Social Media Scolding 44:36

This is a special Jan show today. We've got Caitlin Greene, but not for long because she's having a baby in two weeks and it's the size of, we don't even know what. Welcome, welcome to the Jan Arden show with Caitlin Greene, Adam Karsh in their respective homes. Caitlin has two weeks to go in her pregnancy. I know.

You just said, I don't care about the news just before we went on air. I don't care about the news because I don't have to. Not so much the news, but I guess current affairs. Hey, Caitlin. Yeah, because I think that was like the thing that I obviously did for work and followed most closely. And so I've been officially on mat leave from my full-time gig with the morning show on Chum for a week. And I just had to follow everything so closely every single day that I've really enjoyed not...

having to follow like the numbers and politics and natural disasters, just give myself a couple weeks to kind of ease into a new life. Now, would you have thought because you are a person who has made no bones about not being one of those young women, who from the time your biology and your body would allow it, you weren't like, I want a baby.

It wasn't, it wasn't on your plate. It wasn't on, it wasn't on my to-do list. No, it wasn't. And I think at times I actually really thought that I wasn't going to have children ever. And like, sometimes when people were really like pushy with asking, especially after I got married, were really pushy with asking me, even when I didn't think it was a for sure thing, I would sometimes just tell people, oh, I don't want children just to like stop the line of questioning. And I was kind of like fine with it.

And so it's a nice surprise. Like I still like it, but I certainly never, I never counted on it. I also never really counted on getting married. Like I didn't really think about that too much. I think that's the best way of going about it. Adam is nodding. So I have a feeling he probably didn't count on having kids or marriage either. No, I did. I did. I mean, I hear you because I understand where you're coming from. No, I wanted to get married all along and I wanted kids all along. So.

I am at the other end of the pool with you guys. And I'm not going to blame anything. I'm not going to say, oh, I was working so much and I was on the road all the time. I mean, let's face it, your relationships, certainly in the early days, are brief and fast and furious things. And it's people in the band. And it's, you know, kind of these...

I don't know. It really was burning candle at both ends. And it's funny because you blink and my God, 25 years have gone by. So I don't think I was ever the type of person that wanted to have kids either. And I've told you guys this before. I spent my twenties praying that I wasn't pregnant.

Like doing the prayer, telling God and Jesus and Moses that I would never have sex again. And as I got older, it's so funny, like 30s and 40s. And I've said this before, too. Mom would be like, well, your dad and I would look after the baby. So the story changed so much with them. But I would imagine your mom and dad are really thrilled. Yeah.

Yeah, they're excited. But I don't I don't think that they necessarily thought I was going to have kids either. Because you know, I'm not I've been I've been married for a while. And my husband and I have been together for even longer than we've been married, and I'm 37. So it was one of those weird things where I heard a great interview with Seth Rogen, who is I think the same age as me and him and his wife don't have kids. And it was with Dax Shepard.

and Dax was doing the thing that a lot of parents and most people who are quite happy I think that's every parent I know recommends having children like they all seem to complain about it but they like it and he was telling them like you know do it like it's like when someone really loves a movie they like want you to see the movie and love it too and Seth Rogen said the funny thing is like at a point you go from saying we don't it's like we don't have kids yet to all of a sudden you just ease without even realizing into the being the couple that doesn't have children

like actively doesn't have children. Yeah. And so like that had just started happening for my husband and I, where we were all of a sudden we were like the couple that didn't have kids. And I think so my parents probably didn't necessarily think I was going to do it. So they were pretty excited and surprised. I think my husband's parents probably thought we eventually would, but mine, certainly my mom, they were like, what? It's, it's funny how society is

has bound us to these stories before we even come out the gate. And I don't know if it's any worse now than it was 200 years ago. As we know, and Adam, you would know this too, women were so constrained. They had such a narrow road to walk. I mean, even as far as being able to read and write was discouraged. Right.

Um, we were not going to go down that road too much today, but it's amazing that as modern as we think we are, and as much as we really think we've, we've made all these strides, which I guess we have, there's still these really narrow guidelines as to, I mean, I get asked about kids all the time. You guys, I bet. I'm like, why did you have kids? Did you ever want kids? Um, oh yeah. And I'm 58 years old.

