Pants Are Mandatory 43:48

It's the Jan Arden Podcast and lots of things are happening here. It's a snowstorm in Calgary and it's time to put up the Christmas tree. Okay, I'm going to stop now. Oh my God. I apologize. Hello, listeners.

We just, we're so happy to be here. We're out, we're smiling. We can see each other on our Zoom call. Lots going on, so let's get right to it. Caitlin, let's just start off with the no pants that's been going on. Minnie! That's my dog. She's barking at squirrels. Because it's a winter wonderland here, I'm responsible to feed everything in my forest. I want you to know that. All the animals are like, where's the sun? Where's the grass? We need you, old lady jam in the woods. Yeah.

I watch your Instagram stories and just laugh at the number of wildlife visitors you have on your property. There was that squirrel that seemed to have commandeered the outdoor dog bed this week. You've got a woodpecker who was single-handedly trying to take down the remainder of your tree deer. Like I just look at the window of my condo and mostly see treetops and hear sirens. So it's kind of nice. Well, it's a, if you guys were here, um,

I'm telling you, I would have to like lend you snowsuits and boots and things like that. This really is unusual for this time of year. And they said something that it was a record low of the last like 80 or 90 years since they've been keeping weather charts that, you know, minus 12 sort of mid October or wherever we are, third week of October. It's a bit much, but yeah,

You know, there's good things about it too. You feel like it's okay to just be by yourself in the trees with your little dog without feeling like you're missing out on the world. So it's somewhat helping my lack of

like social connections. It's making me feel like, well, yeah, it's snowy outside. I should be in here alone kind of staring at a book by myself. It's not that bad. Jan Auden, Lady of the Forest. No, I like that, Jan Auden. I love that. You can start announcing all my tours, Adam. And here she is, Jan Auden, Lady of the Forest.

It was kind of a good week to be hiding out in the forest, I think, though, because, boy, this was certainly a week for insane trending news. Like, there were so many stories this week that I could not possibly imagine being real, and they were. Great week for people who can't keep their pants on.

People who have a hard time. Let's start right there. Let's just go. Because I know you're going to talk about Rudy Giuliani. So, yeah, it starts with Jeffrey Toobin. He is CNN's chief legal analyst and he's a longtime journalist for The New Yorker. And so you figure this is like a busy guy right now. You know, he's talking a lot about the Supreme Court.

court confirmation that's happening. He's talking a lot about the possibility of the election results in the U.S. being challenged legally. So this is someone who should be making the rounds right now. And instead, he's been suspended by CNN. He's also been or no, he's been suspended by The New Yorker. And he has decided to take a leave, which understandably has happened because he was caught on a work call, a Zoom call.

work call with his colleagues, I believe at the New Yorker. And he didn't, it started by saying he didn't have his pants on and everyone started thinking, oh, well, he was probably just, you know, like rushed over to make it to the laptop and then stood up without his pants on and thought that his microphone and his, his camera were off. But what he actually was doing was he was touching himself without his pants on.

- It's a call. - So how do you have the lapse of judgment to be, I mean, we can all see our screens. We see our screens when we're on Zoom calls. You can see how it's framed. - Yeah. - Right. - Adam's got his hands on his desk right now. You're sitting in a red chair. You have a black shirt on. I can't see below your waist. So if I turn my camera,

or point it down, and I can see him like I have black sweatpants on or whatever. So I find that, you know, I have to really suspend any kind of... I just, I don't see how it's plausible, Caitlin, for him to be...

fondling himself and pleading that he didn't realize he was on camera. Like, I think he didn't. I believe that he said he thought, and this was just the most, the biggest indicator that this is somebody who is like not technologically up to speed based on how much we have to use technology right now for work. He said, oh, I thought I had muted the camera. I was like, well,

that's not how a camera works but you can see yourself right can't you see yourself but like so i don't know if he had partially you can you can well he might have partially closed the laptop lid like i haven't dug into the minutiae i'm honestly afraid i'm going to see a picture so i just know that i just know that he was caught and everyone starts saying he was caught pulling a tube in which is the most apt description of what he was doing i've ever heard and

And then, but the real question is, the real question is, why are you doing this on a work call? Like, why is this something that is arousing for you? How creepy is that for your coworkers? Like, it's just, it's a disaster. It's so embarrassing. He had to issue a public apology on this. And he sounds like he's, you know, the old creepy guy who can't work his computer.

