Just Looking For JTT with Franz Szony 44:35

Welcome back to another lovely episode of The Bald and the Beautiful. Welcome everyone. Welcome. Welcome in. Hope you're having a lovely night. How you been going? That was two different things. That was clapping and sad noise.

Oh, I love that. That's good. A bittersweet energy to start off our podcast. And we have a very natural guest for us. One of our favorite people, close friend. Yep. One of our favorite people in the world. Also, someone with whom we've had the pleasure of working, who also happens to be, in my humble estimation, one of the best living photographers on the planet Earth. Wow.

Thanks for that. I'm talking about David LaChapelle. Just kidding. Annie Leibovitz is here. I agree. We have the wonderful Franz. Franz. Hi. Is it Zony? It's Zony. Zony. The S is silent. Zony. Or if you're Hungarian, it's Czony. Czony. Yeah. S-Z is a Czech. So it's Hungarian, is the... Yeah. Okay. Czech and Hungarian. Czech and Hungarian. Yeah. Have you been to Czech Republic? No.

No. I've been a lot of places, but I haven't been there. I hear that it's a beautiful place, but very sadly run down. It's not like a touristy place that's been upkept. It's like sad. I went there for the first time earlier this year and right before lockdown. And it's beautiful. The

Prague. Prague was beautiful. But it was small. You can walk from one side to the other. You hear that, Prague? Your shit was small. Tiny. Unimpressed. Insignificant. Now, I feel like photographers have this sort of willing identity crisis because...

it's one of those things where people have probably seen your work, but they see the subject and they don't see you. So what would people know you from besides that? Welcome to all production. Gosh, the people that make everything are like totally unsung. A hundred percent. Yeah. Like Albert, like a lot of my favorite people are photographers. Yeah. And it's this meditating thing where they just shoot the picture and let the picture be and slip away into the shadows. Yeah. Yeah.

I like doing that, but, um, what was the question? I'm sorry. How would people, you've shot both of us. What would they know you from? Uh,

Well... Oh, God, that's a lengthy question. Well, I shoot Dita Von Teese a lot. I'm lucky to shoot her. I like shooting drag queens a lot. I think... I've been in Los Angeles for about eight years, and the first person... Well, the first person I ever reached out to when I moved here was Devin Green, drag queen. Drag queen, yep. Because I saw her, you know, Welcome to My Vagine video, iconic, and I said, I have to know her. And the first...

real drag queen that I shot was, um, Sutan, uh, Maharaja. Oh my God. With the papery.

That picture is so cool. Thank you for that. Yeah, I was super broke and I was kind of going through like, I just happened, super broke, but a whole box of Swarovski crystals. So I was like, what can I do with like paper and crystals? And he was so lovely. I just reached out to him and said, I'm a big nobody. I just moved here and can I shoot your portrait? And not only can I shoot your portrait, but like, let's do this like finger mustaches tomorrow.

And he was like, great. What time do you want me to come over? And so that kind of, you know, kind of every, at least for me, every shoot kind of leads to the next shoot and snowballs. But yeah, so that's what I shoot. I have a million questions, but I don't want to forget to ask the, how do you, this is, I don't know how to, such a dumb question, but like, how did you come up with your story

How did your signature look develop? Because you have a style that is very identifiable. Thanks. I don't know quite how to describe it, though. And not easily copyable. Right. Oh, thank you. It's very, very, very rare, I think, to find somebody working in art, whatever medium it is, to be like, oh, that's this person. You have a style that's not derivative. It doesn't like...

It's unique. Thanks for that. How did that happen? I studied illustration, actually. I went to school in San Francisco, and illustration was my major for about three years, and it just was kind of a...

A family friend of mine said, hey, why don't you, all the elements that you love, lighting and fashion, makeup and making vignettes exist in photography. Why don't you try that? And I was just kind of like a fluke. And so I, literally all my counselors hated me. I just, after three years, I was like, well, I'm changing my major. And I just got into film photography, but I never even...