So it's, and part of me, I'm so, you know, openly ready to answer that question. I, yeah, it's weird, but I'm excited for you. I'm excited to see what happens. What has been the biggest surprise of being pregnant? What's been something that has surprised you the most? This is going to sound bad. It's like, it's not as terrible as I thought it would be. Yeah.

Like I did, I, I had, I like have low, had low expectations of it just because I think sometimes when so many of your super close friends, like all of mine have been having kids for the past, probably like really five to seven years. You hear all the stories like as being the close friend. So you hear about the, the morning sickness and the, like how you physically feel and then the after effects and all that stuff. So,

I maybe out of self-preservation, I like really lowered my expectation of pregnancy. Like, I'm just like, I'm going to assume this is going to be a dog's breakfast. And so I'll be pleasantly surprised. So I thought like, I really expected I would feel terrible all the time and I'd be cranky and hormonal and crying. And like, I just truly haven't had a lot of that.

which is great. Well, I mean, that's a great name for a dating agency is lowered expectations. Wasn't that an old SNL skit? Lowered expectations. Yeah. I think we all need that. Well, it's true. I mean,

It must be so weird that first three months when you're kind of thinking, this is real, this isn't going anywhere, this is going to take hold. And it's got to be strange feeling that first movement. I mean, you've lived, you know, three and a half decades kind of in your own, you've been in control of your own body. And then something moves and, you know, stuff gets real.

The shiitake mushroom gets real. That's, that's kind of a, that seems to me to be like more of a late second, third trimester thing that happens like early on. You don't look any different. Like if you, I just compartmentalized it to the point where I didn't think about it that much. And then as you get bigger and you know, you're, you're taking all your prenatal vitamins, like you definitely take better care of yourself that I noticed right away.

And because also it's a pandemic. So like a lot of people, I was having a lot of cocktails at home during lockdown. Yeah.

And so right away you're like, everything's different. You're like eating differently. You're not having any drinks. Like, you know, if there was like a smoker outside, I would try to like avoid walking near them. So you start trying to think about your health in a different way, which was kind of different. Were you one of those people that didn't do, I know there's certain kinds of cheeses, soft cheeses, unpasteurized things, um,

uh sushi i think women pregnant women are are sort of that yeah yeah they don't they want pregnant they don't want pregnant women to eat that and i mean i think it's it's really it's it's like it's so different than what you know the general rules are um now i think like if you live like we live i live in toronto and so obviously we're not near an ocean so most sushi that you eat is flash frozen and so it kills a lot of the bacteria that would cause food poisoning but

Um, you're actually at greater risk of getting food poisoning from chicken than you are from sushi or from bag salad or from deli meat. So like, there's lots of stuff that you just, you know, avoid. And, um, yeah, but I was doing that. Like you asked if cheese is pasteurized and, and all that stuff comes into play a little bit, but it doesn't like, I don't think there's a ton of unpasteurized cheese, even in Canada. Yeah.

I posted a thing of eggnog, actually. I posted a Christmas time, like is November too early to have eggnog on my Instagram? And I had a bunch of like finger waggers being like, you can't have eggnog.

And I was like, yeah, it says pasteurized right out of the bottle, dum-dum. And also, we don't sell unpasteurized store-bought eggnog in Canada. But I do think that that happens a lot. As a pregnant woman, everyone starts to treat you as being not somehow intelligent enough to make your own decisions. And they think that they have more of your baby in mind than you do. So that part has been a little... I've been sheltered from that because of the pandemic. I'm just not seeing her around people anymore.

which is great, but they'll still DM you. I don't like being admonished by complete strangers. I don't like the finger wagging stuff. I don't like the comments. And I have to say, and people have criticized me a little bit for blocking the way that I do. Because even on Instagram now I block, I'm doing a lot more than I used to. And if somebody else does mean I block them,

Just because I don't want that vitriol on my site. And if I have finger waggers, I will block them as well. Like I've had all these deer in my yard.

