done acid. My comedy is very mathematical and it kind of makes sense. And, you know, there's a setup and, you know, then a delivery. But God, those people who are just from another planet, I really do love. Yeah, that's... I mean, did you see Tammy's Christmas special?

I did not see the Christmas special, but she, I've, I've worked with her a lot and she's one of my very favorite. Like, I mean, just talk about like not feeling pressure. I mean, listen, the best thing about her, she feels no pressure to do a good job. No, I just mean to like be normal or like, Oh, this is how you're supposed to do it. I mean, I'll never forget was, was Tammy on the very first season. Yeah. All right.

I think at one point she literally like said, this is bullshit. Yeah. She's like, Oh yeah. And then read Michelle for her, like, um, your, her makeup and then left or something like that. She tried to, Michelle tried to read her and she said, if I wanted to read, I could read somebody for a makeup line on their neck. She literally said that to her on television.

Yeah. It's fierce. It is. When she's like my go-to, whenever I need, so I'm going somewhere and they say, do you want to bring an opener? She's like the first call I make because she's so professional and so wackadoo and just like, just a good energy backstage. She's like thrilled to be. Yeah. And she's so like, like you said, it's not that she doesn't, she's just on a different frequency. Yeah. Different frequency. Yeah. Yeah. It's just, you have to have faith. I mean, I think of things like anything new and different, which is so,

Like words I don't think of when I think of drag now. I mean, I'm sorry. It's just so like, oh, my God. And like, I don't know if you guys watched, you know, the first episode of the new season, but it's just so like step over those dead bodies for fucking ratings. But I think my point is like, you know, like Roseanne was such a huge thing.

And nobody had ever, it's always somebody who like everyone passed, you know,

Like who thought some big, loud mouth, fat, you know, relatively unattractive. I don't mean, you know, I'm just saying by Hollywood standards. Now we're talking about her. It becomes a huge hit because everyone's, you know, starving for something different and something real. And then everyone's trying to do their Roseanne. So there's a million stories like that. And you just have to be yourself. Yeah. What I like about Tammy is it's very, I mean, I love the Tammy's of the world because it's like,

They're not really interested in whether or not what they're doing is quote unquote like marketable. Right. Yeah. But they want the nine people who worship them to have like the night of their lives. Yeah. And they usually do. And they a hundred percent do. And I wonder if they even think of those nine people. Like, I just think that they literally, I don't, I, I don't know what they think because I don't think they think. I'm not saying nine people watch her. I'm saying, I'm saying like,

She's not like I've been at shows where she goes out there and let's be honest, they maybe don't all know her. And by the end of the set, they are like chanting her name because the conviction is there. Like she, right. She delivers it. Like it is something to be said for like, is she serious? Like, is this a character? Like, does she know?

It's the real deal. And that's why people love it. And she's very lovable. And wow, I can't believe we've been talking about Tammy for 20 minutes. And this is my another thing about me. I wanted to mention back to Queens with nine fans, Jackie. Can I ask, how did you invent this makeup?

Well, I mean, first of all, I've always been like sort of an artist, but not, you know, I mean, I can draw and like when I write something, people like, you know, Sherry's always like, oh, my God, your handwriting is so good. And I'm like, it's because I'm drawing the letters. I'm not writing them. Oh, my God. That's a lovely way to put it. Do you do calligraphy ever? Yeah.

Do you have a part-time gig as a wedding calligraphy artist? Yeah. Are you a notary public? Yes, that's how I bought this house. Do you enjoy penmanship handwriting? Calligraphy to be you and me. Yes, I do love handwriting and I love...

Like I noticed that when I do sign autographs, my writing is very much like I don't know if you've ever seen Frank Oz sign things as Miss Piggy. No. Miss Piggy's writing is so like curly cues. It's so amazing. Anyway, so I really love that. But I don't know what I'm saying. What were we talking about? Oh, my makeup. Miss Piggy. We were talking about you. No.