I have a once a week meeting, like a Zoom meeting with my team. We have our weekly meeting. And as much as I love to see my coworkers, there's nothing arousing about the Zoom call. So I don't get why he would be- Glad to hear that, Adam. Thank you for that. You're welcome. I'm really glad to hear that there's nothing arousing. Well, listen, if it was me, I'm telling you,

I cannot express the depth of my shame and horror. Like, I don't know if I would ever personally recover, even if I was just caught like scooting by nude, you know, late for a call. I can't even imagine what the circumstances would be in order for me to appear, even with a side boob on a, on a call. Like I just would be mortified.

Like, I'm not nude alone. Like, at the start of the pandemic, do you guys remember? I think her name was Jennifer. She became, like, Zoom Jennifer. And she brought her laptop into the bathroom with her. And she thought that she had disabled the camera and the microphone. And she was trying to stay on the work call while she peed. And she wound up peeing on the toilet in front of all of her coworkers. I do remember.

I will forgive someone like a moment where like, cause that's just, there's nothing intentional to me about that. Like everybody pees and you know, Jan, if you scooted by with your side boob out, like I wouldn't hold it against you. Okay. But this guy is, is,

doing this while he's on a work call. There is a level of decision-making that went on here that I just like, it's creepy and gross. It's like everyone's conversation- - A level of decision-making. - A level of decision-making. - It's bizarre. And like everyone with this week, there were a bunch of people who like came to his defense and like, that's how the world works. Everyone will view things differently. But they were like, this is masturbation shaming. I was like, it is not. It is work masturbation shaming, which is very, very different. - Totally.

But I mean, I think what we all have to kind of imagine is if you were in a boardroom,

You know, and you know, with their stuff going on underneath the table, I think, I think the police would be involved. I think, I think the police would be called in to go, there's a man that is completely exposing himself and, and being a public mischief at the very least, but because it's online. So this is, this is where you're just like, how is it not kind of,

in the realm of being something illegal if it's online. I don't know how they go around that, right? His poor co-workers, because, like, Jade, imagine you're at, like, a table read for the Jan show, and you've got all of your cast there and the writers, and you just look over, and there's somebody in the corner just, like, being the creepy person on the bus. Like, they're the local flasher at this point. I don't know what... I don't know. So, professionally, I don't think you can come back. Well...

Good morning, everybody. Welcome to the Jan Arden podcast. We thought we'd just come out of the gate swinging. Swinging? No, no. No, not swinging. Swingers. We're swingers. Yeah, there's a lot going on in the world. But anyways, Rudy Giuliani.

He's the other person that is pantless in today's news. Oh, man. Pants news. I never thought we'd have a week where we had two of these stories, but we did. And he was caught by Borat. And so I don't know if everyone's aware of it, but this week Borat 2 was released. And he's, you know, Sacha Baron Cohen is a master storyteller.

of getting people in these outrageous moments. He is committed to outrageous satire during this film when they shot it. He actually had to stay in character for five days because he was living with conspiracy theorists in the southern United States who didn't know about the character of Borat, thought he was a real person and he actually lived with them for five days as Borat. So like this is commitment.

And in the scene that Rudy Giuliani is taking part in, Borat and the 24-year-old actress who plays his 15-year-old daughter in the film are trying to get an interview with him. She's posing as a very pretty journalist, and she interviews him saying, I'm a huge fan, and I would like to talk to you about Trump's response to the coronavirus. He grants her an interview. Afterwards, she says, why don't you come back for a drink in my hotel room?

Rudy Giuliani agrees to go back for a drink. His version of the story is that he was going to take his microphone equipment off. So he lay down on the bed in the hotel room and was trying to unfix his shirt. After he removed the microphone equipment, he had to re-tuck his shirt in. So he had to lie down on a bed, undo his pants, and re-tuck his shirt in.