and I don't feed them. Just FYI, I don't feed them. I don't have oats or bales of hay. I put bird in these way up high bird feeders that I have, and I sprinkle some seeds on a table. Like there's not enough to feed a magpie, for God's sakes. But the deer come by, they're curious that I'm out in the yard. They're not always here. And honest to God, if they have 10 little minuscule sunflower seeds each,

Um, but I've had so many people, a fat deer is a dead deer. Oh, you, oh my gosh. I've had some, so I, so I blocked them. And then I had a woman, um, who came on after I'd apparently blocked her friend. And she said, uh, you know,

Just because someone has a difference of opinion with you, you know, I think it's really immature or something to block them. So I blocked her. Good. But I'm just like, I'm not going to respond to you. No. So you can go tell people, oh, that she blocked my friend, then she blocked me. I'm just like, I am not going to listen to criticism anymore.

Like I said, I'm 31 years old. Okay, whatever. But you know what I mean? It just gets to the point where it's my feed, my page. So Caitlin, I really feel for you of having anybody interject their ideas. It's your body. You're not 21. You're listening to the Jan Arden show. We're going to be right back with more of, you know, very interesting things that you won't want to miss. Don't make me block you. Someday, a big enough thing you can't hit.

Welcome back. You're listening to The Jen Arden Show. I'm with Caitlin and Adam.

We've been talking about being admonished by perfect strangers on all social media formats. Never mind that. Some people can be as brazen as to say stuff to you like in person. We haven't been around people a lot because of COVID. We haven't been really interacting. We have masks on now. We have two masks on. I'm doing two masks. I don't know about you guys, but if I go anywhere even near a store, I throw on two masks. I don't give a crap. Why not?

I'm like, I don't want the strain. I don't want the variant. I don't want nothing. And I haven't had a cold this year. I haven't had anything. I haven't had a tickle in my throat. Nothing. Anyway, people don't... I feel like...

They just don't even think it through. They will tell you, especially since Caitlin's been pregnant, you shouldn't be having that or you shouldn't do that. Or, you know, that'll happen. Oh, their heads will be too big or whatever. People just, there's always something they can't help themselves. And it was like, even before when I didn't have kids, it was like, as, as you may be experienced as someone who doesn't have children, especially for women, it was like, oh, you'll just one day you'll just have them.

one day it'll like this knowing I'm like you don't know me and it's always strangers

and they would just say, you know, like, oh, have you and your husband thought about little ones yet? I'm like, no, not really. Like, you know, Josie42783 on Instagram, I have to record. And then, you know, oh, well, one day you will, and your life will be complete. And I'm like, yeah, like, maybe it will, maybe I will, you know, and maybe my life will feel more complete, but also, like, kind of go away. Yeah. There's...

I don't know where it comes from, this desire to somehow force your ideology into people's lives. And has social media made that different? I can't tell. I feel like maybe it feels like in Victorian times, it was equally as bad with the... I would call it gossip. I would still say that this is a type of gossip. This is still a type of judgment. Mm-hmm.

uh, push, you know, forcing yourself, your, your, you just, judgment is sick. It's just, it's a terrible, it's more like now there's more, there's like more access for so many people because, you know, everyone can reach you via your phone, just like DMing you, or they could tweet at you or whatever. So you're, you're much more available to people who have

who don't maybe really know you, especially if you're a public figure in some capacity, which I'm sure you're very familiar with being that you have so many followers. And I just don't know that it's, and like 90% of people are absolutely wonderful. It's just, there's still that 10% that are problematically annoying. And that's kind of, you know, they've always probably been that way, but now there's just like so many of them that can reach you care of your phone.

yeah, it's, it's, it's an irritating side effect of social media where it can be so fun and such a great way to connect with people and share information. And it can also just be like, oh, and I see that happen with you a lot of times, Jan, with swearing. Well, I have a lot, I have a, I have a lot of men calling me a potty mouth. Yeah.

A potty mouth. I can't believe it. Well, you know, your ideas and the things that you care about would be a lot more accepted if you weren't such a potty mouth.