I didn't even really do that well in school because even in film photography, I was doing, I really had no interest in photography. Like I was layering like three negatives and I was bleaching things. And like, it really was about illustration for me. And, um, uh, actually my, um, my Photoshop professor failed me after two years of Photoshop, who said I had an unrealistic, um,

What is it? Unrealistic view of the program or something. I would never be able to use it in a realistic... My final project was all these bald aliens and whatever. So yeah, I... Hello. Hello, I'm still photographing the bald aliens. Yeah, what a good... Yeah, you're so good. So I don't...

I think any artist, I don't deem to like, what can I do that's different? I'm just making what I know how to make. You just do what you do. I mean, I guess that is, that's like the hallmark of any true unique individual is that you just do your, you just do your thing and then it is what it is. Yeah. But I don't look to photographers really. I mean, David LaChapelle was a big one in school that I knew of. Obviously, Pierre Agile, two amazing French photographers. But like, I didn't really know photographers, but,

like, you know, Mark Davis or Air Tay or like these great illustrators. I was like, I want my photography to look like that. So thanks for the compliment. It's amazing. It's really like, it has almost a...

Like it's everything sort of a still from a film in a way. It's very like cinematic. Yeah. Yeah. Very. There's. And I. Like an environment, like a world. Yeah. It's a universe. Yes. There's like a. There is. You look at your photographs and you kind of get the sense that there is like a Franz universe. It's so like Wizard of Oz adjacent in a way. Don't you think? And it's very. It's very. It's otherworldly, but it's also very flattering. Yeah.

Like, cause when we were, so we, I was so excited to shoot with you. He shot the red scare shoot. So, so far as I'm not the red scare shoot, which was so, so, so, so, so much fun. But the thing is as a drag queen and where, I mean, I've been getting photographed in drag for about 10 years now or more. And it just is as recently as a drag con a couple of years ago. They'll get the girls. They, they,

Sometimes what will happen is a superstar quote unquote photographer will come into the drag world and be like, I want to, you know, their interest is peaked and they shoot us. But what they're interested in is texture. Oh, they want reality. No, they want, they want the stark. Yeah. I mean, they want fried. Yeah. Pan fried reality. The crispy, crispy critter. Well, of course, listen, fuck them. Whatever. It was New York mag. It was two years ago and it was the worst pictures any of us had ever seen in our lives. And I hope everybody involved died.

And I think that's very fair. I was, when they took my picture, I was the freshest. I had just gotten there. It was like 15 minutes after I arrived and I looked a fucking mess because it was, it was like a, it was just everything. You could see every, it was like, you know, those mirrors that are like five times magnification. Oh yeah. It was like that. The way, the way you light to the, um, the unretouched,

You see it on your monitor and I'm like, this is going to be a great picture if that's the raw. Oh, yes. Oh, my God. Thanks so much. But so the whole point is with you, I knew 100% I was like, no matter what this motherfucker does, it's going to look fantastic. And that's very rare to have that kind of trust in a person because, like I said, you never know. It's that even...

it's sometimes it can go the other way where it's like the photo is so badly airbrushed where it literally looks like you're on a t-shirt in Florida. Do you know what I mean? Like the person was failed in Photoshop class. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. Well, I think, and I'm, I maybe I can speak for a lot of photographers, but I kind of feel this sounds really philosophical, but whenever I shoot someone, I'm kind of treating it like a self portrait. I'm shooting people the way I would want to be photographed myself. And I don't know if,

This kind of borders... I mean, we have all these terms. Is a photographer an artist? Is an artist a photographer? Are they the same things? Sometimes I think, obviously, we're living in a world that photography is so disposable. It's just in and out where... Because maybe... I just have a different outlook. My goal is always like, would I hang this picture in my living room? And if I wouldn't, then I don't really have any interest in it. So, you know, I've... Yeah. I think that makes a lot of sense. Yeah. You should...

I think it's okay to make something and love it. And I know we're supposed to be like, whatever I did it, I, whenever I'm glad you like it. I did a thing. You should love what you make. Yeah. I agree. And that doesn't mean it has to take forever. I used to be in that kind of mindset where I was like, this has to like, really like I have to,

bleed for this to mean something. So I would spend months making these huge sets and like, just like it was my whole life. But I think maybe coming to LA, I've learned to like, you can make something brilliant, you know, in an afternoon. And, and granted that, you know, just like our red scare shoot. Thank you for saying that. That was like, that was so much fun. It was relaxed. It was fun. Do you always enjoy yourself when you're in the process of shooting or working on something or can it be a slog?