Miss Piggy and my makeup. No, my makeup was really bad in the beginning. Like, first of all, I did my eyebrows with a Sharpie for real. And then when you take your makeup off, it's still there. And I would take like a sponge, you know, the scrubby sponge and try to, and then it would be all raw and bleeding. Ginger used to do that. Yeah, still does. Horrible. Horrible. But then you just slowly learn. Like you watch other people and this was before the internet. So you would just watch,

be backstage at squeeze box, you know, and notice that somebody, the way they overdraw their lip and you just kind of learn what works for your face and what doesn't. And I'm not sure how it really came up. Yeah. But that iconic sort of makeup that for a while there, everyone was kind of doing, and there's no nice way to say that, but let's be honest. Yeah.

Can we at least be honest? Can we at least be honest, you guys? I've invented that. Please. It's pretty amazing. I mean, had anybody done those really graphic, drawn-on lashes and all that until you did it?

I think, well, first of all, I really think that I was very inspired by Patrick Nagel. Like I used to think like this may look really paint by numbers and very like not terribly blended. But when a fucking camera hits it and the flash goes off, it looks like a Nagel, you know, like or, you know, so. And, you know, I always shave my eyebrows off because I just can't.

I'll never understand spending the time to cover them because you can never really do it fully. And then the time it takes to take them off, it's like, I'm too lazy. Just shave your fucking brows and walk around like a chemotherapy patient. Yeah, I mean, that was a great segue into my next question. How do you negotiate the surrender of your masculinity to drag during the daytime? Well, okay, first of all...

I only get laid in drag. Okay. Okay. That's my, first of all, I have to tell you, there's a certain point as a gay man where, uh,

You are a certain age. You're femme. You are a certain size. Like I had just completely given up. Tell me my future, Jackie. Tell me my future. There are things about myself physically that like no amount of dieting is going to change. Like I'm never going to gain weight in my dick. You know what I mean? And I just am such a size queen that I just...

I just assume that everyone else is. And it's just not true. They aren't, you know, but I'm also not like this, you know, voracious, you know, power bottom. So I was just neither here nor there. And I was not in the gay world. I was just like dead. I may as well have been dead.

So actually dead people might have got a little more action. They didn't think you were dead because of the brows. They thought you were dying. At least there's a fetish for that. But my point is then Sherry kind of like shook me up a little bit.

And now I realize, like, honey, I'm a fucking unicorn. And, like, I am some people's, like, I mean, ultimate fan. Ultimate wet dream girl. And I'm not even just talking about, like, the fucking... Because I always ask them, I'm like, do you want, like, natural blended makeup? Or do you want rock and roll whore? They always want rock and roll whore. The more makeup, the better. And then guys will start, like, I've had guys...

I mean, it makes me emotional and I'm not even joking. Be vulnerable. For someone who is 57 years old and have hated certain things about myself. And then the guy says, like, I love your fat ass. Bring that fat ass over here. Or they're like, oh, I mean, I'm just going to say it. Like, take out your dick. And I'm just like, oh, it's nothing compared to yours. Oh, I don't care. Like, that turns me on.

Yeah, Alexa, play Nothing Compares to You. Yes. Nah. Yeah. But so it's sort of like the Tammy Brown thing. Like, just you need to embrace who you are and who you're not and not try to be, you know, and just like, honey, if you think you're fucking hot, then, you know, I mean, if somebody's not into you, they're not into you. Yeah. But. And then get them drunk. No, I'm just kidding. Can I ask? Honey, I am hot. Your mother is a sexual person. Yeah.

Can I ask, this was supposed to be my year. My New Year's resolution was to do it in drag. So I guess that's going to carry over to this year. Do the men care when you have so much wig and makeup on? Do they say anything? Do they have a problem with the clownery? That's what they want. That's what they want. But I'm telling her that the wig choices that she's suggesting, they're a little lodge. Because just for logistics, you want to be able to have a free range of motion. What do you put on for the gig? What's the wig?