So the photo of this is brutal. It makes the rounds. That's how I do it. I always have to just lie down to tuck my shirt in. You know, people, keep your lies simple because when you add details to them,

They get really corny and people won't believe you. So carry on, Caitlin. Well, so Borat busts in on the scene and says, he cracks this joke and he says, no, she's 15. She's too old for you. And then Rudy Giuliani realizes that this has gone sideways and she is not in actuality a young reporter who's interested in having a hotel drink with him.

and so this goes sideways he says it's a total fabrication I'm just tucking my shirt in every single person who's reviewed the film and seen it says that the actual play-by-play of this is much more embarrassing for him than that and ultimately the reason why anyone cares about this is because he's the president of the United States personal lawyer so you're like if you can get this gotcha moment of this caliber from a comedian what what

Like, how safe is that for the president? Yeah. How safe is the, is the country internationally? Like, how are you doing on any kind of foreign diplomacy or any of that? Well, you know, at least we can sit back and have a laugh. I am very,

The COVID times have made such strange days appear before us. You're here listening to the Jan Arden podcast. I'm with Adam Karsh and, of course, Caitlin Green, who has way more to talk about today. We'll be right back. No, my ding-a-ling.

Welcome back, Jan Arden Podcast, here with pants. All of us have pants on. All of us are acting responsibly. Listen, getting back to what you said about, you know, you're with a journalist. So Rudy Giuliani was with this supposed journalist being invited back to the hotel for a drink, a casual drink. Listen, we've had a great conversation for an hour about politics and

All the important things that are happening in the world and in our country. Let's go have a scotch and soda.

And then, you know, the shirt tucking crap that ensues. I have done, and I am not kidding you when I say this, probably close to 20,000 interviews in the last 30 years. Yeah, I believe that. I'm exaggerating slightly. But I still believe it's like. No, it is. It's thousands and thousands and thousands of interviews. And I know that because sometimes I do 30 a day. Yeah. When I'm on a press junket. So anyone that's done press junkets knows how these things can add up.

Like I've been with you for at least, I've been around you for at least 10 and I'm like quite literally never with you in person. Yeah. I just go from one thing to the other, to the other. So I'm telling you right now, even if I meet a journalist in the lobby of a hotel, I'm always so excited.

I would never in a million years accept an invitation from a journalist, male or female, not that that makes any difference to go to a hotel room room and have a drink, not a hotel lobby. So let's just keep that. So I just, I'd never would. And if I did, I'd be, if someone even asked me and I've never been asked, so maybe, maybe I'm a loser, but I don't think so.

When you set yourself up for that kind of stuff, I'm sorry, the onus is totally on you being a stand-up person.

Yeah, he should have declined. He should have declined. And you're the lawyer for the president at a in a year, you know, in an election year. Now, I'm not exactly sure when they shot this, but it would stand to reason that if anyone on the face of the planet should be more skeptical about a journalist's intentions to talk to them off the record or to get time alone with them, even if it was a real journalist, then it wasn't some plant from Borat.

which is 10 times more embarrassing, obviously. But like, you'd think that you would want to be very, very skeptical and very guarded. And that was the thing. Like he, he let his guard down because he obviously wanted the opportunity to spend time alone with her in a hotel. Who would be around Rudy at this time, Caitlin? Like who,

Who would he be there with? Would he not at the very least have an assistant or a driver off in the corner? I mean, it's Rudy Giuliani. Would he not have any kind of a security detail? So I'm trying to suspend my disbelief here.

But was it the man just alone? Would he not have anyone in the ears going, sir, it's really not a good idea. So this is where I get so lost in these kinds of stories. Like I haven't yet watched the scene and I definitely will. Cause I want to see. Okay.

Yeah, I want to see so much of what happens in this movie, even though we'll talk in a minute about why this kind of thing makes so many people uncomfortable, Jan, you being one of them. But I really think that sometimes you have those personality types, and political figure or not, where you can't get through to them. And the people who are closest to them that they've surrounded themselves with are like, yes, people, exclusively. And so they never stop them. They'll all be like, oh yeah, she's into you, Rudy, or who knows what somebody closest to him would have said.