Yeah. I, um, this also sounds really prima Donna, but I get really exhausted from shoots. I don't know if you like you're, you know, sometimes the fainting, you just kept falling. I was like, thank God for that. We had three. But you kept finding your light while it happened. Exactly.

Thank you. I also, by the way, this is so weird. I have no hair on my knees and people are always like, why do you have hair on your knees? But it's because I really feel... You wax them. Just a little circle. You're on your knees so much as a photographer, at least for me. I know that's an insert pun in here, but it's exhausting. You know, you have early call times. Oh, gorgeous. You don't, you know, I'm not like using the bathroom all day. You're barely drinking water. You're just like so in the zone that...

after 12 hours of that, you kind of, when reality snaps back, I'm just like on such a high when I shoot that I forget to take care of myself. So that's, yeah, that's a thing. That's, I mean, I feel like that's just a thing in general. Yeah. I don't, I enjoyed myself that day a great deal, but it's, by the way, I was told something very flattering. I was actually by multiple people on set. They said, Oh God, you would never do this for anyone else.

The fact that I was like, no, we need more. We need a couple more hours. Let's do this and this. And you kept showing up and you were like there. I felt very flattered. I love when you snatch the pads off and Franz goes, can you go put your legs and ass back on? You grabbed me at the shoulder. You're like, don't, don't ask. She's not going to do that. Our whole career is me. I'm like her secretary. People go, what about you guys doing this? I go, she's never going to do that.

But you did, but you actually showed it. You didn't, you didn't repad, but you came back and we made you a lovely muumuu and we had a fabulous little coda to the day. It was, we did a whole bunch. We did the video at the end of the day and it was fantastic. Yeah. But I will say, um, that was remarkable because that place had no AC and there was, I was wearing a latex, um, uh, vest or rubber vest.

And I, so there's like moments where I like, I almost, I can see that on the horizon snapping. I don't think I would never have snapped. Sometimes I require people to, and I always tell this to people, like, I will keep going until I get the shot. And if you are feeling like you need to stop, like you need to tell me that because I'll just keep going. Not, you know, so. Yeah. And you didn't, you just kept going. Yeah. I mean, it was, that was one of my better days, but like the, the,

You know, communication between a photographer and the person being photographed can be very strange. And one of the things I noticed with you is that you give clear direction, which I really appreciate because sometimes you kind of just, you're in front of the camera and you have no idea what, I mean, I can't see myself. I don't know if I look ugly, stupid, whatever. And it's really like. You never look stupid.

Wow. I mean, but you know what? No, come on. Like two degrees to the left. And it's like, man, you know? So it's like, it's kind of hard to, to just need a helpful, like just move your chin a few inches to the left. And you said exactly that. Like that's, that's very helpful to me rather than like fierce. Yeah. Fierce. Look fierce. Look sexy. You're like, what the fuck does that mean? I would never. There was this one photo shoot, whatever it was for out magazine. Yeah.

And I don't remember the photographer's name. And it was, um, I believe the person, I don't remember the name, but it was they, them pronouns. And they were shooting me and it was natural light from the side and they were kneeling. Oh,

And I said, this isn't working. I feel like we should flip this way. Like, you know, and I said, I'm worried about all this natural light and like the texture in my skin. And they go, oh, don't worry. I'm a master manipulator of light. And I go, okay, Thomas Kinkade, let's reel it back here. And actually that whole shoot, they ended up having to put them all in black and white because I was like,

These are nasty. You can't trust anybody. I don't trust anybody. You can't trust anybody, which is like that, which is why I'm going to, my claws are clinging into your side and they're not leaving, you know, because I like that, you know, she's dead and we're photographing the body. You're, you're going to be there at my wake, the open casket next year, three months from now. Um, thanks for that. Well, I, um, I mean, you should always have a queer mind on any set. I feel like,