I could send you a, it's okay. Yeah. You're sending the picture before, please. No, it is this sort of like dark wavy parted on the side that I can, you gotta be able to fucking bolt it down. Girls. Yeah. And yeah, it's got some height, but not a whole lot. And. Oh, so you don't wear the show wigs for the set? No, no. Cause bunny does. Few people want full on clown. Bunny wears the bunny wigs for the sex.

Yeah. Yeah. Cause I'm always trying to hypothesize like what hair and she's always trying to get me to go smaller, which I understand, but smaller. And then it's a numbers game. So I know this sounds crazy, but like,

There have been a few guys like this one guy was like he specifically wanted to be with a drag queen, like the colors and the giant hair and like, you know, chunky platforms. And, you know, so almost like he wanted to reveal he wanted ISIS wings. He wanted. Yeah, he wanted you to do a track. I just feel like most guys want.

like sex doll on steroids with helium. Like everything is larger than life. And it's like rock and roll, slutty whore, the fantasy tons of makeup, but like your, like some wigs are just too big. Like they don't want a walking art piece. That's going to fall apart when they slap your face with their huge uncut. Right. Yeah.

Slap the wig right off. Neither one of you wants to have to worry about the state of the hair at any point during the evening. Right. Right. Right. I'm telling you, the turtleneck is a good look for you. Have you ever had, have you ever, let's say it's, I don't know, Craigslist or Grindr or whatever. Have they ever been like, I'm looking for their words, not mine, like passable CD. And are you ever like, listen.

I've got a clown fantasy. You want it or not? Because I feel like they would ask for, I want real breasts, whatever. And then if you go, well, I have a little sequined dress, they're like, fine. Yeah.

Well, yeah. I mean, listen, I've learned from Sherry that like if the lights are dim enough that some guys will put up with anything. They're like, I don't need a lot of makeup. Just put on some lipstick. All I'm going to be seeing is the back of your fuck, the top of your wig. That's what they told her. Just the wig. Just put on the wig. But let me just say, like, first of all, there are varying degrees. So many. Just blowing a guy gets really boring, really fast.

So now my whole thing is, do you want to go downtown? Are you into drag queen dick? Like, honey, life is short. And so there are plenty of guys who like want and I'm not into fucking. We've talked about this. I'm a side. But I guess my point is, first of all, you guys, I am fat. So I've got tits.

And if they are pushed up properly and shaved and have a nice, you know, like bit of, you know, makeup foundation. So they are blown away when I send them pictures. And I'm not lying when I say this on the on the dating app. I say dating app like this is dating like it's dignified. I say because it's hard to describe what I am. So.

So I say, I am, I am on the trans spectrum, you know, busty fun time, you know, I'm trying to use all the buzzwords. And when I send a picture of the tits, they're like, I'm in and, and, um, but my point is, um, I just need to kind of take advantage of, of men. Well, make, you know, make a fucking purse out of a sow's ear. Yeah.

I think you're underselling yourself here. Make a purse out of a sow's ear. Yeah, it is interesting. I mean, we talk a lot about beauty on the show. It is interesting that dressing up as a totally different person, it does do something to how you feel about yourself out of drag. And I think a very like improving way. Yeah. Well, I've had guys say,

Because they'll be like, oh, can I come over tonight? And I'll be like, I don't have a show tonight. And I do not, I don't want to get ready. Cause if you flaked on me, I would be so bitter because it's a 90 minute makeup job. And they're like, oh, you don't have to do the makeup. And I'm like, I need to do the makeup. Yes, exactly. Exactly. Exactly. I feel like literally I've had guys and you guys, I mean, some of these guys, um,

I'm seriously, when they walk in, I'm like, you've got to be kidding. He's here to kill me. Yes. I am a 57 year old fat, like, come on.

on but when it's all put together so i swoon like i can't even believe i'm getting this top shelf cock yeah and but here's my point i've had guys walk in and they're like oh my god you're fucking gorgeous like they are so into it and this is not you know like across the room this is they're three inches away from me and like in the direct sunlight yeah

And you know what? I'm not going to, no, not in direct sunlight. But you know, always like the lights are so low. I travel with scarves to put over lamps. Can you give some tips to the girls? What's the lighting tricks for the trade? Very moody. Oh, Sherry says like one votive candle. Like I'm over here. Follow the sound of my voice. Use a clicker. Yes.