Oh, yeah. She's into you, Rudy. Can you just imagine him saying that into the lapel of his coat? Oh, yeah. Rudy, she's into you. Go for it. And now use the shirt-tucking thing if it all goes to hell. Exactly.

And so you never know, right? Like if he didn't have a, like, cause maybe he'd kick somebody who was going to give him the straight goods out of his inner circle because after a while they'd rub them the wrong way. I didn't mean that as it came out, but. Why do we take such glee or find such glee in people failing? Yeah.

Like in, yeah, I think, you know, everybody always laughs when you see a poor woman standing on a street corner on a windy day and her skirts blowing up one side, she gets that down, it blows up the other side. I mean, she's got pantyhose on, which is never a great look, right? Or someone that gets, that falls off a ladder or those video shows that really show nothing but, you know, people having their,

wieners and beans like knocked on a, like a stick or a kid that the kid is throwing a ball and he hits his dad in the crotch. Like we all take such glee in physical and emotional pain and embarrassment. And I'm just wondering why, like, yeah, the whole thing, like what you were saying, Caitlin, I'm, I watched the first Borat movie and I just feel like,

It's like The Office 2.0. It's like watching The Office with Ricky Gervais back in the day when it first came out, and you're just head and hands. It's so cringeworthy. That's the word for this, right? Cringeworthy. Who Borat is such a brilliant...

I think he's a brilliant humanitarian. I like you. I think he shines a light on misogyny, on homophobia, xenophobia, all the phobias. I think he makes people...

He shows them in a very clear light of who they actually are. And he does it in a way that, like you said, it's absolutely brilliant. And he's been accused of all kinds of things, you know, of being kind of pointing his nose up at marginalized people or people that aren't particularly intelligent. And I would defend him to the ends of it because even seeing stuff that he's done over the years,

He's so freaking smart that he just shows people to be the racist that they are, the cruel people that they are. And maybe that's why it's fun, but like I said, very cringeworthy to watch. It's cringe comedy all the way through, and it's just such outrageous satire. And I totally understand that half of the people who honestly can't watch it because it makes them too uncomfortable. I'm one!

Yeah, I get it. And like sense of humor is so subjective. You know, I have a very dark sense of humor. So I get when people don't necessarily find what I find funny, funny. I think humor is incredibly subjective and I find it hard personally to be offended by, by humor. That's just the way like my brain works, but it's totally personal. But he is such a great conduit for so many important issues. Yes. And he's,

It's the combination of he's dealing with important issues in the cheapest laugh way, in the dumbest possible way when it comes to like jokes about his cram or his like crotch, you know, stupid sex jokes. And it's like, it's the combination of the high and low that I think works so well for him. And also just the commitment to these characters and the inventiveness of coming up with all of them, like Bora, Bruno, Ali G, like the list goes on. He's just got so many amazing characters that he's created. He's,

just he's a brilliant comedian he really is um you are listening to the jan arden podcast we've got lots left to talk about don't go away

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Just in closing, to just give us some closure on this issue of doing things in front of cameras, be it at a Zoom meeting, you know, holding your Johnson or, sorry, I don't know how to get rid of this. Just like that, I think. Is that how you do it? There we go. There's people trying to get a hold of me. Okay.

I'm very popular. That was Rudy Giuliani trying to phone me to put a, to put a kibosh on this podcast. So, and then further that, what we were talking about in the break is Rudy, they've had cameramen all day around them, right? Yeah. Yeah. So he's Rudy's there on his interview. Then they go to the hotel room. There's still cameras there. So this is where it gets cloudy for me. Anyway, Caitlin was saying, um,

To me, they just somehow compartmentalize it and they don't think about the optics of the cameraman's still there. You're laying on a bed. You're tucking your shoes. The cameraman is still there. So anyway, we'll move on. I don't know why people forget about being filmed or...