I feel like, you know, not all photographers are created equal. Someone who does portrait photography, you know, I could never pick up a camera and like go shoot a wedding and like get, you know, I've tried to like catch that moment of like the, and like, I can't do it. But other photographers are great at that and don't know what the hell they're doing in a studio. So, you know, I think, um,

especially when you're shooting anything along the lines of glamour, you know, it's all lighting. So, you know, yeah, there are photographers that do want to see, and they're, you know, I can't believe I'm going to say this, but I'm going to say this. I remember even the Annie Leibovitz shots of RuPaul for Vanity Fair. They were stunning, but they were not necessarily lit in the most flattering way, so to speak. No, not at all. You know, and I think that's just what each photographer's prerogative about

you know, how fantasy you want to take it as opposed to like some photographers really do want, you know, and a lot of art buyers in the art world want to see the realism when you, they want to see the seams. They want the, they want the bubble gum on the side of the tuck. Yes. Yeah. And that's a fine. That's interesting to them. Do you know how many of those I've retouched girl? What has been the wildest thing you've retouched?

Like what's the nastiest, weirdest, wildest thing? Cause you're really zooming in on people's nether regions. Yeah. I can't say anyone in specific. Everybody's equally gross. For the people at home, let's recap some of my favorite pictures of you. Um,

obviously katya yeah shot me devon a bunch of times right love devon that those disney shots of devon yeah i shot her as maleficent she helped me get a contract disney incredible there's you did a few of marlo um marlo's wonderful yeah and i don't know if she was who was the one who had had the crown of uncut dicks well that was marlo so that was i mean that was probably the most retouching i've done on a piece i did a piece called medusa and instead of

It started off as a joke. I just said it a bunch of, you know, wouldn't great to do a head of penises instead of snakes. And everyone said, that's completely mad. You have to do it. And I just gotten, um, signed with Disney prior to that. So I was like, well, maybe I shouldn't do this right now, but, um, Disney actually, they said, whatever you do in your own private, just like hide the nipple, just like hide the piss lit. Yeah. Oh no, that was very, there was a lot of those, but, um, I worked with them. Marlo was the face of that. And then, uh, uh, uh,

lovely gentleman who shall not be named um was the the penises for that and um that took a long time because they you know all the dicks individually oh yeah oh yeah i mean they were all him yeah right unfortunately i knew him on a romantic level so the shoot was a little bit more uh you know oh we know what it was you fucking whore we know what well yeah

Thank you. You know what it was. I enjoyed my work. Yeah. And that explained why you kept touching me during our, I'm just kidding. That is not a joke. Not in 2020. Well, you know, I'm trying to think of all my favorite, uh, Gigi, that Gigi with the birds. She's yeah. Oh my Gigi gorgeous. Yeah. Sometimes people don't. Um, that's another thing that's interesting. I find with people that I, I think most, um,

Most people that are used to being shot are used to producing a lot of content. We need this many outfits, get the shot, you know, turn up. So we have lots of options. Whereas when I'm doing a piece like that, it's like, you're going to spend eight hours in hair and makeup. And then I'm going to shoot you for a half an hour and we're going to get one shot. And that's it. That's my favorite photographers. I've all done that.

Which is you. I loved shooting with you and then Albert. Yeah. And then you guys know Adam from Chicago? He shoots a lot of the Queens or he used to. What's his last name? Like O-M-A-N-E. O-U-H-A-M-E or something like that. Yeah. He's like, you know, he'll go in on that retouching. Yeah. But he shoots for like 20 minutes.

And he gets it. And it was always, to me, when you hear that number of clicks keeps going up, you start to realize that the person doesn't know what they're looking for. It's a waste. I never understand photographers. I mean, I guess unless you're shooting motion where you're just click, click, click, trying to get the right one. It's like, why? I come from the school of film where if you're shooting medium format film, you've got 10 shots and that 10 shots just cost you 500 bucks. So get the shot. Don't fuddly-duddly with stuff set up. But the one with Gigi actually took...

I should take that back because, you know, we were shooting with one bird named Peaky, which I had to shoot in multiple positions all around her and then composite it all together. And fun fact, the woman who owned that...

bird, Peaky, was the woman who played Samara in The Ring. You're kidding. Yeah, she was the contortionist and so she has this pet bird. So it was a great shoot and the bird was amazing and like literally was like a cat. Like you could hold it and

loved Gigi and talked to you and would like snuggle into your neck and totally changed. I'm a little scared of birds cause they are dinosaurs, but I love, yeah. Oh, I love birds. They're gorgeous, but you know, don't bite your ear off. Yeah.