And then I tell them to F off. So I'll quote them. I love that. I tell them to F off, like F off Dawn or F off whoever. And I just leave it at that. But swearing to me, it's not, it feels so good. There's just, the F word to me is the quintessential verb, noun, adjective. It just, it encompasses everything.

And I'm just not, I, I, I like swearing and I don't think I ever do it in a malicious way. Even when I'm telling someone to F off, my tongue is firmly planted in my cheek. Yeah, totally. And I think it's also, it's like, it's a lot, some of swearing is like humor based. Like it, sometimes you just swear and it makes things funnier. Like there's just, you know, it's, and it's just the way it is. And also I know there've been like countless studies cause I've like read them. They would get sent to the,

show in like prep services, but all these like studies that say they link swearing to intelligence or creativity. And if someone doesn't like swearing, I would just encourage them not to do it themselves and also to unfollow people if they don't

see them swearing a lot and they find that offensive, but people have a really hard time scrolling past. Some people just can't scroll past things. They think that their two cents is worth anything to a stranger on the internet. And it just isn't. Well, I just, I'm

I just don't understand how my language on my Twitter feed is affecting your life or affecting my messaging. I mean, a lot of people come to my defense and a lot of people swear along with me. It doesn't happen a lot. Like most people, people will say I'm following Jen because of her swearing. Yeah, I've seen that. It's pretty funny. Yeah, I'm following Jen because of her swearing. That's why I'm actually on here. But, you know, as a woman, I feel like

I don't know, I just find it very insulting to be told how to behave in any way, shape or form. And I don't tolerate it. And I'm much different about it than I am, than I was 20 years ago. 20 years ago, I kind of cowered. I kind of, I stepped back out of my own light. I didn't, I thought, oh, I just, God forbid, I should offend somebody or make someone dislike me or, and don't get me wrong, I don't want people to dislike me.

I don't. No one does. I don't think. Right. But on the other hand, I do not need to prove myself or to have people to like me in order to like myself. I know that makes very little sense, but I'm not dependent on other people to value my own ideas and my own place in this world.

And I think that's something women really need to understand is that you don't need to rely on other people. And social media is very dangerous for that. I mean, especially for young people, young women and men are so adversely affected. And we talk about this a lot on the show because it's huge. Yeah.

It's such a big deal now that the world of social media has become such a regular part of our lives that there's no and a lot of times to all see like not necessarily on like your account, but on a lot of accounts, someone gets they start getting trolled by a few people. And everyone's like, oh, just ignore them. And you're like, yeah, that is usually like the right attitude. But sometimes you just want to write back to someone and say F off.

dawn and I also love I love I like I'm I'm fine to block people I also love muting them they don't even know they're not getting through they they don't even know and that's the other thing that's funny too about like you know when they reach out they don't realize it and that way they're just like yelling into the abyss forever which is about right for a lot of people who make this their hobby to just like attack random people on social media um it just depends on

It just depends on the day of the week, too. Sometimes it's just people seem to get really bent out of shape, and other days it's just very lovely on Twitter. Do you guys worry about... I mean, Adam, you have girls. You're about to have a little son, Caitlin. They're coming into a very different world, and I know this seems like such an old...

kind of a tired narrative about, well, back in my day, we walked up here to school and up here away. And I don't mean to be doing that to you now, but it is a very different world that your little girls are in. And it's a different world than your son is coming in. Do you guys worry about where, like how are you going to, I don't know, what are you guys going to do? How do you approach parenting? We're old enough to know the power of a device in your hand that literally connects you to the world.

We understand what it does, how it works. But we didn't have that, Adam. Right. But the girls, my girls, have grown up with a cell phone or an iPad in their hand. And I don't think that they, at their ages of seven and nine, truly understand the power that's in the palm of their hands and what it means to text something or post a video on TikTok or watch TikTok, whatever. But I just, I think, I mean, in a broader way of...

the world they're coming into. I mean, your son's being born into COVID. He's a, he's a COVIDian. He's a coronial. Yeah. And like, how do you, I would just worry so much. Like, how do you protect them? How do you keep them safe and safe?