I have to say, think about reality TV shows. And again, like a person who agrees to go on a reality TV show, I do think is like a different brand of human than your average person. They want to be famous. Definitely. But they agree to go on it. They agree to have their entire life inclusive of probably some sexy moments, probably some moments of just being in the bathroom. Like they agree to have this all filmed. And I have a friend who was a camera operator for years and years and years. And he worked on a reality show called

I don't want to say which one, but let's just say it takes place in a house. And so as a part of him filming, he would have to be in the walls of this quote unquote house to get around and see different things happening. And these people know that they're being filmed at all times and the stuff they still try to get away with.

It's quite laughable because like you'll just hear about, you know, someone trying to get away with a little something, something under a blanket. And they know that they're on a reality show where their whole life is being filmed and they still are trying to do it. So some people just can't help themselves. Maybe they're just not that bright. I don't know. I, anyway, moving on, just be careful out there, folks, just be careful and just make sure when you're on your meetings that

that you have clothes on. Thank you. Thank you for wearing a shirt, Adam. We really appreciate it. Thank you, Adam. You're very welcome. I'm holding my hands up here for the rest of the show so that you can see them at all times. No, I know. We are decent, kind people and we would never do that to each other. No. That we know of.

That's big news this week. And I know it's horrible to talk about yourself in any way. And yes, I'm selling something, but not really because I'm just super excited for our entire team. The Jan show, which is well into its second season, got picked up by Hulu in the States. I saw this. Yeah. So we will start streaming early 2021. Seasons one and two will start playing down there.

And it's great for myriad reasons, but it's great for Canadian television. It's great for comedy. It's great for Canada exporting. It's really great programming all over the world. Yeah.

I mean, Schitt's Creek, I can't say enough good things about Schitt's Creek. Nine Emmy Awards a few weeks ago. Dan Levy and the entire cast walked away with everything. I thought we were being punked in the Emmys. I thought the Emmys was going to stop and say, just kidding, because the first seven awards all went to Schitt's Creek. But anyway, yeah, it's exciting to think that we'll have a whole new group of people kind of watching Schitt's

And seeing Calgary, like it's weird. Yeah, that's what I was going to say. Because, you know, like your show isn't set in some like anonymous city or it's not set in a big, like, you know, Toronto or a big US city even, right? Which could happen. And I think it's just cool that they'll be learning about Calgary and seeing kind of like that part of Canada because so much...

of the US, I feel like they just imagine us being all the exact same thing. Like we're all like living in igloos and we're obsessed with hockey and we just have a Tim Hortons cup glued to our hands, but they forget how regional Canada is and how different the West is from, you know, from the East and Ontario, Quebec, whatever. It's just so cool. I'm so excited to see what the response will be from Americans.

Yeah, it's interesting too. And I'm really proud of the cast. I think our storyline of having sort of the matriarch of this family, of the Jan Show family, having Alzheimer's dementia and having a laugh about it.

I mean, imagine that they figure there's 800,000 people going through that in Canada with having someone in their family with memory loss. So that grows exponentially in the United States. I mean, you're dealing with millions and millions of people that are dealing with someone with memory loss. And I'm always wondering how impactful that will be because we always try and be very factual about

how you deal with getting your grandparent or your mom or your husband tested. And we've really done research, the writers certainly have dug into how they do those cognitive tests. So I don't know, I'm proud of the show in many, many ways, the sexuality issues in the show, that it's so fluid and that we don't really address that in any kind of a big announcement way. Here she is, she's

She's got boyfriends and girlfriends and let's make an announcement. And I find that to be truly a Canadian thing too. Not that we are without problems here, not that we are without homophobia and still fighting for equality in the transgender community, all of that. We have our own issues. I'm not making light of that. But just that once again, there's a Canadian show that's just kind of

crossing all the T's and dotting the I's and making people think. So anyway, I'm really looking forward to it. And I like that also too, like with Schitt's Creek, I feel like all age groups are kind of represented on the show as well, which is like a new thing that has been super successful on television shows. But it's like, you have obviously much younger cast members all the way up to, you know, the woman who plays your mother. And so I think that that's great because, you know, such a wider audience, such a broader demo that you can hit by including a different age group for, for every single person. Yeah.