They'll peck your eyes out. You don't think a dog will kill you? Absolutely. I know that. I count on it. I don't have any illusions about that. Next shoot, I'm putting dogs all over your shoulders. Yeah. Perfect. Dead dogs. Yes. Perfect. Oh my God. Can I ask, aside, who's like your...

your favorite person you've gotten to shoot where you're like, this is like the stuff that I dreamed about doing. Wow. Well, I still have a list of people that I was really. Yeah. Who's on the list? Let's put it on. Let's flatter. Vision. Angelica Houston. Come on. Um, until I've, I've, I was close to shooting her once. I'm still going to try. I was going to say, yeah, I feel like it was, you have to shoot her. Shoot till the, you got to. She has that like,

I mean, talk about alien. Oh, talk about like, she always looks like National Geographic. It's the last photo of her seen alive. Yeah. I love that. Yeah. Which is why you love shooting. Yeah. Wide eyes. But I mean, I would love to shoot like Gaga and you know, I like shooting. I'm not necessarily after shooting. Like what's the biggest celebrity I can shoot. That's not really what it's about for me. It's more about like, who can I transform the most? And usually I,

I like that process a lot of like, let's take you out of your element completely. And I know everyone's heard it. Like, let's do something totally different that you've never done. But I, I really like aspire to do that with every shoot that I do. And sometimes it's got me in trouble. I, I, I've pushed people a little too far out of their comfort zone and they,

they don't know how to react to the photos in the, in the end. It's too much for them. Really? So have, have you had like a, a person who's like really unhappy with the, um, it was me and I don't want to talk about it. I'm sorry.

I've really... Well, to different degrees. I mean, for the most part, everyone's always even... I'm really grateful that the majority of people that I've shot always are really happy with their images. Sometimes people that I've shot will give me a list of my along of like, I love it, but please fix this, which I'm always happy to do. There was only one person that I shot, which I shall not name her name, but it was... Yes. And it was...

it was horrifyingly bad. We just mouthed the word Susan Boyle. Oh no, I would love to shoot her. Yeah. And it was, and I think, um,

you know, if without fluffing my own feathers, I thought the images turned out gorgeous and everyone that saw the images said that she had never looked better. But, um, I think it was just too far out of the comfort zone, her comfort zone, how she's, how she's used to being seen. And, um, uh, and, uh, yeah, that was a kind of an ugly story because instead of just, um, maybe, um,

politely saying these aren't quite what I wanted she really kind of degraded me you're kidding yeah it was really bad it was like really really bad it took me a long time to get over that and you think that when you shoot people that have been in the industry for so long that they would have decorum and courtesy but yeah I didn't or that they've been through something like that before and then they approach it with a bit of tact yeah portrait like a portrait with someone like you is also so intimate so I'm sure for a lot of people it just is how is it not vulnerable and how is it not

Thanks for that. Well, I mean, I had a similar situation where I remember after our shots were done and they were rolling out. You said sharts. Sharts. After our shots were done. We have to stop and mention that you just said after I sharted on your shoot. Remember when I shit wet shit? I farted wet shit all over the floor at our shoot? Oh, no. She didn't say anything.

thing. He didn't even mention it. He quietly cleaned it up yourself which I thought was really impressive. Thank you very much. No but when the images came out I said aren't you going to retouch them at all and you said no they need to stay raw I'm not going to retouch these images we need to show people as you really are and then those were the images that people saw.

no Photoshop or anything. It's true. Yeah. In fact, I added wrinkles and storks to the finished one. That took me on a journey. I went, did we really not retouch those? I didn't realize you would be interior. Oh no, the retouching I think is the most fun part and retouching has been around forever. I really have like over the years have had to like

wade through the retouching pool because it's something that is so people get so opinionated about retouching but people loved people love this whole and now that the retouch the democratization of retouching is like through facetune everybody has retouched you know what I mean yeah

I mean, I don't know any drag queens who would throw up an image without a filter or some kind of face-tune thing besides you. I do it a lot. But I wear so much makeup that I know that if I light it straight on, it is what it is. And as long as the skin texture isn't being brought out, I can live with it. Yeah, yeah. What do you think about... I mean, I'm always fascinated by this like, oh, it's like you have to...