Yeah, I think it's mostly like, I think there's going to be so much that we don't even like, we're not even using yet. Like I was thinking about, you know, Instagram the other day and like Twitter for him. And I watched a really great documentary called Fake Famous. That's on HBO Max right now. It's about social media influencers. You can watch it on Crave. I recommend it. And I thought to myself, oh yeah, how will I approach this with him? And I thought, I don't even know what he's going to be doing yet. It hasn't even been invented. Hang on to that thought. We're going to talk about that when we come back. This is the Jan Arden Show.

Welcome back to the Jan Arden Show. Caitlin, just before we started today's program, you were talking about going out and buying a whole bunch of biscuits. What did you buy? So I'm in like crazy nesting mode, but it's interesting during the pandemic because you can't like go into a store or do anything. So you're trying to do it online, which kind of makes your brain cave in. And one of the things I thought of out of nowhere was just how I'm not going to want to cook.

And but I am going to want certain like comfort foods around. So I'm trying to like do stuff now in advance. And it was these biscuits and scones, these current scones, and biscuits and a blueberry compote from a really great breakfast place here in Toronto called Mildred's Temple Kitchen. They're like known for their brunch. Yeah, you know, Adam? Yes, yes, yes. I think I've been there. Yeah, they're great. So I was like, I have to have these in the freezer so that when we get home, I can make them.

So do you have like all the baby room done and everything? The baby room is not totally done, but I think we have the essentials pretty well, like organized. Like, you know, we've got the crib change table. The rocker comes this week. We got blackout curtains actually just installed recently, which is a good idea for any, any parent who's thinking about what they're doing for their nursery setup. Now do we have a crock pot in the nursery? Now what are the end things in nurseries now?

Now, do you have the convection oven, like the air fryer, the crock pot, the Instapot? I don't even know what to put in a nursery now. Like, I'm out of that loop. Do they have their own little coffee pot in there? Yeah.

Can you imagine? I want to name that character, whoever that voice just was. What's her name? Boy, did it ever save us time when we put that crock pot in our daughter's room? It just, you know, lunchtime, honey, it's in the crock pot. And those meals, they lasted days. And we just gave them a big spoon.

I don't know why I imagine her name being like Donna. Lana Mulroney. No, that's not. Well, I mean, I just I'm thinking of people's nurseries now, right? These beautiful the thought that goes into them. We're going to do a light green because it's neither boy nor girl. And we don't we want to be non-binary. And people are putting a lot of.

thoughtfulness into that, you know, when they don't want to shove boy ideas down boys throats and girl ideas down girls throats. Like I think those times have got to go away. Like me personally, I am over it. Let kids figure it out. And, and, you know, there's, there's, there has been a dialogue about transgender and what it means to, to have, you know,

these different layers of, of being a human being that don't involve being a boy or being a girl. Yeah. So I'm thinking about you guys in that fact too. You don't know what your son is going to be like. You have no idea what,

who he's going to be. But I would like to think that you and your husband are going to let him be exactly who he wants to be. Yeah, exactly. And not try to conform into this tiny space that society has created for all of us. And you experienced, Adam, you experienced it growing up. We all did. This is what we're supposed to be like. Yeah. Yep.

And it's for, it's to the point kind of that we were making about even just the presumption that every woman wants to have children, the presumption that, you know, every guy is this tough guy and like, don't cry. Like there's, you know, the, the, the quote unquote stereotypical gender roles, like they serve no one, even if you aren't struggling with gender identity issues when you're younger. Even if you're, even if you feel like your representation is intact kind of thing, and you're not looking to make any changes. Even,

Even if you're in that position, it still doesn't serve you to live your entire life in pink or blue. Like it's just, it's, you know, it's not kind of the way things are done anymore. And to be made fun of for that.

To be made fun of, you know, literally colors that you're supposed to wear and not wear. So you have to think about how ludicrous that does sound. You know, it's time to move into a new way of thinking. And there's nothing more appealing to me than someone who's truly that individual. And we've all met those people in our lives who are going, oh, my God, they're so themselves. They so march their own drum or they're so unique. They're so...