It's great. I love that. I love the also too. It's such a good time, I think, to be releasing any kind of content on a streaming service because people are sitting at home. They'll be sitting at home for the foreseeable future. And you're just watching everything. You're running out of content.

Yeah. What did you guys watch when you were kids, Adam? I mean, television has changed so much. I just remember Carol Burnett, All in the Family, Mary Tyler Moore. But what were you watching? You were younger than me. I'd say a lot of cartoons, like all the Bugs Bunny Roadrunner cartoons. I watched the Flintstones and the Jetsons, all that stuff.

But I remember, like, as I got a little bit older, like, you know, in terms of, like, comedies, I watched Three's Company. I was obsessed with that show. I mean, think about the premise with Three's Company. They didn't go anywhere. You know, comedies now are so cutting edge. They're all location. They're moving around. But those sitcoms had live audiences. Yes.

They had three cameras that were, they were learning their lines and almost doing it in a theatrical way. And that was how most television was done for 30 years. I mean, the Dick Van Dyke show, I'm really dating myself now, but all about early television, the spinoffs, the Golden Girls. I love the Golden Girls. Love the Golden Girls. Thank you for being a friend.

But when, you know, I mean, I've been watching them too. I started back on the very first season because my road manager, Chris, is obsessed with the Golden Girls. I mean, he's got their candle set. He's got their t-shirts, their pajamas, like the Golden Girls lunch kits. Like whatever comes out Golden Girls, he buys it. But I was very curious, I think, because of doing the Jan show. I thought, I'm going to start watching that. Yeah.

everything takes place in a room. Right. And I just thought about the challenges that a director must have had to keep it fresh, but I'll tell you what, it was in the writing. There are so many singers and I mean, there is a joke every second line.

Totally. It's like click, click, boom, click, click, boom. There's no long, arduous setups for a joke. It is everything they said was hilarious. Totally. Did you watch and this is not a sitcom. I used to watch The Love Boat. I disagree, Adam. I think it was a I think it was a comedy. Wasn't it like a dramedy? Maybe it's a dramedy. Maybe.

No, it was like, it was light. It was pretty light. Well, all of that stuff was light. I mean, Charlie's Angels, but still it's television has come such a long way. And like Caitlin was saying, because we've all been home, the content that everybody has sped through. I know everyone's always looking like, what have I not seen yet? I signed up for Acorn television. I signed up for Brit box.

I signed up for Disney. I signed up for Apple TV. So I've got to start canceling this stuff because I'm doing like $60 a month in, you know, fees for watching stuff. You're listening to the Jan Arden podcast. We're going to be right back. Okay, Adam, I heard you singing a little bit. Like I said, where the kisses are hers and hers and his three's company too.

Oh, Caitlin's gonna jump in. Listen, do I have competition here? No, I'm a falto. You don't want me to jump in. Well, it's amazing how many songs we remember. Like, La Boat, soon we'll be making another one. I love that. Something adventure for everyone. I don't even know, but I think we know more of these songs than we want to admit.

Dukes of Hazzard I watched too. I missed all these shows. I missed them all. Caitlin, you're so young. You're like 21 years old. No, you're not. What were you watching? I watched my version of those shows that probably have been Fresh Prince of Bel-Air and loved it. And then all the Full House and all those types of shows that were around at that time. Those were two big ones, I think, growing up.

for sure. I was weird though. I love, I really liked was I was a comedy nerd kind of quickly. Like I loved Brit comms, British sitcoms when I was a kid. Really? Yeah. My parents loved them. And I think that was because my grandparents on my mom's side were very British and they're like sensibilities and,

And on Saturday nights, PBS or Channel 18 here in Toronto would always air these back-to-back block of British sitcoms. And it was things like Are You Being Served and Keeping Up Appearances and Chef and whatever, One Foot in the Grave, even Fawlty Towers. And I just loved it. I love British comedy. I love Monty Python. I listened to all their comedy albums.