pull the wool over people's eyes like when you're retouching your own images that you can't let anybody know like that you've done like you've just come there's like a shameful element of it it's like especially with drag well that's a lot of times too why i don't allow people to see the images while we're shooting because people will get in their head and they'll lose the goal of the shoot they'll just immediately go oh god i need to change this and they won't just give me

what I need and let me worry about that later. But, um, I mean, retouching has been around forever. Ansel Adams retouched his work. And I mean, every shot you've ever seen of Marilyn Monroe, they would bleach their negatives and, and, you know, physically air, you know, that's where the term airbrushing comes. You'd physically airbrush your work with paint. And so, um, yeah, I, I kind of get up in arms a lot about the debate of like, you know, in order to

Thomas Edison. Thomas Edison. Famously wore a shape tape concealer at all times. Exactly. Well, yeah. I mean, the idea of idealizing art has been around forever since the Egyptians. So I don't know what just got me triggered about all of this. It's not unlike the idea of like, oh, this is retouched. You retouch this. But if you're going to be, it's not real. If you're going to be anti-retouch, you also have to be anti-hair and makeup. Yeah. And light. Clothing. Lighting. Yeah. Yeah.

None of that's natural. What are we doing? Well, what do you think about like taking out a leg? You know, like sometimes on the, it's always funny to see like, you know, in Vogue or whatever, where they're like, they'll just, they'll take the scale out of something or they'll just like whittle down somebody's arm to like a, to a bone or, and it just like, kind of insane that way. But I guess on the cover of Vogue, it's probably more like,

It's less about fantasy and more about reality, although I could be wrong about that. I wish it was back to fantasy. I know. I don't know. Well, you're really towing the line as far as like... Would you do a Vogue cover? Very high fantasy. Oh, in a minute. That'd be amazing. Who would be on your Vogue cover? Oh, God. Probably somebody already dead. I mean...

Yeah. I mean, like, I would pay for the exhuming of Lucille ball. If I could shoot Lucy, that would be okay. That's like the dream. You know what I mean? Yeah. What about a man? Who's your dead man?

Living, so let's say two men, living and dead. Who's your- Like a Vincent Price. I mean, I'm like, I live for that. I thought he was, him and his youth. If you ever look a picture of Vincent Price, young, damn. Really? Yeah. I'm going to look that up. While you guys look that up, we're going to take a break. Let's take a break.

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And we're back. And we're back. So, Vincent Price, young Vincent Price was a hottie. Who would be your living male cover guy? Oh, no. I'm so bad at this. Um.

I know who's beautiful. Who's beautiful? Are you paying attention to the people who are live right now? Not really. No. I'm not either. I never, I never know what anything is. Yeah. I mean, who's a, who, who, who do you think? I should shoot. I mean, you know, you would be really good with Timothee Chalamet. Oh,

Timotheni Chalowini. Timotheni Chalowini. Yeah, because he's got that, I feel like you could insert him into some kind of like dandy, he could, or Harry Styles. I'd love to shoot Harry Styles. You know who I'd love to shoot? Jonathan Taylor Thomas. JT. JT.

Childhood crush. Someone asked me that ages ago. They were like, who from the past, like heartthrob, would you shoot? But he's gone. He's just here. He's dead? Oh, no. I don't think, I got it. He's not dead. He's left this life. No, he's just, I don't know where to find him. But like, you know, I'd want to shoot with the most. I don't know where to find him. I keep looking. You have. You act like you're walking around Hollywood, like Hollywood, like Jonathan. I'm going to get that tattooed to my moomoos just looking for JTT. I have to ask, besides your photography, you have a very distinct personal style. When did,

When did you, I mean, it's your drag. When did you start dressing kind of the fantasy every day? Um,

Well, I have a great mom who really encouraged me from, I mean, really, I was wearing dresses and jelly shoes in elementary school. I mean, and my, my, and I should say both of my parents are really fine with that. But yeah, I, I don't, I think I, I was really privileged in many ways growing up, including that, that it was like, I never questioned that when people were like, why are you wearing a like floor length kimono in like high school to, you know, on a Tuesday? Yeah.