They're so extravagantly, wonderfully, I don't even know what you'd call it, just themselves. Yeah.

We meet so many people every day that just have sort of decided that status quo is okay and they want to fit into this mold. They don't want to cause any waves. And I understand that because a lot of people don't have the fight in it. It's just like, I would have done that, but it was just too hard for me to think about living my life that way or whatever. And I'm not even talking about sexuality. I'm talking about identity.

Because they're two very different things. People get that all tangled up all the time with, you know, how people identify. And I have actually had several people in my world that have come out as being non-binary people.

transgender people. And I asked so many questions. You have no idea. I just, my hand is in the air going, you know, I was typing my friend the other day going,

And they had just, you know, come forward and said this was their reality. And I didn't miss beat. I'm like typing away. What? How can I help you? How can I be an ally? What do I do? And I don't I don't know a thing about this. And they were so kind and laughing and making jokes and like, oh, my God, Jan. OK, well, here's the basics. And here's where it comes from for me. So that's what I think about when I think of Adam with your girls. And what have you decided on a name yet?

I have a favorite, but I don't, we don't, we're like, you don't want to sign. And we're also trying to like stay open-minded that like, maybe, you know, maybe the baby comes along and it's different and we feel differently about it. So we're just trying to like be as chill about it as we can. And then, um, but I think we have a favorite. So yeah. And, and the funny thing, the funny thing about it is like, without even kind of going into it with this in mind, it's.

It's a, it's a very kind of neutral favorite. So it would, it would work no matter what. And it was funny because I looked at our nursery recently and it's very neutral. Our, our place is very like neutral colors, all like mostly just like grays and creams and black, whatever. And you know why we mostly did that? We mostly did that for like resale purposes of our place. Yeah.

I don't think we had nursery stuff when we were kids. I was thrown in with my older brother. My mom said, you slept at the foot of our bed for a year and a half. I didn't even have a freaking room. And my brother was tied to a tree. But when I put Dre in the backyard...

Jan, he would wander all over the neighborhood. I guess it was different then, but they tied him to a tree. I'm telling you, parenting is a far different thing. I think people are actually more freaked out now than they were 50 years ago. Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. Allergies and freaking peanuts.

Do you know my, my girlfriends, I have multiple girlfriends who've done this and we mean, I don't know if it's the, if it's the golden rule here, I'll find out Adam, you have two kids, so you can tell me, but when their kids, when their kids first tried peanut peanuts, any peanut product, they drove to a hospital parking lot and gave them peanut butter and the we're told to give them peanut butter in like the parking lot of a hospital.

I was like, how do people make it through the day? Cause that is just so much stress. And I do, I really do feel for parents there. They must be very stressed out. We did not do that. To a parking lot of a hospital. No, I love peanut butter. I joke with Risa. I'm like, if any of our children have a peanut allergy, we're sending them back. Cause I need my peanut butter.

Well, I have heard it all. No, I haven't heard it all. But that is, that's bananas. Thank you so much. You and I have had the CTV handbook. That was bananas. I feel as though it was just one of those situations that is designed to make parents mad.

very scared. And so as you said, I bet 50 years ago, your parents weren't worried about half the stuff that they are now. And I'm sure some of the things you worry about now, it's great, because statistically, maybe it has increased the life, you know, quality of children and parents, whatever, that's probably helpful in some instances. But overall, I bet you they're really freaked out. Because some of the stuff is really scary that parents are told, like, it's very scary stuff. I feel like you and your husband are going to have

a couple of months of like, just, you know, some trepidation, hold the head, right, honey, you know, you know, probably sitting by the bed all night, making sure the monitors on really loud so you can hear everything. And then I think you're going to loosen up. I really feel like Caitlin, you're going to, you are going to be such a good parent. Like you,

I keep thinking, you know, my God, if Adam can do it. I'm just kidding. No, but I mean, I bet you had a few trappers. I bet you, Adam, were more of a nervous Nelly than your wife.