But, you know, it really, first of all, I got to say, it's not about tricking anyone. No, no, no, no, no. This dating app that we're on, this hookup app that we're on, has two choices, male or female. So obviously we list ourselves as female, but the picture and the very first thing it says in the sentence is, I am a drag queen. Yeah. So I'm not trying to...

fool anybody, but it just goes to show you that there are like never sell yourself short. Yeah. And also don't get in the way. Don't let your own shit get in the way of other people's enjoyment of you. Yeah. Right. And I was going to say that don't if somebody says you're sexy, don't fucking talk them out of their opinion. People show you who they are. Believe them.

And also, honestly, a lot of these guys are probably so closeted, et cetera. Oh, sure. They don't understand on the spectrum between somebody who lives as a woman, a trans woman, and a part-time cross-dresser. Yeah. They might say looking for trans because that's the only word they heard on like Reddit. They don't really know what they're looking for. So when they see drag queen, they're like, oh, I guess I'm into that too. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, you know what? The cock wants what the cock wants. And if you see a picture and the blood starts pooling, why question it? I like that we live in a world now. Not the blood pooling. When Jackie gets a boner, please don't say, is your blood pooling? I was just going to say that was the least flattering, most unsexy image of a boner.

Jackie in a dark room with a votive candle is your blood. I thought it was like an ambulism or whatever it's called. Wait, here's my point. I've had friends be like, well, like I don't, I don't even use the words gay or bi or anything anymore. It's just like, if you see something and you, you know,

Like I'm like vegan bacon. They claim to be vegan. I'm dressed up like bacon. You're not really breaking the rules. Just put it in your mouth. You know what I'm saying? No, I think that makes perfect sense. Jackie, thank you for coming on. You are just so stunning. It's over? It's over? It's pretty much over. I want everybody to know where they can find you. Oh.

Oh, well, I need everyone. And I am not joking. I need everyone to follow me on social media. My numbers should be better. I give such good tweets and such good Instagram. God damn it. Follow me. I am Jackie Beat on every platform. The people that you love and worship would not exist without me. I invented that.

She invented it, folks. She is the moment. You are so beautiful and I just love you. You're so wonderful. Oh, you guys, you're so sweet. And congratulations on your face. And I really do love both of you. Your neck lift. I mean, you know, there's an annoyance level that sometimes takes over, but for the most part, I think you two are. Honestly, for us too. Yeah, no, I was thinking the other day, it's like people were talking about touring and I was like,

Oh, you know, I do. I missed that thing in Amsterdam we did because that was a really good like kiki off, you know, on the road, like out of drag. It's nice. It's really nice. I just read. I have such a memory of that hotel that we stayed at.

Like in, was it Amsterdam? It was outside the city. Where they had like all the like, you know, there are certain cities that just do things properly. Like you come, you could show up at two or three in the morning and in the lobby, they had like this place where you could still get like snacks and food. And you know, she loves her snacks and her food. You remember every location by the menu. Yeah. I do. And I remember that we went out for Indian food a lot. That's her gig. They had the best meal. It was in a lovely stroll. Yeah.

A lovely straw, Jacqueline. It was just so nice. And I bought a pillow. It's so funny, like a throw pillow that I still have. I actually had to put it away because it was bothering me. No, it is a throw pillow cover, but it's cork. Oh, I remember that. I remember the cork store. And it's so not comfortable. And so I finally had to just like kind of stick it. Yeah, good for you. Stick it somewhere. I don't know.

But yeah, I just remember. And I have to say one last thing. My favorite memory of Amsterdam is...