And I really love late night TV. Like I loved, I grew up being obsessed with Conan O'Brien and David Letterman. It lived for SNL. I wasn't supposed to watch it when I was younger, but I'd watch every single episode of SNL. I just thought I just loved laughs. Like I love, I've always just thought comedy. You can't tell me that that didn't inform your mind as you went forward. You were an only child. Yeah. And I don't, I don't care what anyone says about,

There's a level of intelligence in comedy that really is palpable, like a well-written joke. I think funny people, like really funny people are incredibly smart.

And they play around a lot, right? And there's something for everyone. I love silly comedy, but I love a dark joke. And I like physical comedy, but I think observational comedy is just as good. And I love Seinfeld. I just think there's nothing better than a big laugh. And so that was kind of all I ever really thought about was what was funny. Oh, I mean...

previous to what you were watching, it was a little earlier on, but the Carol Burnett show really was something that I look forward to every week. It was hilarious, Adam. And I think she was such a, she was like a light in the dark for so many young women, especially, I think, coming up through comedy. Because in the 60s and 70s, I didn't see a lot of female actors.

Not that I was, I mean, I was very, very young. I was, you know, eight, nine years old in the late sixties, but Carol Burnett, every female comedian that talks about their influences talks about Carol Burnett kind of kicking the doors wide open and doing her stuff. But I mean, you think about comedy now, as opposed to what it used to be, there is some dark frigging comedy out there. Like so many comedians have found themselves in trouble because

with their humor. It's like you can only go so far and then you push it and all of a sudden the entire world is canceling you. Like, I don't know if, if Louis CK will ever really come back to where he was. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe he deserves a second chance. Yeah. He has to be one of my, and like, you know, the pre-cancellation or whatever. I've seen him in, in, in like, I've seen his live shows and,

Loved him. Just a genius comedy writer. And he goes really dark. And he always has. And he says things just to shock people. And that's kind of what he's always done. He goes to these really, really strange places in his mind. And to me, they're hilarious. So how did he get so far in?

without those checks and balances, because I feel like it just happened overnight. And I know it was the, once again, the, you know, fooling around with himself in front of other people. We're trying not to say anything too horrible on the radio every second word. But yeah, we're trying to keep it clean here. But how did the humor, because I watched his routines. I didn't see him live, but I saw a lot of his specials.

over the years. And I would even like, I don't need, I felt like, why am I watching this? Because as a woman, I just feel completely berated and everyone's kind of uncomfortably laughing. So why did it get that far down the pike? Do you think?

Yeah, I mean, it reminds me a little bit like, I mean, they're very different comedians, but like Bill Burr, you know, he says stuff that can be incredibly offensive. But I, I laugh at him, I find him very funny at times. And I don't view comedy the same way as I do

I view a conversation between two people. I don't view it as a conversation I'm overhearing at work. This is certainly not a politician. This is a comedian. And what they're trying to do is get you to laugh however they can, if that means freak you out or make you outraged. Or, you know, I think back on like Glyphosate

great, great comedians over the years. Like, you know, Richard Pryor, he's not saying safe stuff. Like he was not saying safe stuff. And so the notion of like making comedy super safe in terms of your act now personal life is different, but I don't like a safe act for comedy. That's just me. I agree with you. Yeah. Did you watch either of you guys watch the first Hannah Gadsby special on Netflix? I did. Yeah. Yeah. Um,

Well, she's an Australian comedian. And she openly admits right from the top of her show that, you know, this isn't what you think it's going to be.

So there are absolutely jokes and uncomfortable laughing that cringe worthy humor that I really feel like has been a real benchmark to 2019, 2020, especially going now. I think humor has gotten quite dark, but she, she,

builds her show around an assault that happened to her. And she builds the audience up. You know, we're laughing with her. And then with the swift dropping of this hammer, she takes us into this world where you're like, am I supposed to be laughing at her?

what am I supposed to be doing? And I have found this kind of humor to be getting back to the Sacha Cohen Baron stuff is educational comedy, comedy that really does enlighten and point a light at parts of society that are flawed, really flawed. Yeah. Cause we're laughing at uncomfortable things, but if you haven't seen,

The Hannah Gadsby stuff. I highly recommend it. You will laugh and you'll also learn a thing or two about being a human being. And I love that kind of humor.