Yes, I'm totally nervous. Thank you. I'm totally nervous. And to this day, I'm nervous. I'm the anxious one. I am totally the anxious one. Well, when we come back, see, that's non-binary. It's because the woman's supposed to be the neurotic nervous one. You're listening to the Jan Arden podcast. We're going to be right back. And I have some very deep questions.

to ask before I let these two guys go today. We'll be back. You're listening to The Jan Arden Show. Fathers be good to your daughters Daughters will love like you do

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Welcome back to the Jan Arden Show. We've been talking a little bit today about, I guess, child rearing, about being a parent, about how things have changed and they haven't changed, about how nurseries should have a crock pot or shouldn't they?

Listen, and I'm not kind of making this stuff up. My friends years ago, I mean, their kids are like teenagers now, but in their nursery, they had some pretty wacky stuff. They had like a humidifier.

They did have the light thing that was kind of cool that shone stars on the ceiling that I actually was very jealous of. And those little light things have come a long way. They have things that you can project on ceilings, like moving planets. And I mean, they're beautiful. These, the rooms had everything, but here's the kicker. The kids did not want to be in that room.

They wanted to be like under a freaking old blanket in the living room with a flashlight and, you know, where the cardboard box was from the GD armchair they bought. So I don't care what you do for your kids, you know, how much stuff you get them. They really, they don't, I just don't think they want it.

A lot of the stuff is for the parents, I think too. A lot of the stuff that's around now is definitely intended to make my life and my husband's life easier, which I fully appreciate. So there's a lot of that. And then some of it is like for the kids, like the toys and stuff like that. You obviously realize that's for the kids to enjoy. The rest of it is mostly either to like save you space in your home or to keep things moving, make something faster, give you more time.

And those type of advances, I definitely appreciate. Oh, absolutely. I mean, yeah, there's a lot of modern...

and conveniences. I think the days of changing your child's dirty butt on a kitchen table or the backseat of a car. I mean, now they have mats and they have plastic things that fold out even on airplanes. They have a thing that clicks down, you know, for people that do travel with infants. I know that there's a couple of specialized spots in the bulkhead of a plane where there is a thing that flips down. And there's still that thing. And you're going to be facing this Caitlin. Are you going to breastfeed?

I think you try. Like, I mean, that's mostly how I look at things is like, I'll try whatever has the most scientific data behind it to say like, this is helpful for your baby. So I'll always look at it and I'm like, okay, there's some good research behind this. So I'll give it a whirl. And then if I, but I'm not going to lose my mind over it if it doesn't work out either. That's the other thing.

So I'm like, I'm not driving myself crazy and I'm not there. I'm not involved. I don't like competitive parenting. I think it's really unhealthy. And I find- Tell me what you think that is. Cause I want you to expand on that. There's a lot of parenting. There's a lot of like, I've done this the best way. And- Oh my God.

Yeah. Like, you know, have you like, it's, it's a lot of like goop type advice. Sorry, Gwyneth, but she's unfortunately branded herself that way, even though I think she's probably pretty smart. But yeah, so there's a lot of that. And there's a lot of, I found too, there was, I don't know, Adam, if your wife experienced this or if maybe this missed you, but a lot of the move towards natural quote unquote, which actually, I don't, I don't even want to say natural because I hate thinking that there isn't a non-natural

natural way of giving birth to your child. So, but like going drug free when you give birth and that there was a lot of that. And I think it's a great choice to have. If you don't want to use any drugs and you want to go drugless when you give birth and you want to do it at home or whatever, I love all the options that are out there for women. I don't like the finger wagging of you should do it this way because there's no metal for you at the end. There's no award. But here's the finger wagging thing again.

And it comes back of this is how you do it. This is the way I did it. And a lot of times it's people that don't even have any experience with parenting. Like the one thing I know I would never do because I don't have children, I would never tell you how to do anything. I don't have a GD clue.

What to do or how to do it. And I have, I have friends who planned a home birth and they planned a home birth. They had the birthing pool set up and everything. And they wound up having an unplanned cesarean section in the hospital. And, and they felt.