And this will tell you so much about me and so much about Bunny. Lady Bunny said, Jackie, I'm begging you, please smoke hash with me. You need to let go. You need to you deserve to enjoy yourself. You need to unplug. Why won't you just do this? And I was like, and for a second I thought I should. I'm in Amsterdam with Lady Bunny. Let's smoke some fucking hash.

But then I thought to myself, no, I've been talked into things like this before. That's this is not me. Like, I will not have a good time. I'm going to get paranoid. I'm going to get I mean, I have no idea. But like, there's a reason I don't do drugs. And it's like, let's go eat some Indian food.

Plus, when you get talked into a first-time drug experience by somebody who's experienced, they don't know how to calibrate. You don't want to get talked into a drug experience by anybody. So when Bunny says, this is a little bit of hash, you'll be fine, it could be enough to put you on Saturn. Yeah, it's like I did with Violet. Right, but doesn't it sound like when you hear the sentence,

I did hash with lady bunny in Amsterdam. I want to be able to tell that story. And now my story is how she begged me to do it. And I was too much of a pussy. I can't, I have to go to the cork store and get a pillowcase. Right? Wait, I never got to answer the question of what do you, what do I admire the most about you? Just so quickly. I'm going to do that. Oh my God. We almost tuned out before you got the chance. Oh no, I did. I tuned out. So I'll say very quickly. I think one of my favorite things about you is that when I called you earlier, I,

to see if you were on a schedule to record. You said, I'm feeling really weird. Cause I don't know. I'm thinking about Anne Frank. Yeah.

It's true. And it wasn't a joke and it was just true. And I was like, no, you guys, it's not a joke. And I've said this before, but specifically because I'm in a mood. I've been in a mood for the last couple of days, like really like, oh, it's the new year. But, you know, what does it mean? It means nothing. I know there's a lot of good stuff on the horizon and I know that things will eventually get better, but it's going to be a long time before I can.

fucking go perform somewhere. And then after the show, have some hot guy come to my fucking hotel room. Okay. There, I said it. So all I could think of, I was lying in bed and my one dog, darling is underneath the covers. And I was drinking one of my Zevia sodas, which is soda. So delicious. Sweetened with Stevia. I love those. I love them too. And I just, I put my hand under the covers and I was petting my dog.

And I was thinking to myself, oh, my God, Anne Frank would have loved to like have this experience to like have a pet, something to love, like something to touch. I took a sip of my soda and I was like, this would be such a treat.

for Anne Frank. And I know it sounds crazy, but I really mean it. Like you guys, they were like how many people shitting in a toilet and all they had was like books and her diary. And like, they couldn't do anything or make noise or do fucking anything. So boo hoo, get over yourselves. You can go for a drive. You can go for a walk. You can watch any fucking movie here. Any fucking song. Watch drag shows. Yeah.

Like watch drag shows from the safety of your fucking home. Like we are in paradise and I know it's, you're right, but no, I want to go to Puerto Vallarta. Yeah.

Oh, fuck those queens. Can you believe? I mean, I can believe. Absolutely. Of course. You know what? Coco and I were texting about this and I just typed, I'm so glad I did all those fucking AIDS benefits back in the day so they could pull shit like this. And she was like, exactly. I'm furious. That's what I'm saying. I feel they should. I mean, we're at the point where they need to close the doors in the United States because we can't be trusted to interact with the rest of the world because we don't act right. Wild and out always.

do you that america we can't be trusted can't be trusted our new that's our new uh you know like slogan yeah well i love you jackie thank you for coming on it's such a privilege thank you for doing this you guys are adorable now um you'll send me a link so i can share it and like my nine fans i'll send it to your people or yeah listen i don't have people i don't know what do you think i was on drag race yeah it's gonna be great

Awesome. Thank you, Jackie. People are going to be really excited to find out about this up and coming ingenue talent. I just want to say one last thing. Yeah. The fact that I kept such energy and such a good attitude staring at a big giant fucking print of rainbow bright meat.

meets Ronald McDonald up on that fucking wall it takes one to know one bitch I know alright you guys I love you have a lovely night bye that's Alaska

you