Yeah. And I mean, the other thing too with comedy is it's, you know, you don't have to watch it, right? Like that's the other part of it. No one told me that, Caitlin. But I always find it funny. Like, you know, Ricky Gervais has this great, and maybe we can even like drop a clip of this in, but he has this great bit in his act about people who follow him on social media. And I think this is from Humanity. But again, that's what the world is like. People take everything personally. I think the

world revolves around them, right? Particularly on Twitter, right? I don't know. I'm not tweeting anyone. I'm just tweeting, okay? I don't know who's following me. I've got 12 million followers. I don't know who's following me. They can be following me without me knowing, right? Choose to read my tweet and then take that personally, right?

That's like going into a town square, seeing a big notice board, and there's a notice, guitar lessons, and you go, but I don't want guitar lessons. If you don't like something that's part of the world of entertainment, you don't need to comment on it. You just keep it moving. The way you change that is by not paying attention to it. If I don't find someone funny and I think they're offensive, I'm never going to watch them. Exactly. I mean, my Twitter feed, I treat very much the same way. All my socials.

I have people, I swear a lot. I say the F word a lot on Twitter. I go after people a lot. I tell people to F off on Twitter. I just say, Hey Liz, F you. And I'll say it. I saw that this week. Yeah.

I have no qualms about it. And you know what? If you don't want to follow me, don't follow me. This is my feed. And I also will block immediately. Some people disagree with me. They're like, oh, they're getting attention, the attention that they want. I block immediately, like first sign of trouble. And I will block people that go after other people. I've had people come up to me in the street, and I've talked about this on this show before,

I'll be in line, I'll line up at a grocery store and someone will say, you know, they'll say, hi, you, you blocked my sister-in-law on, on Twitter. And I'm like, well, she must've done something, but she doesn't know what she did. Like I've had people say, can you, can you refollow me? I'm like, no, this, this, if you're done now, like go terrorize somebody else. And that's exactly that. I don't,

I'm not following you. Yes. I'm not following you home. You're following me home. So if you don't like what I find that so counterintuitive to be coming after somebody's Twitter and being offended by it, like, well, you looked it up and looked at it and are reading it. I've never understood that.

This is not a public figure. This is not a politician. This is not an elected official who controls your tax dollars, who is going to change parts of society. These are entertainers. And if you don't find them entertaining and you don't like what they're offering, that's the beauty of being able to

go and watch and laugh at and engage with somebody who closer reflects your views. And that's fine. But we've entered this weird world where everyone thinks you should care if they like you, or should care what they think about you or care what you think they think about your art that you're putting out. Like, believe me, nobody cares. And certainly no one's opinions ever been changed by social media, like people writing to celebrities saying they don't like something they've done. It's just like yelling into an abyss. And I just think to myself,

What a waste of your energy. And I just imagine that they're not a very happy person in their real life and they must not feel very seen and heard in their real life to be like, think about yelling at Chrissy Teigen on Twitter. If you are yelling at Chrissy Teigen on Twitter, you need to reevaluate every single thing you do with your energy because it's just not worth it for you. Why are you doing that? Well, there was a day when...

I think people could write letters to corporations or television networks or to, you know, some kind of product that Canadian Tire had out and they would get leverage. Like these people would read these things and they'd be like, pull it from the shelf, take those gumballs off. You know, people got so reactionary and that doesn't work that way anymore.

You know, there are people that sit and they just, if you go into their Twitter feeds, that's what they're doing all day long is they're berating celebrities. They're berating people. They're, they're trying to cause a disruption. Anyway, we're not trying to cause a disruption. We're really glad you're here. This has been like a fast show today. We talked about a lot of zany stuff.

Thanks for coming with us, folks. As always, hit subscribe on your favorite streaming outlets. That means that you'll be reminded about our podcast every week. You won't have to go looking for us. We appreciate you so much. Write us, let us know if you ever want to talk about anything or want us to talk about anything. We appreciate it a lot. Adam Karsh, Caitlin Green, Jan Arden Podcast. Toodaloo!

This podcast is distributed by the Women in Media Podcast Network. Find out more at womeninmedia.network.