I just didn't, um, I don't know. I didn't get, yeah. And I grew up in Reno, which is a, now it's a little bigger, but you know, like the, the best place you could shop at was like hot topic. And I was like, I'm not going to go to JC Penny and like, I just don't know. I just wasn't like a jeans and t-shirt kid. So, um, yeah,

Yeah. I, thanks for saying that because I really only wear black moomoos every day. No, but you're so glam. Yeah, you are glam. And you, so, and you also, I mean, I remember a couple of years ago, we were over at your house and you're like, um, it was like, oh, I, I've been playing around with music. And then you played us. Oh my God. You played us. How have we not touched on it? You played us this track. And it sounded like so good.

so like you've been doing it all your life in addition to fonts being both an inspiration and beauty in front of and on the like on the camera lens both yeah both sides of the camera in the camera yeah thank you for that you also are a fabulous musician with probably some of my favorite music videos I've ever seen yeah the music video

It was so good. Petunia, so good. Like, it's embarrassing how good you are. Thank you. Really, that means a lot when people, I have no idea what I'm doing musically. And I truly mean that. I don't know. Because I have to say this too, coming from a photo background, I really, when I turned 30, I kind of had one of those like,

what am I doing with my life? Like, why am I not doing more stuff? Like, I know I'm a photographer and I love what I'm doing, but like, I should just be doing more artistic things. I think it's good for photographers to, to be in front of the camera every now and again, because it helps you direct your subjects so much better. It always blows my mind.

photographers, oh, I can't get my picture taken. It's like, no, like you need to know what you're making others suffer through, you know? Yeah. How do you, how do you, how do you deal with like, are you more meticulous or are you harder on yourself when you're in front of the camera? Like what's your experience of being the, the, the self portrait?

I just... I love your portraits of yourself. We're all just Gumby. I don't know. I don't look at myself as anything. Nobody's a model and everybody's a model. So I think to a photographer, I'm like, I know what I can... You can alter everything nowadays. So...

Yeah, I just, wherever we've segued, sorry, from music. Thank you for appreciating my music. It really just started off as like a, you know, I took a book of poetry that I had been working on and I was like, how do I turn this into- Oh, so you're also a poet. Well. Anything else? Car repair? Well, I only had the book because I got down the tree and made the paper. Yeah.

You're a true renaissance man. We all write poetry. Come on, we're all fiddly diddly. Several volumes. Yeah, exactly. I shouldn't even say poetry. Just, we all have ideas and we write them onto paper. I know we all do that. We form sentences, we call it poetry, we write the check. Exactly, yeah. But speaking of Devon Green and her magnificent beau, Ned Douglas, really, it was just friends that were like, encouraged me, that just said, you should turn this into music. And so...

I just got, I, you know, I'm just lucky that I'm working with really talented people that I can, you know, um, really like the, the first album that I did, I, I don't know how to read music or, um, uh,

I've never studied anything. So I was being very Enya in the sense that I was doing all of my demos just by layering myself humming in GarageBand. And I was taking all of these to net and saying like, okay, like here are the tracks that need to be guitar. And it sounded like a mess, but he, you know, a good producer. He deciphered it. Yeah. He was like totally, and he's very British. I can't, he hates it when I do that. But it's, yeah, he was just like,

It's so cool to be like I feel like we have a little coven going on here in LA It's a cool little group of people There's famous people and then there's the people you actually would have the privilege to meet The people who really like you who are just creatives who set the standard for both like

like the final product, everything you put out is so like, you know it, you stand by it, you swear by it, the integrity. You know what I mean? Well, the feelings mutual with you too. I think it comes down to art for art's sake. There are people who are making work for commercial. Yeah, when people think of us, they think integrity. I agree, but it's true. It's true. I mean, what you guys do comes from the heart and you guys have to go into another dimension to be as crazy as you. You know what I mean? You're not, I don't view you guys as being like commercial people.