I think they had some psychological like difficulties with it. They felt there was some level of, you know, quote unquote failure or this wasn't part of my plan or and then, you know, the whole like, are you trying for a natural birth? Like again, and I like that happens like people, women sometimes have to have unplanned cesareans. A lot of cesareans are unplanned. And I don't think that

I don't like the notion for women in general that there's a right or wrong way or best way to give birth because ultimately the baby's going to decide to do what the baby's going to decide to do. Circumstances are what they are. We live in a great country that will give you all the care you need for whatever scenario you find yourself in. And I think that's what's important is that you have the most positive health outcome for the mother and child afterwards.

I don't plan anything. I'm not a planner. Anytime in my life, I've even attempted to plan, okay, this year, I'm going to da-ba-da-ba-da, da-ba-ba-da, and da-ba-ga-ba-doobie. It never works out. It's always like the best laid plans in the world are going to be

sidelined because life has a completely different idea of what it's going to do. Did I think I'd be laboring in a mask? No, no, you did not. I did not plan for that, but yeah, you will be, won't you? You'll have a mask for, I think a portion of it. I think late stage, they cut you some more slack once you're in your room too. And you're by yourself. Like I think everyone gets a

private labor room now. Yeah, you will be. And then if you're in a shared post room, I think you probably everyone has a mask on. You know, you don't plan on those things, but you got to try to roll with it. Like that's the that's the only thing I can think of for me, at least. That's the only thing that works for me. I don't want to get caught up in one way of thinking. Yeah, you're right. One way of thinking is is boring and it lacks a lot of adventure. I want to be on an adventure and I would like to think that

the greatest things in our lives, in human life, is the idea and the art and the whole concept of surprise. Guess what happens? Surprise. I mean, it's always a surprise when good things happen and when bad things happen. We don't see any of it coming. And anybody that thinks they can control the plot,

in their lives is kidding themselves. And I find those people to be terribly unhappy. They're usually the judgmental ones. They can't control anything happening to them, but by God, they're going to insert themselves and try and control something about you. Here's the big question I've been wanting to ask. And it's not unrelated to what we've been talking to, but I want to know if either of you are afraid of dying.

Yes. Oh, yeah. Adam, we know this about you, I feel like. Have you mentioned this before? Yes, I'm terrified of dying. But we had... I've asked it in a roundabout way, and I think...

I just, I had so many DMS of people asking, they wanted to know more about it. They wanted to know, we really wanted to know what you guys thought. So when you, when you think about dying and, and what I asked you guys before conceptually was where you thought you would go. But now with the kids and what's made me think about it more is we all know we're going to exit this planet, but yet here, here you guys are with children.

Even though we know what the end game is. So that's why I wanted to just take this a little bit further as to how you just how you put that on your table and look at it.

I mean, I think that beyond the practical part of it, like hoping that I left enough money to my son and I like, I, that's kind of where my head goes first. I'm like, Oh shoot. I hope I've left him enough cash. And then also, you know, I hope that everything's as easy as possible, like for, for him, um, like in terms of logistics and all that. So yeah. Interesting.

Once that stuff is done, because I'm like, I just don't want to have to worry about anything. That would be the only thing. And then after that, I kind of, I'm a bit like, who knows? I always found it incredibly presumptuous of anyone to be like, I know for certain what happens in the place that no one comes back from and can't tell us anything about. So I'm like, I have no idea. In the last minute, like, is this not frustrating though as a parent? You're not going to be here for the whole thing.

Like you're going to exit, obviously, thankfully, gladly, long before your kids do. Hopefully not. I mean, is there not that that desire? Oh, I wish I could see what happens to the whole story. Yes, kind of. But I kind of feel like that's the way it's supposed to be. Okay. Yeah.

I think I'm just going to lie down in the fetal position now. Adam. So you do think about that, right? Yes. You want to know the rest of the story. I know. I know. Yeah. It's it's so it really freaks me out. I bet. I bet.

No, I, I, I'm sorry. I just wanted to ask it because that's what I think about with parents and we're at the end of the show. Maybe next week we'll talk about it a little bit more, but just, just gosh, dang it. Everything we know and love as a person will, will leave us. I mean, what a positive thing to end the show on. So let's not end it there. No, Caitlin is going to be, she got one more week after next week, but thanks for listening.

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