even though what you do translates to commercialism well, but I think the core of what you do, neither one of you think about like what will do good commercially. You're just crazy people that are making art, which I really relate to, you know? So it's gotta be fun, man. It's a good balance because I'm, I've always got like a, I'm always trying to sell something on the corner and she's always kind of like, but I don't want to do that. And so it's a good balance of like, we have to get paid a little bit and actually enjoy it. Yeah. You have to get paid or else you,

you can't make the fantasy. You gotta get paid. So speaking of getting paid, let's take another break. Speaking of getting paid, let's take another break. We are back. We are back. So speaking of getting paid, what is it? So talk about working for Disney. Well, I, I mean, that sentence sounds a lot better than it is. I've only have one piece that's been released by them as of now, even though I have a whole stack of images that I've finished for them that I'm waiting. Okay. Disney. Um,

What do you want to know? That's the Maleficent. That was the first one. You know, I have to say, and I'm saying this, I'll do love. I wasn't really Disney's cup of tea, so to speak, but I grew up watching Disney films. And when I moved to LA, I was like, I have to do work for Disney. And Disney Fine Art is who I'm signed with. But it's a section of their merchandising where they feature maybe 100 artists worldwide that do merchandise.

different variations of Disney characters, but they, they don't work with photographers. They only work with illustrators and sculptors and whatnot. And so I went in there with all these big gay ideas and it took five years for them to, I'm not exaggerating five years of back and forth and meetings and give it, they probably had. Well, they're probably extremely protective. They're very protective. Of something as old and like,

I don't know, like, I guess what's the word important to them as like a sleeping beauty character. Yeah. I was referencing stuff, you know, Salvador Dali was one of Disney's best friends and the stuff that if you look at like old from the fifties, like conceptual art of those early Disney films, they were dark and like weird as hell. And, um, that's what I really wanted to tap into. But I, and I have to be careful what I say. I don't know if those ideas are still, uh,

what is wanted by Disney, but I'm still pushing it as far as I can. And, um, I mean, looking here, Devin, I mean, the way you shot her and the way it's lit, it, she's definitely spooky. She's definitely spookier than she's portrayed in the films. Her face is, um,

It's a little... If you woke up in the night and saw that across the room. Yeah. Horrifying. Devin's... That shoot, by the way, too, was like a 13-hour shoot. The police came because of all the smoke bombs. It was like... That was a good example of like, you know... Devin standing there dressed in this. Really. And Devin is such a pro. Didn't complain once, even though she passed out literally once because the... You people...

the fainting I know I know always pulling focus those horns were real and so they weighed so much and just having weight on your head for that long and you know I was pushing her to smoke bombs sulfur everywhere and just it was like a lot the knives yeah the knives the knives in her feet yeah exactly the feet that you bound before the day started yeah that's beauty standards yeah

You're such an icon. I just sometimes can't believe we know you. I know. And you're not an asshole. I mean, you know, you hear so many horror stories about people with major talent and it's like you start to think that if anybody's...

that good then they have to come with all this you know these caveats and baggage oh god ego will rot you ego will start to rot you yeah who has time for all that yeah exactly who has time for all that to know you is such a privilege and to be shot by you is like a whole nother privilege and I just always can't wait to see what you do next well let's keep it going you two yeah where can we where can people find you in your work well you can find me on my website franzoni.com or on Instagram at the same name

And that's S-Z-O-N-Y. Correct. F-R-A-N-Z-S-Z-O-N-Y. I'm telling you guys, just go to the website. The first thing you're hit with is a gallery view of some of these images and they will just...

I mean, I'm not encouraging them to do this, but it would make great phone screen savers. Absolutely. These pictures are so beautiful. Look at Candy Ken. Oh, Candy Ken as David. He's so great. So great. Matthew. Yeah, Matthew's fantastic. Have you shot Violet? I've shot Violet, yeah. They were... I don't...

She survived. She survived. Yeah. Violet's fabulous. I did some promo stuff for her tour. I've never shot her. Oh, that's her commercial. Yeah. I've always shot Violet as Violet. I've never really quite taken her as into like Fran's world, but I'd love to at some point. Yeah. I mean, when you're Violet,

You've already arrived. Yeah. Agreed. For us, he's more like, what if we got you in a totally different wig and makeup and a completely different outfit? Okay. What if I, let's, what if you look good? Yeah. I always say that's the like spirit of drag is you are a star. We just got to change your height, your voice, your hair, the color of your skin. Cut my hair. Cut my hair. We love you. Thank you so much, Franz. We love you both so much. Thank you for being here. Thank you guys. Of course. Thank you.

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